DML - Mission Creation Toolbox [no Lua required]

[cfrag]

3 minutes ago, Chad Vader said:

I have a question about heloTroops.  I want to spawn ground units using a spawner when a helo flies into the spawners zone and lands.  Do I use heloTroops for this because in the manual it seems like this module is for player controlled vehicles

heloTroops is a module that allows any player-controlled helicopter to pick up and deploy same-faction infantry troops. It does not care how these troops were spawned. 

That being said, heloTroops allows for integration with spawners and cloners to trigger a spawn/clone cycle via the communications menu if you want to, and the helo has landed close enough to the spawn point (trigger zone that houses the spawner/cloner).

[Chad Vader]

1 minute ago, cfrag said:

heloTroops is a module that allows any player-controlled helicopter to pick up and deploy same-faction infantry troops. It does not care how these troops were spawned. 

That being said, heloTroops allows for integration with spawners and cloners to trigger a spawn/clone cycle via the communications menu if you want to, and the helo has landed close enough to the spawn point (trigger zone that houses the spawner/cloner).

Is there a way to do this automatically with AI helicopters?  Before I was just using an in zone ME trigger to spawn a LA infantry unit.

I would rather use a cloner or spawner to do this when the helicopter lands in the zone.  Is this possible?

Thanks again for your continued assistance. 

[cfrag]

Just now, Recluse said:

So, you are suggesting that rather than actually registering dropped supplies, we use some sort of trigger to SPAWN them when the appropriate aircraft is in the vicinity and does the appropriate action?

As my grandmother used to say "there are many ways to skin a cat" (now, I don't know why she said that, nor do I want to know how she knows that) - but that approach is merely one of many possible ways to do that. There probably are many more, and more elegant, ways to do so. WRT to how units spawned by the (hopefully soon to be released Herc) integrates with mission persistence is currently unclear to me, and we'll have to see. The (fantasitc) Anubis Herc (precursor to the coming aircraft) has some internal script that does not integrate with DML.

Just now, Chad Vader said:

Is there a way to do this automatically with AI helicopters?  Before I was just using an in zone ME trigger to spawn a LA infantry unit.

Well, I've written the code (some while back) that clones a helo and its embarking units, so that should still work. The real issue here is that IMHO the DCS-internal troop embarkation method is a mess and I wouldn't trust it as far as I can throw it. But in theory, cloners work with AI helos and embarking troops.

[Chad Vader]

12 minutes ago, cfrag said:

Well, I've written the code (some while back) that clones a helo and its embarking units, so that should still work. The real issue here is that IMHO the DCS-internal troop embarkation method is a mess and I wouldn't trust it as far as I can throw it. But in theory, cloners work with AI helos and embarking troops.

I agree, so I use a zone instead and when the helo lands there I spawn a late activation unit.

I just dont understand how DML handles the whole 'detect if a unit of a certain faction (AI) is in a zone and if so spawn units there'

Its fairly simple in ME but when using a cloned unit I cant refer to it by name.

Edited January 24, 2024 by Chad Vader

[cfrag]

10 minutes ago, Chad Vader said:

I just dont understand how DML handles the whole 'detect if a unit of a certain faction (AI) is in a zone and if so spawn units there'

I'd break that apart:

• detect if a unit of a certain faction is in a zone is easy with ME triggers and you can use it to increment a flag which then triggers a DML module
• alternatively, you can use a unitZone to do the "detectoring", very useful if you want to trigger only on certain units that have been cloned (unitZones allow to trigger on names, and you can tightly control how clone units are named)
• Once detected, use the flag that is incrmented by the detector to initiate a clone cycle.

You may also find the "Clone Relations" demo and explanation interesting.

[Chad Vader]

19 minutes ago, cfrag said:

I'd break that apart:

• detect if a unit of a certain faction is in a zone is easy with ME triggers and you can use it to increment a flag which then triggers a DML module
• alternatively, you can use a unitZone to do the "detectoring", very useful if you want to trigger only on certain units that have been cloned (unitZones allow to trigger on names, and you can tightly control how clone units are named)
• Once detected, use the flag that is incrmented by the detector to initiate a clone cycle.

You may also find the "Clone Relations" demo and explanation interesting.

You've thought of everything!

Is there a way of checking if the unit is below a certain AGL before triggering?  In the ME we have the "units AGL is less than X" and I use that to fire the trigger so that the units spawn when the helo has landed.

Edited January 24, 2024 by Chad Vader

[Recluse]

@Chad Vader I had a hard time with the AI because of the built in DCS ME mechanics where you have to specify the embarking troops (no wild cards allowed that I could see) so when the Cloner spawned units, the AI helo didn't know to pick them up because their name wasn't the same. The only way I found to do it was to preposition a squad with a known name (either active or Late Activation) for the AI to pick up.  Spawinng the units when the helo was in zone was the easy thing.....having the AI pick them up was the hard part.

Maybe I am missing something obvious. LIke this:

"alternatively, you can use a unitZone to do the "detectoring", very useful if you want to trigger only on certain units that have been cloned (unitZones allow to trigger on names, and you can tightly control how clone units are named) "

Have to investigate! Seems like you can't duplicate group names, though, so it would be a One-off anyway... Investigating IDENTICAL yes now...

 

 

 

Edited January 24, 2024 by Recluse

[Chad Vader]

6 minutes ago, Recluse said:

@Chad Vader I had a hard time with the AI because of the built in DCS ME mechanics where you have to specify the embarking troops (no wild cards allowed that I could see) so when the Cloner spawned units, the AI helo didn't know to pick them up because their name wasn't the same. The only way I found to do it was to preposition a squad with a known name (either active or Late Activation) for the AI to pick up.  Spawinng the units when the helo was in zone was the easy thing.....having the AI pick them up was the hard part.

Maybe I am missing something obvious. LIke this:

"alternatively, you can use a unitZone to do the "detectoring", very useful if you want to trigger only on certain units that have been cloned (unitZones allow to trigger on names, and you can tightly control how clone units are named) "

Have to investigate! Seems like you can't duplicate group names, though, so it would be a One-off anyway...

 

Hey!

Thanks for replying.

The unitZone is interesting, I have got it to spawn and despawn units when a helo enters and leaves a zone accordingly.  You can wildcard the name of the unit if you put a * after its name like troopHelo* so it doesnt matter that the unit is cloned and has an appended suffix.

I just need to figure out how to wait to spawn the units until after the helo has landed using the triggerzone.

[Recluse]

I got it to work (at least for the initial clone) using the IDENTICAL  YES flag on the CLONE Zone.

How are you getting the AI to pick up the troops? When in the Mission Editor and using the EMBARK TROOPS Waypoint action for the HELO and EMBARK TO TRANSPORT WP action for the Troops, it forces the Helo to land and pick them up, so it doesnt matter if they spawn before landing because the helo has to land anyway.

FYI..

 

(I used flags in the Mission Editor Trigger section vs. DML for the In zone flag that triggers the Cloner, but it could as well be done with the unitZone.

My question about the Wild Card was not for the UNIT that triggers the spawn but for the spawned troops themselves. I think it might crash and burn if a helo came BACK to trigger more troops that had the same name as the first group...unless I wipe them once they get transported and disembarked to capture the base.

DML_DynamicMission_TEST_NoNASAM.miz

Edited January 24, 2024 by Recluse

[Chad Vader]

1 hour ago, Recluse said:

I got it to work (at least for the initial clone) using the IDENTICAL  YES flag on the CLONE Zone.

How are you getting the AI to pick up the troops? When in the Mission Editor and using the EMBARK TROOPS Waypoint action for the HELO and EMBARK TO TRANSPORT WP action for the Troops, it forces the Helo to land and pick them up, so it doesnt matter if they spawn before landing because the helo has to land anyway.

FYI..

 

(I used flags in the Mission Editor Trigger section vs. DML for the In zone flag that triggers the Cloner, but it could as well be done with the unitZone.

My question about the Wild Card was not for the UNIT that triggers the spawn but for the spawned troops themselves. I think it might crash and burn if a helo came BACK to trigger more troops that had the same name as the first group...unless I wipe them once they get transported and disembarked to capture the base.

DML_DynamicMission_TEST_NoNASAM.miz 118.31 kB · 0 downloads

 

Oh, I dont actually pick them up, I just despawn them and respawn them where I want to drop them off.

[Recluse]

26 minutes ago, Chad Vader said:

Oh, I dont actually pick them up, I just despawn them and respawn them where I want to drop them off.

Ahhhh... I see....that explains it!!  I tried Cloning 2 groups of troops with the same name, and it seemed to work, and two different helos picked them up. But once one of the groups was dropped off, the other helo did not disembark its troops (probably because a group with the same name had already disembarked/ spawned?). Maybe something else was going on..

Edited January 24, 2024 by Recluse

[Chad Vader]

7 minutes ago, Recluse said:

Ahhhh... I see....that explains it!!  I tried Cloning 2 groups of troops with the same name, and it seemed to work, and two different helos picked them up. But once one of the groups was dropped off, the other helo did not disembark it's troops (probably because a group with the same name had already disembarked/ spawned?). Maybe something else was going on..

 

I havent got that far yet  im currently trying with one helo and trying to get it to land before the troops spawn.  I was thinking of outputing a flat to a delay timer so by the time the delay timer expires the helo has landed.

[Recluse]

Yeah, now I understand why you were looking for triggers to specify landing etc..."The AGL is less than"  didn't work, coupled with an IN Zone flag?

 

BTW, the reason I went with the actual dropping of troops was that I couldn't get a BLUE helo to LAND at a RED airbase (in order spawn units) but they were happy to fly into a Hot LZ to disembark troops, and effect the capture.  Wouldn't be a problem with a ZONE but is with an Airfield.  Was going to have them HeloCap a nearby ZONE and then use a flag to change ownership of the Airfield but it got messy. Maybe they land outside the perimeter and spawn troops that march in or something.

Edited January 24, 2024 by Recluse

[cfrag]

Version 2.0.1 - 20240125

Maintenance Update 

The first couple of weeks after the big 2.0 release have been surprisingly calm, and happily filled with a lot of feedback for new and interesting ideas. This release contains minor tweaks to many modules, plus two more demos and their descriptions that I could not get done last year. 

The biggest updates were to csarManager, which received a partial re-write to its inner core for better performance and reliability, and The Debugger, where I (with great help from the community) was able to finally track down a very, very strange bug that is related to how DCS does memory management during event callbacks, and that you should not worry about.

All changes in Detail:

Manual
    Main 
        - Updates/Tweaks to many modules 
        - New "Clone Factory" demo doc 
        - New "Airfield Mine" demo doc

    Quick Reference
        - tweaks / corrections / updates  
        
Demos
    - new Airbase Mine 
    - Attack of the CloneZ update 
    - Bug Hunt update 
    - new Clone Factory 
    - CSAR of Georgia update 
    - Debug events and more  update 
    - Landing Lessons update 

Modules
    - airfield 2.1.1
        - fixed a DCS getCategory regression-related bug 
        - added makeNeutral? attribute 
        
    - cfxZones 4.1.2
        - added some QoL 
        
    - civAir 3.0.2 
        - clean-up 
        
    - csarManager 3.0.0
        - rewrite of inner core, no longer requires cfxPlayer 
        - better integration with Limited Airframes 
        - better support for aircraft other than Helicopters 
        
    - dcsCommon 3.0.1
        - improvements to clone() 
    
    - factoryZone 3.1.0
        - new attributes redP!, blueP!, defendMe?
        - support for method 
    
    - objectDestructDetector 2.0.2
        - integration with PlayerScore 
    
    - PlayerScore 3.0.2
        - integration with objectDestructDetector 
    
    - TDZ 1.0.3
        - fixed defaulting for 'manual' option 
        
    - The Debugger 2.1.0
        - fixed long-standing issue with crash after exiting mission 
    
    - Willie Pete 
        - added more WP ammo 
        - hardened player update 
        
Enjoy,

-ch    
        

[Recluse]

James Brown might have been the Hardest Working Man in Show Business, but @cfrag seems to the the Hardest Working Man in DCS Utility Modding!!  Thanks for all you do and your willingness to answer our (MY!) stupid questions!!   o7  

Edited January 25, 2024 by Recluse

[Mistermann]

2 hours ago, Recluse said:

James Brown might have been the Hardest Working Man in Show Business, but @cfrag seems to the the Hardest Working Man in DCS Utility Modding!!  Thanks for all you do and your willingness to answer our (MY!) stupid questions!!   o7  

 

I am constantly amazed at his dedication.  Huge thanks to @cfrag for what he does for us.  My DCS experience is better thanks to him.

Definitely a member of my community hall of fame !

[Chad Vader]

thanks cfrag!

[Recluse]

On 1/22/2024 at 7:54 AM, cfrag said:

Let's make this 100%.

Please try below amended script. Warning: Untested.

williePete.lua 26.21 kB · 1 download

Finally got to do a real MP test.

- Indeed there were no more Script Errors being thrown, so the tweak seems to have worked.

- Not unexpectedly, there were issues when we were in a group of more than one aircraft. We were a flight of 2 and my wingman (who was number 1) was RTB and I was hanging around slinging WilliePete. Once he got far out of the zone, it wouldn't let me check in saying I was many kilometers away, when I was really well within the zone. It probably checked position of the Flight Lead. It did let me check in the first time when we were both close together.  So it makes sense to stick to Single ships or have all the flight members stay together when using WilliePete.  We never did try to see what happened if BOTH of us tried to mark targets once checked in, or, in fact if it would let both of us check in, or say we were already checked in.

 

[Chad Vader]

Does anyone know if there is a way to make a cloner spawn if 2 flags are raised?  So enter 2 flags into the clone? box to make it behave like an AND condition?

[Recluse]

25 minutes ago, Chad Vader said:

Does anyone know if there is a way to make a cloner spawn if 2 flags are raised?  So enter 2 flags into the clone? box to make it behave like an AND condition?

I don't (yet) know how to do it in DML, but I have done it in the ME Flag section, basically creating the AND condition THERE  in the conditions to trigger the appropriate clone? Flag.

 

[cfrag]

30 minutes ago, Chad Vader said:

So enter 2 flags into the clone? box to make it behave like an AND condition?

Try the XFlags module. It's a multi-in AND, OR, XOR and some other stuff gate  

Just now, Recluse said:

but I have done it in the ME Flag section,

Be very weary of ME's condition. They do not fully document the precedence of AND and OR, so you must be VERY carefuil with your sequence of AND and OR, unless you have all ANDs or all ORs. They can't do XOR.

Edited January 26, 2024 by cfrag

[Chad Vader]

Thanks!

I have another question (sorry for all the questions)

If I remove the last unit in a cloned group using the deClone value, does that fire empty!  ?

im trying to remove a group if it doesnt get killed then spawn a new unit.

Here is my stack.  I despawn using a unitZone, bang enterZone! which I pass to the cloner, then I want empty! to fire and the timer to start, but it doesnt actually clone a new unit.

Edited January 26, 2024 by Chad Vader

[cfrag]

1 hour ago, Chad Vader said:

I despawn using a unitZone, bang enterZone! which I pass to the cloner, then I want empty! to fire and the timer to start, but it doesnt actually clone a new unit.

Wouldn't it be easier to simply set preWipe to true, and then run a clone cycle? preWipe removes all remaining clones from the last cycle before spawing, which should be the same net effect (if I understood correctly what you are trying to do)

[Chad Vader]

HI,

I have encountered another problem with the clone zones.

I have a cloner set up just outside the city like this

Theposition in the top right is where the troops get cloned, but as you can see, the first clone group followed their waypoint to attack the city, but subsequent cloned groups just sit on the sapwn and dont move.  Do you have any idea why this could be?  THanks.

EDIT: After some experimentation.. ive found that if the previous group is still alive when the next group spawns, they dont do anything.  But if the previous group is dead, they follow their waypoints as normal.

Edited January 27, 2024 by Chad Vader

[bitboy]

Hey cFrag,

 A quick question, in looking at the Factory zone. When attackers are spawned, is there a way to control the number spawned? In my case I have the Factory zone set to spawn 3 infantry, a truck, and two technicals, which works great. However the factory spawns an enormous amount of units. I've been reviewing the documentation and I missing on how to control the number of attackers produced. 

Thxs