DCS VR... Is it worth it?

[harm_]

It has been a dramatic change for me too. I have had to relearn several things (mainly landings)

 

As a oculus CV1 user, I think it is totally worth it, provided you have the funds (if you have to choose between upgrading your system or the VR set... upgrade your system.)

The WOW factor when flying on VR is ... you have to try it. You will be amazed the first time you roll inverted, look up and pull on the stick going for a split-S heading to a valley at mach 1... Pucker factor 10+.

 

I will add to what was already posted in this thread, that I found several things that you cannot really appreciate if you are not flying VR:

 

- When you're fling VR you really apreciate the different sizes and ergonomics of the cockpits/planes. For instance, the A10 feels huge, and the cockpit is very big and confortable, jump into a 109 and you will find hoy cramped the cockpit is.

Talking about the 109... as a bonus VR ends the neverending discusion about the need of the 109 pilot to lean to one side to aim through the revi ... It is not necesary. You'll see it though your right eye and your brain does the magic.

 

- Refueling, I love it in VR. It is easier for me because it is easier to apreciate the movement (drift, closure rate). Also the KC135 is biGGG

 

- Hovering: your hovers will be more stable on VR (once you train). It is very easy to detect movements as I said before and correct them

 

- Dogfighting IRL is physically extenuating. You wont feel the g-forces but you will have to perform the real movements with your head/body. You will not extenuate yourself, but after an hour of dogfighting you'll feel it in your neck.

There is a big difference using TrackIR and using VR to look arround. With trackIR checking six is almost instantaneous... in VR it will take more time, also your SA will drain faster on VR, because of it.

 

... and more ...

 

 

Be advised:

 

You may get motion sickness and eye fatige (if you fly very long missions).

My recomendation (based on my experience) is: Take Babysteps. Start flying short flights until you get used.( 15 min - 30 min ).

Eventually you'll get used.

 

Beware of the helicopters: it is awesome flying them on VR but I don't recommend them as the first VR experience. When I started using the CV1, I had no problems on fixed wings. From time to time I suffered a bit of vertigo when doing some radical manouvers, but nothing more.

I jumped on the huey ... and, oh boy!, I got very sick after 5 minutes on i t. I think that was due to the following factors:

- Low altitude

- Chin bubble

- Unestable platflorm on hover/transition speed, it moves a lot and your body doesn't feel it so...

 

I had to stop and call-it a day. Nauseam dissapeared after an hour

 

After a couple of weeks, i feel vertigo on the huey from time to time (for instance when I try to land on a rooftop), but nothing dramatic

Edited December 22, 2016 by harm_

[Asset]

where does the resolutionissue come from

 

after reading all the posts about the resolution not being as good I ask myself where this is coming from. The Vive has a combined resolution of 2160x1200, my current single monitor only has full HD at 1920x1080. So how can the image of the Vive be worse despite having better resolution?

 

This question is of particular importance to me, as I am a ground pounder by heart. And statements like "difficult to see ground objects" gets me all worried.

[Goblin]

Asset, imagine your 1920x1080 resolution on a 50-60" screen... And then sit so close that it fills your entire view.

It's not the resolution that's the problem per se, but the size of the screen and the close proximity of it.

[Neldrion]

@Asset

 

When you sit in front of your monitor at your desk it fills your field of view for about 30 degrees horizontally. The VR headset display will fill your field of view for about 100 degrees. Very roughly estimated.

 

The resolution of the VR headsets is 2160 x 1200 but each eye gets its own display with almost the exact same image displayed. So in the end it is about 1000 x 1200 pixels per eye = 1.2 million pixels. That is about half of your monitor with 1920 x 1080 pixels = 2.1 million pixels.

[harm_]

@Asset:

 

I was concerned about it too when I was about to buy it.

The answer is Yes. Ground object (and air!) are definetely more difficult to see on VR, specially against the ground. I've never tried the VIVE, so my experied is based on rift. And you'll need to be closer to clearly see the object to identify it.(Zoom helps a bit)

 

There are some problems with the lens, due to the close proximity to the eye. In Oculus, the sharpest image is on the center of the lens, so you loose some sharpness outside that sweet spot. (for instance, when you move your eyes instead of your head, a natural instinct) You will see dots in the outside, and you'll have to center it in your view (turning your head) to place in the middle of the image, to get the sharpest outline possible.

 

I have a 23" monitor with the same res as yours, and objects are easier to see on it than with oculus.

Try flying on the monitor with the depth of field effect enabled and imagine a bit less resolution, and less Antialiasing and no so perfect clear lines. That will give you a rough idea.

 

The dept of field is present in VR because it is a 3D world, and it is more noticeable than IRL because the image is placed closer to the eye so the depth of field is narrower (If you know a bit of photography you'll understad this better). For instance , if you focus your eyes on the rail of the canopy, the outside will be out of focus. When you focus your eyes on the horizon, the cannopy will be out of focus. On landing, when looking at the runway, you migh get a double vision on the elements of the dashboard. (Try this: put your index finger in front on your nose at arms lengh. And then look ahead into the distance. Then look an your finger That is what I mean.)

This is something, we are not used on 2D screens because everything is always in focus. And it takes time to adapt to it in the sim. And it makes spotting things outside more difficult

 

Also there are some factors that will affect how sharp is the image... mainly MSAA and pixel density mainly (framekillers)

 

I'm also a ground pounder, and you'll get used to it and with practice you'll find ground targets. You'll need to fly a bit closer to them than on a 2D screen, but you'll see them. Slightly blurry, but enough to place the pipper on them and release the avenger cannon at 1.2 miles.

I'm playing The enemy within, and piercing fury campaigns in VR now, and I'm not having problems finding the targets. The throuble starts, when I have to take notes about Grid coordinates... I use the space between the oculus and my nose to see and write in my notepad...

 

My conclusion is: it is not a perfect tech, it has a lot of problems to solve, and it makes indeed things a bit more difficult in the game.

But I can combat with it, maybe I am slower Identifying target and I have to risk myself closing a bit more to ID them. But the experience is awesome.

 

For me balancing things out... the good things outbalances the bad things. It is my opinion.

[Goblin]

And, if I may add, spotting targets IRL isn't easy either... :)

 

Spotting targets on a high res LCD screen is easier than RL, and spotting them in VR is slightly harder than RL. Actually, it depends on the distance, and how the sim treats object sizing with distance. Once you have spotted the target in VR, it's much easier to instictively know where it is in relation to you.

[Asset]

ok, I am sold. I guess that is just the thing with early adoption: you won't get everything and it will have a price tag. I mean, once the F/A-18 is out I won't need the Mk1 eyeballs anyways and can just go with ground radar.

 

Then my question would be: what system no I need for decent performance? Especially for 2.5 with the revamped graphics engine. Do I really need a GTX1080 or will a 1060 do? I7 6700K?

[harm_]

As with everything, the best you can afford. Be aware that no system can run it (at this time) with constant 90fps with high settings so, if you finally buy it before upgrading, test it with your current system

I tried the DK2 version in my old PC (RIP) I7 920 overclocked to 3-8, GTX780, SSD, 16Gb and it was able to run. Not as smooth (also the VR support of DCS was iffy in those days). But it worked. The resolution was worse of course but with similar settings worked fine also. CV1 is more demanding (higher res), but the rendering is more efficient now

 

My Curent Specs are:

 

I7 6700K, 32GB Ram, GTX980ti and SSD disk

Oculus CV1

Win10 64x

 

Currently I run the setting of the attached image (ignore the resolutions, i had to run the game out of VR to take a screenshot)

My pixel density is at 1.7 (i'm experimenting with it) on heavy campaigns I set it to 1.5...

 

If anyone has a setting to share, please, go ahead. Looking forward to try it. I'm doing it the old fashioned way ... trial and error.

With these settings, i have a smooth flying experience 90% of the time. I have some hiccups from time to time, over dense cities, and when there is a lot of movement on the airport (for instance in the new F5 campaign. THe first couple of minutes of the missions, there is some stutter. its beareable, but anoying lol.)

 

They work fine in 1.5 and 2. I'm happy with the current performance / visual quality.

 

The oculus is expensive and I dont know which headset is the best... but oh boy!, i'm happy with it. It also Works on P3D, so when i'm in the mood of flying GA planes or a big stupid A320 I do it VR too.

 

I'm looking forward to the hornet. Carrier ops in VR, sweet!

 

Its funny you mention MkI eyeball. With VR I find myself looking most of the time outside instead of staring the MFDs.

Edited December 22, 2016 by harm_

[BlackLion213]

why are you running your CPU under clocked from the Default speed, Default should be 4.0 Ghz which makes a lot of difference in DCS , also mine is OC to 4.5 GHZ with no issue on default voltage no increase in Voltage at all.

 

Setting from the manufacturer, don't know. How do you overclock? I'm not a computer tinkerer.

 

-Nick

[SnorreSelmer]

Been flying the Mi-8 for two weeks in my new Rift, an it has "ruined" flying with a monitor and TrackIR. For flying in the A-10C it's nice, but it's amazing for helicopters.

 

Don't expect miracles, but my personal opinion is that it's worth it!

 

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[Davee]

Can anyone describe how VR works if you are wearing eye-glasses?

[Torso]

Can anyone describe how VR works if you are wearing eye-glasses?

 

You can wear your glasses while using the devices. Ideally you will have a pair of lean designed glasses because big frames can be an issue with the available open space in the headset. But yeah, you can wear glasses with them. I know of some that get a set of VR specific glasses if their daily style choice is not ideally suited.

 

Also, you can get VR lens inserts that match your prescription as well from these guys.

 

http://vr-lens-lab.com/

[SnorreSelmer]

Can anyone describe how VR works if you are wearing eye-glasses?

Works just fine, as long as your glasses fit inside the set. I have fairly wide glasses, and mine fit juuust. Good thing you can get add-on lenses that can let you use the HMD without glasses.

 

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[SnorreSelmer]

You can wear your glasses while using the devices. Ideally you will have a pair of lean designed glasses because big frames can be an issue with the available open space in the headset. But yeah, you can wear glasses with them. I know of some that get a set of VR specific glasses if their daily style choice is not ideally suited.

 

Also, you can get VR lens inserts that match your prescription as well from these guys.

 

http://vr-lens-lab.com/

Those were the exact lenses I was thinking of!

 

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[NickD]

but we now have a zoom function on the vive that makes it somewhat better.

 

We do? When did this go in? I must have missed it.... must get back to flying rather than just working on modding/modelling.

 

I absolutely love my Vive - VR is basically ideal for this genre. The only (minor) negative is that it will really test your HOTAS binding abilities on planes without full clickability.

[Jabbers_]

As with everything, the best you can afford. Be aware that no system can run it (at this time) with constant 90fps with high settings so, if you finally buy it before upgrading, test it with your current system

I tried the DK2 version in my old PC (RIP) I7 920 overclocked to 3-8, GTX780, SSD, 16Gb and it was able to run. Not as smooth (also the VR support of DCS was iffy in those days). But it worked. The resolution was worse of course but with similar settings worked fine also. CV1 is more demanding (higher res), but the rendering is more efficient now

 

My Curent Specs are:

 

I7 6700K, 32GB Ram, GTX980ti and SSD disk

Oculus CV1

Win10 64x

 

Currently I run the setting of the attached image (ignore the resolutions, i had to run the game out of VR to take a screenshot)

My pixel density is at 1.7 (i'm experimenting with it) on heavy campaigns I set it to 1.5...

 

If anyone has a setting to share, please, go ahead. Looking forward to try it. I'm doing it the old fashioned way ... trial and error.

With these settings, i have a smooth flying experience 90% of the time. I have some hiccups from time to time, over dense cities, and when there is a lot of movement on the airport (for instance in the new F5 campaign. THe first couple of minutes of the missions, there is some stutter. its beareable, but anoying lol.)

 

They work fine in 1.5 and 2. I'm happy with the current performance / visual quality.

 

The oculus is expensive and I dont know which headset is the best... but oh boy!, i'm happy with it. It also Works on P3D, so when i'm in the mood of flying GA planes or a big stupid A320 I do it VR too.

 

I'm looking forward to the hornet. Carrier ops in VR, sweet!

 

Its funny you mention MkI eyeball. With VR I find myself looking most of the time outside instead of staring the MFDs.

 

You are spending needless performance on MSAA when you are using Super Sampling. Just saying, they effectively do the same thing, on SS gives you a better picture for VR