tanks shooting down helos

[Dark_Sceptre]

All this talk about Apaches reminded me of the very first sim I ever played; Microproses Apache AH64H Gunship for ZX Spectrum 48k. Filled vectors aside, it was actually a very realistic simulator considering its constraints. Juggling collectives & cyclics with a rubber keyboard and a digital 8-way joystick while trying to stay in cover with multiple SAMs and even Hinds on the hunt was damn hard and damn fun.. ahh.

 

The game even modeled things like safe zones for autorotation landings - and trust me, you'd done a fair amount of those by the time you'd played through all four campaigns ;)

 

This is how it looked like:

 

 

The row of letters at the top are the warning lights. The yellow area in the middle is a scrolling map - diamonds are mountains, squares with a smaller square in the upper left corner are airfields or FARPs etc. Primitive but surprisingly functional

[169th_DedCat]

I had a photo I grabbed off of a site on the net about a month ago of a remotely operated Huey helo catching a tank HEAT round in the face. It was a devastating photo at the point of impact. I'll see if I can't re-locate it and post a link here.

 

LOMAC may have over modeled the accuracy of a tank engaging a helo with the main gun, but it isn't completely unrealistic.

 

I think I remember the game M1A2 Tank Platoon II having a special round, probably an unshaped charge, for engaging airborne targets.

[169th_DedCat]

Okay so I wasn't able to find that photo of the remote-operated helo getting smacked by a tank HEAT round--which is too bad because it was really cool--but I was able to find this info:

 

[Sealpup]

Actually, it shouldn't even matter for the AH-64D Longbow. Their AGM-114s are fire-and-forget, like the AMRAAM, only for tanks. In all honesty, if Lock On was to model helos correctly, a flight of four AH-64Ds should take out 32 T-80s caught in the open all in one or two passes - a minute or two - assuming that it takes two Hellfires to destroy a tank as it currently is in Lock On.

 

Actually, the Hellfire is semi-active, and depending on the version, needs either constant laser or radar illumination. Also, the Longbow can only illuminate one target at a time. The way they get away with attacking multiple targets is by changing the missile to a 'lock on after launch' mode, which lofts them up higher and gives the firing platform a little more time to think and switch targets.

 

Now, as for 4 Longbows taking out 32 tanks? They wouldn't really do it in passes. They would find some place to make pop-up attacks and just ripple the missiles off, likely alternating between one ship firing and one designating targets semi-behind cover. You'd still end up with a big pile of scrap metal afterwards though :twisted:

 

EDIT: Wow, there was a whole other page. I wonder why I didn't get that nifty little '1,2' thing in the corner until just now?

[SUBS17]

Thats what I said, they don't pass over the target but launch from behind cover. They don't even have to popup now! Also the target can be painted by several methods and even though its one target at a time the result will still be the same.

cheers

Subs

[D-Scythe]

Actually, the Hellfire is semi-active, and depending on the version, needs either constant laser or radar illumination. Also, the Longbow can only illuminate one target at a time. The way they get away with attacking multiple targets is by changing the missile to a 'lock on after launch' mode, which lofts them up higher and gives the firing platform a little more time to think and switch targets.

 

Are you sure the Longbow doesn't have a radar mode analogous to TWS (as in the F-15/AMRAAM combo)? From what I've seen, the Longbow Hellfire can be rippled off pretty much instantaneously, and are also fire and forget. It was one of the reasons why the AH-64D was so much more survivable (8 times, I think - over 700%) than the AH-64A.

[GGTharos]

The MMW Hellfire is supposed to be an active missile last I heard.

[D-Scythe]

Yeah, both evolutions of the Hellfire, the Longbow Hellfire and the Brimstone, are active missiles: one MMW and the other IR.

 

It's the logical extension of missile technology over the past 10 years: weapons that were previously not fire and forget, like the SM-2 standard, are being reequipped with active radar or IIR seekers.

[Sealpup]

My knowledge of RF-guided hellfires ends at the K-model, which is SARH. Anything past that is news to me :D

[D-Scythe]

Hyena, the AGM-114K is NOT the Longbow Hellfire. I think Lock On made that mistake. IRL, the AGM-114K AFAIK was intended to be an interim solution before the jump was to be made from the normal AGM-114 laser Hellfires, and is actually BOTH laser guided and SARH guided. Probably an interim weapon for non-FCR equipped AH-64Ds.

 

The definitive Hellfire missile for the AH-64D Longbow Apache is the AGM-114L Longbow Hellfire. Here's a quote:

 

The Longbow Hellfire missile will provide an adverse weather, fire-and-forget, heavy anti-armor capability for attack helicopters.The Longbow Hellfire missile is a millimeter wave radar fire-and-forget version of the Hellfire missile. The Longbow development program also includes development of a fire control radar system and numerous modifications to the helicopter. The Longbow fire control radar system will locate, classify, and prioritize targets for the Longbow Hellfire missile. The Longbow system is being developed for integration into the Apache attack helicopter and the Comanche armed reconnaissance helicopter. Longbow is planned for integration into the entire fleet of Apache aircraft and into one-third of the Comanche fleet.