Gpruitt54 Posted October 23, 2016 Posted October 23, 2016 I just downloaded six missions for DCS. After opening them, I discovered that none of them contained a text file describing which version of DCS the missions were for and, more importantly, how to install the missions. To all you building missions and the like, please remember that not everyone knows how to install mods and add-ons. Please include a least a base level of instruction in a .txt file. There are new people coming to DCS every day.
Gliptal Posted October 23, 2016 Posted October 23, 2016 Well, all missions are installed the same way, so I see no need to include instructions for every single one. You can drop them wherever you want in your filesystem. The best place is DCS's Documents folder, where all the settings are stored. 1
Yurgon Posted October 24, 2016 Posted October 24, 2016 Well, all missions are installed the same way, so I see no need to include instructions for every single one. Agreed; I think that's a very basic topic and should not be included in each and every single mission. I'm not 100% sure, but this might be covered in one of the DCS manuals. Also, missions themselves are usually a single file with .miz extension. Adding a readme.txt would require to put the mission into an archive file, like .zip, or add the readme as a secondary download. That's not really practical and would probably cause more confusion to newcomers rather than explain things to them (and in addition, .miz files are actually already .zip files, and zipping a zip archive makes even less sense :music_whistling:). On the other hand, I think Gpruitt54 does have a point regarding the required version. For people active in the community, the link between 1.5 and 2.0 and Georgia/Caucasus and Nevada/NTTR is everyday business. For newcomers, I imagine it's much less obvious, and so a hint regarding the intended version would be a useful addition to mission descriptions. I think this is something that should be included in the mission's description, regardless whether it's in a forum post or in the user files. If people don't read the instructions there, they're not likely to read instructions anyway. :smartass:
Gpruitt54 Posted October 25, 2016 Author Posted October 25, 2016 (edited) Well, all missions are installed the same way, so I see no need to include instructions for every single one. You can drop them wherever you want in your filesystem. The best place is DCS's Documents folder, where all the settings are stored. Sure, they are all installed the same way. But, new users like me are completely unaware as to what that is, how it is done. What if you created 4 mods and you took a moment to include the install instructions on 2 of the mods. What happens if I download the mods without the instructions. What good are the files if how they are used is not included? There are new people coming to DCS games every day. What is old hat for you, is completely new for many others. Have some consideration for all us new users of DCS simulations. Is that too much to ask? Edited October 25, 2016 by Gpruitt54
Gliptal Posted October 25, 2016 Posted October 25, 2016 (edited) Google "dcs install mission" and literally the first result is a thread with a bunch of instructions. Unfortunately DCS and simming in general requires quite a lot of personal searching for things. Besides, most of the time missions have a relative forum thread, so you can ask there if you're having problems. Edited October 25, 2016 by Gliptal
Gpruitt54 Posted October 25, 2016 Author Posted October 25, 2016 (edited) Agreed; I think that's a very basic topic and should not be included in each and every single mission. I'm not 100% sure, but this might be covered in one of the DCS manuals. Also, missions themselves are usually a single file with .miz extension. Adding a readme.txt would require to put the mission into an archive file, like .zip, or add the readme as a secondary download. That's not really practical and would probably cause more confusion to newcomers rather than explain things to them (and in addition, .miz files are actually already .zip files, and zipping a zip archive makes even less sense :music_whistling:). On the other hand, I think Gpruitt54 does have a point regarding the required version. For people active in the community, the link between 1.5 and 2.0 and Georgia/Caucasus and Nevada/NTTR is everyday business. For newcomers, I imagine it's much less obvious, and so a hint regarding the intended version would be a useful addition to mission descriptions. I think this is something that should be included in the mission's description, regardless whether it's in a forum post or in the user files. If people don't read the instructions there, they're not likely to read instructions anyway. :smartass: Two lines of text containing the path for where the files are to be copied can mean the difference of a pleasant experience and a total pain in the ass. One can never assume that everyone downloading your work are at the same level of understanding as to how the file structure is done and/or where to copy mod files. There are new people coming to DCS games every day. How is a new person supposed to know how what you know all so well. Have some consideration for all us new users of DCS simulations. Is that too much to ask? By the way. Where does the .miz mission file belong? Do all .miz files belong in one single folder? Does the destination of the file depend on what the file contains? How does one know? I still have no idea because on one had provided the details. Edited October 25, 2016 by Gpruitt54
Gpruitt54 Posted October 25, 2016 Author Posted October 25, 2016 (edited) There are times when I am unable to touch DCS for a very long time. Sometimes months and at another point at least a year. When I came back, I had to get completely re-antiquated with nearly everything, specifically where things belong. Recently, I downloaded 4 mission files for the Gazelle, and I still don't know where the mission files are to copied. One must always consider new users. New people are discovering this amazing simulation every day. Not everyone knows what you guys know. Consider those people. How much work is it to save a simple two like text file with the version of DCS the mod is compatible with, and where the file belong. Simply copy and paste the basic instructions into your zip files. Is that too much to ask? Edited October 25, 2016 by Gpruitt54
Buzzles Posted October 25, 2016 Posted October 25, 2016 I don't understand why you're having a problem. DCS's mission selector is simply a file explorer. Like the one in Windows, which I'm going to assume you're at least half way familiar with. You can literally put missions *anywhere* on your PC in a place of your choosing and select them from inside DCS. The version note is a good idea though, although one ED should probably implement into the .miz file directly. 1 Fancy trying Star Citizen? Click here!
Gpruitt54 Posted October 26, 2016 Author Posted October 26, 2016 Google "dcs install mission" and literally the first result is a thread with a bunch of instructions. Unfortunately DCS and simming in general requires quite a lot of personal searching for things. Besides, most of the time missions have a relative forum thread, so you can ask there if you're having problems. Long before DCS there was something called FSX and Falcon F16. For racing sims fans there were a number of titles. There were even Submarine sims. All of these titles allowed mods to be added them. I played these titles for years. The one thing the developers of the mods did was to have enough consideration to include simple instructions on how to install the mods. Those developers did not ask or expect users to Google in order to cobble enough information to install the mods. A couple of short lines of text is not too much to ask of someone creating a mod or anything else for that matter. There are no excuses for lack of consideration for the users of any product. Be it payware or freeware.
Gpruitt54 Posted October 26, 2016 Author Posted October 26, 2016 I don't understand why you're having a problem. DCS's mission selector is simply a file explorer. Like the one in Windows, which I'm going to assume you're at least half way familiar with. You can literally put missions *anywhere* on your PC in a place of your choosing and select them from inside DCS. The version note is a good idea though, although one ED should probably implement into the .miz file directly. Why did you not include the version note before now? Did you assume something you should not have assumed? So then, why are simple install instructions beyond consideration? The point here is not about me. You can be assured that completely new users are and will be interacting with your mod(s). New users are learning about, and attempting to apply mods to DCS daily. Why not make that entry point easy and user friendly. One or two lines of instructive and/or information can't be that much of a burden.
Yurgon Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 Gpruitt54, give us a break. We get your point. You're mixing up two things, though. You can place mission files anywhere you want. That was explained to you several times by several people by now. Just make sure you know where they are and then you can open them from the file explorer in DCS's "Mission" menu. If you don't know how to do that, people around here are practically guaranteed to help you - just ask. Mods, that's another thing. Mission are not mods (as in: modifications). Mods do require installation instructions. Many mods state "JSGME ready" and that's fine, because if you google JSGME you'll quickly find out what that is, how it works and how it helps you install mods. Mods that are not JSGME ready should definitely include the installation path, or some installation instructions. In my experience, 99% of mods do that. I don't get your point. Do you need help playing downloaded missions? Then just ask for help. I just don't think it's fair to tell the entire forum that we're all doing it wrong because you have a problem. Flight sims in general and DCS specifically are a tough nut to crack, and you really need to invest time and effort. Once again, people are willing to help, but you're not asking for help, you're telling us to change our behavior to suit your demands. Probably not going to happen, and the continuous cycle of repetitions isn't going to convince me of your point either.
Gpruitt54 Posted October 26, 2016 Author Posted October 26, 2016 Gpruitt54, give us a break. We get your point. You're mixing up two things, though. You can place mission files anywhere you want. That was explained to you several times by several people by now. Just make sure you know where they are and then you can open them from the file explorer in DCS's "Mission" menu. If you don't know how to do that, people around here are practically guaranteed to help you - just ask. Mods, that's another thing. Mission are not mods (as in: modifications). Mods do require installation instructions. Many mods state "JSGME ready" and that's fine, because if you google JSGME you'll quickly find out what that is, how it works and how it helps you install mods. Mods that are not JSGME ready should definitely include the installation path, or some installation instructions. In my experience, 99% of mods do that. I don't get your point. Do you need help playing downloaded missions? Then just ask for help. I just don't think it's fair to tell the entire forum that we're all doing it wrong because you have a problem. Flight sims in general and DCS specifically are a tough nut to crack, and you really need to invest time and effort. Once again, people are willing to help, but you're not asking for help, you're telling us to change our behavior to suit your demands. Probably not going to happen, and the continuous cycle of repetitions isn't going to convince me of your point either. Was I on my soap box? Yeah, maybe a lot. Am I trying to change some behaviors or opinions? Yeah, maybe a little. Like the thing about putting the version compatibly in a file with the mission/mod. If it can make usability easier, then why not. In my opinion, as soon as someone says "everybody knows how to do..." It is time to start pushing against that notion. Because "everybody" does not know how to do... So, thanks for bring me down from the soap box. Now, to my specific issue. I downloaded some missions for the DCS Gazelle from the user files section of the DCS website. Because there are no instructions on where to place the files, I was left guessing, placing the files within various file locations but nothing seemed to work. The missions were never visible in the missions list, or the quick mission list, or the instant action list, or the training missions list, etc. etc. These are not missions I planned to edit, so accessing them from the mission editor was not a consideration. I searched Google, and this forum, and still had no answers. That's when I jumped the shark.
Yurgon Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 I searched Google, and this forum, and still had no answers. So, does it mean you still weren't able to fly any of these missions you downloaded? The "Mission" menu in DCS is basically a file explorer, much like Windows Explorer. And, just like your "Favorites" or "Downloads" or "Desktop" in Windows Explorer, there are some preset directories. The most important one, "My missions", points to your DCS "Saved Games" folder, which is typically: C:\Users\{Your Windows Username}\Saved Games\DCS (DCS 1.5, Caucasus map) or C:\Users\{Your Windows Username}\Saved Games\DCS.openalpha (DCS 2.0 Open Alpha, Nevada Map). Just place your downloaded missions into the appropriate folder, then in DCS "Mission" navigate to "My Missions" and you should find them there.
Gpruitt54 Posted October 26, 2016 Author Posted October 26, 2016 So, does it mean you still weren't able to fly any of these missions you downloaded? The "Mission" menu in DCS is basically a file explorer, much like Windows Explorer. And, just like your "Favorites" or "Downloads" or "Desktop" in Windows Explorer, there are some preset directories. The most important one, "My missions", points to your DCS "Saved Games" folder, which is typically: C:\Users\{Your Windows Username}\Saved Games\DCS (DCS 1.5, Caucasus map) or C:\Users\{Your Windows Username}\Saved Games\DCS.openalpha (DCS 2.0 Open Alpha, Nevada Map). Just place your downloaded missions into the appropriate folder, then in DCS "Mission" navigate to "My Missions" and you should find them there. Correct, I have yet to fly the downloaded missions. However, I will follow what you have provided here. This is what I have been looking for. Thanks so much, and pardon my rants.
Gliptal Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 Again, the same answer can be found after a 30 seconds search either on Google or on the forums.
Gpruitt54 Posted October 26, 2016 Author Posted October 26, 2016 Again, the same answer can be found after a 30 seconds search either on Google or on the forums. I did several a google searches for how to install missions on DCS and I never saw the information you just provided. Thank you for making this extremely useful information available. How easy would it be to include the same information and version compatibility in a zip with the mission file. Why not? Again, thank you so very much.
Yurgon Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 How easy would it be to include the same information and version compatibility in a zip with the mission file. Why not? Like I said, mission files are already (compressed) Zip files. The easiest way to share a mission is to provide a link to the .miz file itself. If I were to set it up like this: MyMission.zip - MyMission.miz - readme.txt I'm sure some people would place MyMission.zip someplace on the hard drive, use the DCS file explorer to navigate there and then complain that DCS doesn't "see" this mission file. So I'd have to explain to them to extract the MyMission.zip contents and read the included instructions. I believe this is going to cause more confusion rather than provide actual assistance, at least in the majority of cases. And I agree with Gliptal, the procedure how to play downloaded missions should be well covered in this forum (once more with this thread now :lol:). In any case, I'm glad it's working for you now. :thumbup:
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