Analog thumb stick importance?

[Ifikratis]

Hi all,

 

I am writing because I have a question regarding the use of the analog thumb stick on a hardware throttle. I do not own a dedicated throttle yet except my T.1600M joystick and today I placed a pre-order for the Virpil MT-50 throttle. I chose it instead of the TM warthog throttle mostly because of its metallic internals and thus I believe it will last long and be more precise as Virpil seems to have the quality I like (based on what I see and read). My only concern is the following: I read that they plan to release in the future a model with an analog thumb stick, while the one currently on pre-release state is using hat switches. I am new to DCS and so I am not as experienced about the uses of the throttle switches on flight, however I am aware of the TWC cursor that is usually controlled using these switches.

 

My question is this: Is it necessary and is it realistic to have an analog thumbstick (mini joystick) on the throttle or is it more realistic to have a 4-way hat? If the functionality on the modules I am using is going to be reduced because I won't have an analog thumbstick, I'd rather call off my pre-order and re-order when they release the analog stick version. My main concern is not if the analog is easier to use (I guess it is) but more if its realistic, ie. if the real fighters have all an analog thumb stick.

 

Thank you all for spending your time reading my question. I'd be very happy to hear your opinion.

Edited August 2, 2018 by Ifikratis

[hansangb]

Analog is used for targeting pods, etc. So analog is more useful in that regard than a 4 or 8 way hat. For me, that is.

[Ifikratis]

Thanks for the reply. I am aware that the analog is better, my question though is if its more realistic. Does the real jets have an analog thumbstick or a 4-way hat?

Edited August 2, 2018 by Ifikratis

[hansangb]

It is officially labeled as a missile seeker slew control. So I can't imagine that can be done with a 4/8 way hat.

[mdee]

Thanks for the reply. I am aware that the analog is better, my question though is if its more realistic. Does the real jets have an analog thumbstick or a 4-way hat?

 

Neither, likely. Some force sensing stuff.

 

In the sim, it makes very little difference, except in Viggen where you can use it to guide one of the missiles, which are super hard to guide either way. It's not necessary, 4-way hat has very similar functionality.

Edited August 2, 2018 by mdee

[Sokol1_br]

Real jet's normally use a pressure device called transducer for targeting pods.

 

https://www.otto-controls.com/j2-transducer

 

This kind of transducer is too expensive for use in domestic joysticks.

 

Thrustmaster F-16 FLCS/F22 PRO use a kind of IBM laptop pressure mouse in their TQS, but at time the thing are "loved" like Warthog "slew" control. :)

 

As curiosity the KU-31 used in Russian fighters, a mechanical/analog device.

 

 

Suggestion: take you preferred DCS jet and set the HAT in your actual joystick for control target pod/slew/radar function and see if is practical.

 

EDIT - And for test a mini-stick use borrow a gamepad.

Edited August 3, 2018 by Sokol1_br

[Ranma13]

Virpil has not committed to making an analog version of the throttle, they've only stated that they'd like to get the current version up and going before looking into other variants.

 

Whether a thumbstick is important is something that you should decide based the aircraft you fly and your preferences. I would urge you to avoid falling into the trap of using realism as a criteria. Many people on this forum place heavy emphasis on what's realistic, to the point where it almost becomes the sole criteria. However, we do not sit in real cockpits, we do not experience G forces, we don't have control loading forces, we fly multiple types of aircraft, and we need to use a mouse and keyboard. For that matter, real slew controls are usually force sensors, and analog sticks are only a crude approximation. In aircraft such as the Su-27, the slew cursor will stay in whatever position you move it to rather than return to center. The Virpil throttle and stick are based on the PAK-FA controls, but modified for home sim use and are not strictly realistic. As much as we'd all love to get as close to realistic as possible, there are limits to what consumer-level hardware can provide.

 

A much better criteria is to evaluate something based on how effective it makes you. If a side-mounted stick makes you more effective than a center-mounted one, then that's where it should go, regardless of its position in the real aircraft. If you feel more comfortable using slew controls on the joystick (Russian style) than on the throttle (US style), then that's where you should bind your slew controls, regardless of what's used in the real aircraft. If you feel that you need an analog stick and that it's useful to you, then you should get a throttle with one. But if you feel like it's not all that important, then don't bother.

Edited August 2, 2018 by Ranma13

[Ifikratis]

Really thank you all for your replies. I understand that we have to compromise to what is possible and mostly, available for our simulators. I chose the Virpil because I believe it has the durability and build quality I like.

 

I went through all the aircraft I have using the excellent Chuck guides and found out that all the aircraft I use will need a 4-way or 5-way hat switches to operate the throttle controls, so I should not lose any functionality.

 

Thank you Sokol and Ranma for the very useful input. I was unaware that the real planes use different kind of switches. And in that respect I understand Ranma suggestion. The real switches are so much more efficient that a 4-way hat or an analog self-centering thumbstick, however the analog thumbstick is a closer approximation. I think I will learn to center the pods with the hat fast enough and so keep my pre-order.

Edited August 2, 2018 by Ifikratis