Over the Hump Mission 2, need tactics help

[VC]

I downloaded this campaign, as updated by MadDog-IC, to fill in the gap and give me some action with that awesome new FM.

 

 

However, I'm really struggling. Only on Mission 2, and I'm badly feeling the lack of data-link (I flew the Su-33 before). It's not just that though. Even when "cheating" and using the F10 map for additional Situational Awareness, I'm getting completely overwhelmed by that swarm of F-5s.

 

 

My best result so far has been me getting 3 kills for 5 missiles fired while all 3 of my wingmen got shot down with 1 kill between them. That left me 1v4 with a single R73 on the rail, pretty hopeless.

 

 

I know it's me doing something wrong, but not sure what. It mostly just seems like my wingmen are completely incompetent, but I don't know how better to command them, or manage the overall flow of the battle so they actually help.

 

What tactics should I employ for this mission? I guess I also just need general tips on how to improve SA and approach combat in the Mig-29.

[AeriaGloria]

The F-5s only have sidewinders, I pulled off great TWS2 shots getting 4 for 4 multiple times. As you said it’s hard after that where they almost surround you. It is hard at first but it gets better, pay attention to awacs calls, use the knee board, you’ll get there. You get to use all sixty flares in this mission so use them!

 

It’s really hard when you can’t just communicate with your strike group and ask “where are you” but instead have to use the radar.

[VC]

Erm... have you edited your mission files? I'm flying with the default 2x R-27R, 2x R-73 and 2x R60. I considered switching to R77s but I thought that would be cheating.

 

The F-5s are indeed very dumb in BVR, even with the R27 I have a nearly 100% hit ratio, but because it's SARH I'm merged with the second F-5 in the pair by the time it hits. I can dodge this guy and take him out with an R60, so I'm 2 for 0 at this stage but my wingmen have done nothing. Then after merge my wingmen all disperse and engage randomly anyway, especially since the second and third pairs of F-5s come at you at almost the same time from opposite directions. Then my flight gets picked apart piecemeal or I get sideswiped by a Sidewinder.

 

What do you order your wingmen to do? I normally target lead bandit, order a single wingman to attack him, then attack the second bandit myself. Often wingman is too dumb to fire R27 and I have to deal with both enemies anyway (see above).

 

Also, I'm not really familiar with the kneeboard, how exactly does it help? Isn't it just a flat map?

[AeriaGloria]

I always order spread four and we can fend the two groups off in pairs, with the BVR weapons it works, AI loves to sling R-27s at long range.

 

Yes it’s personal taste wether you edit the mission or not, if it was a mission that was new and I knew that someone put a lot of work into it and that the payload was part of the immersion, k would n9t change payload. But in this situation, in my head canon since R-77s are expensive only the flight lead gets them and my wing,en get R-27s. I often also do 1xR-27Et 1xR-27ER 2x R-77 2xR-73. Entirely fictional load out but again it’s personal preference what you like. I always ignored Adders until the PN update so now I’m having fun with them

[VC]

You must have different wingmen to me because a couple of times I got shot down early, I cycled external view and every single one of them was dogfighting with both 27s still on their rails. Trying to fend off in pairs is the best way to quickly lose 2 wingmen in my experience. :(

 

I'll give it another go, try the spread 4. Do you not issue additional commands? Like a generic "engage bandits" or "reform"?

 

EDIT: I should check pilot skill settings in the mission. If it's "random" then that's probably what I need to change!

Edited November 7, 2018 by VC

[AeriaGloria]

I always tell them to turn on radar and music. If you don’t they’ll often just use EOS

[draconus]

Flight > engage bandits usually is enough unless you want more control which exact targets they should engage. This can work bad if, for example, strikers are nearby, so they engage them instead of the escort first.

There is also a good Pincer Left/Right option which spreads them more and gives you advantage esp. when outnumbering the enemy.

[VC]

Thanks all, I finally managed it :) well, I edited the loadout slightly, gave my team 27ERs and 4x 73s instead of short Rs and 60s.

 

Wingmen were already on Expert but this time they showed it (Maybe they just like the ER more?). They definitely use radar without being told to, judging by how my RWR lights up. 3 kills to me, 5 for 1 loss to the rest of the flight. Although I'm pretty sure at least one more crashed due to lack of fuel. And the Su-24s got mauled, but I have no idea what they were up to in the first place.

 

On to the next mission!

[The LT]

Just did it on the first try with default loadout with no losses. The key here is having your situational awareness high. Be sure to know where the adversaries are coming from and order your second and third element to engage the first group you see. Order your wingman to cover you and dispatch another flight while making sure you cover the Frogfoots. They use stand-off weapons anyway.

 

The adversaries are only armed with two sidewinders each so keeping your distance is key. They don't stand a chance against a Fulcrum in a dogfight.

 

Keeping your SA is key in every engagement in a MiG. Make sure you listen to those AWACS calls and be your radar at all times. Using the front hemisphere PRF mode helps somewhat.

[The LT]

What tactics should I employ for this mission? I guess I also just need general tips on how to improve SA and approach combat in the Mig-29.

 

Know the general direction of the bogeys. Keep your distance. Order your wingman to cover you. Don't push it and don't try to rush without knowing exactly where the enemy is. Watch out for sidewinder launches and go defensive immediately. Keep count of your flares and don't waste them in one defensive maneuver.

 

You have the initiative in this mission. Use it to your advantage. Dictate the rules with those 27Rs.

[ngalvagno]

Hi! Im relativley new and noob, but what helped a lot with my SA was the TacView program. You can download it from their page just google it. You do not need to pay, free version available. After each flight ill check my TacView. There you can see what happened during the flight and were you were positioned and also the enemie planes. It did helped a lot to improve my playstyle. My SA is still crappy but gets better every day. Hope it helps you too.

[VC]

Definitely something to practice. Thing is, I played the Su-33 first so I got so used to that amazing data link, which unfortunately is just a crutch.

 

I had no issue with missions 3 and 4 though in Over the Hump. Actually my SA is great WVR, diving into that swarm of Phantoms in mission 4 and coming out ace in a day was the most fun I've had so far in this game.

 

Now Mission 5 I failed spectacularly the first time. I engaged the "wrong" group and the second scramble snuck past me and wiped out the Su-24s. I definitely need to work on my overall mental picture in BVR. I'm struggling to imagine all the positions and angles, and things change so fast. First mistake, I had no idea where the strike package even was! Lesson learned, will try again.

Edited November 27, 2018 by VC