reported earlier TWS Ranking

[MARLAN_]

It appears in DCS that TWS ranking is being decided based on range only.

- TWS ranking should be based on a combination of range and range rate (shortest TTG)

In TWSRanking.trk you can see two contacts in a ~5nm trail. They are ranked with the lead #1 and the trail #2 despite the lead contact flying Mach 0.6 and the trail contact flying Mach 1.7

The missing consideration of range rate/shortest time-to-go is likely a contributing factor to why outbound missiles are being ranked #1 as they would have negative range rate and a longer time-to-go.

[A1-F18AC-FRM-000 008-00 Page 9 Index 2, A1-F18AC-FRM-000 008-00 Page 16 Index 39, A1-F18AC-FRM-000 008-00 Page 17 Index 45]

TWSRanking.trk

[BIGNEWY]

Hi,

it is not on range only in DCS

There are 10 tracks in total. 2 are L&S and DT2, the rest are simply assigned a rank depending on:
1) HAFU - hostile the highest, then unknown and the ambiguous, last - friendly
2) Time to target
3) direction of the target

thanks

[MARLAN_]

2 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

Hi,

it is not on range only in DCS

There are 10 tracks in total. 2 are L&S and DT2, the rest are simply assigned a rank depending on:
1) HAFU - hostile the highest, then unknown and the ambiguous, last - friendly
2) Time to target
3) direction of the target

thanks

Sorry, I can't see the code so I can only guess how it is implemented on the back end. 

Although if time to target is considered, shouldn't the trail contact flying mach 1.7 be rank #1? It doesn't switch until the moment where they pass each other.

[wilbur81]

On 6/24/2022 at 4:23 AM, BIGNEWY said:

3) direction of the target

thanks

I suppose this raises the question: Then why is an Amraam pointed away (and moving away) from the Hornet out-rank fighters Hot and closing that already had a higher ranking? And, again, why is the other similar radar system in DCS (the Viper's) not seeing the same problem?

I've tried to work out why a Viper, at the same speed and altitude, using the same missile, and having a very similar (slightly less powerful) radar, can so outclass the Hornet in DCS BVR right now. I think I know why: Ironically, our Hornet has had the TALD decoy for over a year now... in the form of the AIM120 (or any other missile).  The DCS Hornet pilot has to do a good bit of work trying to decipher "what is the enemy?" and "what is the enemy's (or ownship's) missile?" The DCS Viper driver has no such decisions to make. It is quite frustrating at the moment. Case in point: in the screenshots below from the attached track, there are only two airplanes in the airspace other than me... chaos.

TWSchaos.trk

Edited June 25, 2022 by wilbur81

[wilbur81]

I've run the exact same scenario/mission with the Viper as the Hornet test in the post above...only this time, I rippled off all 6 of my AMRAAMS to further clutter the airspace. Note that the Viper's scope in TWS is perfectly pristine, only displaying the two J-11's (which have also launched at me, as in the Hornet test) that I'm targeting.

 

[Laurreth]

On 6/24/2022 at 4:33 PM, wilbur81 said:

I've tried to work out why a Viper, at the same speed and altitude, using the same missile, and having a very similar (slightly less powerful) radar, can so outclass the Hornet in DCS BVR right now.

I don't say that it's not a problem, and indeed the ranking probably shouldn't be so bothered about something very small running away very quickly.

According to [citation needed], The F-16CM would, however, have a vastly more modern electronics suite than the end-of-life F/A-18C which was the result of a 1987 upgrade. The F-16CM in comparison was a child of 2002. In terms of consumer computing, that would make the difference between a cutting edge intel 386 and a late Pentium, and while the military might have had access to slightly more advanced parts or simply more of them, the difference would only have been more extreme.

Edited June 26, 2022 by Laurreth

[MARLAN_]

I think that's getting a bit off topic. The issue with TWS Ranking has nothing to do with the computing power of the F/A-18C.

Also, this thread is meant to be about TWS Ranking, not whether or not missiles should be visible on the radar. I only meant to note that part of why when friendly missiles are present on the F-18 radar they can be more of a nuisance because they are sometimes designated a high priority rank despite being dragging away at very high speeds resulting in what would be a very high TTG if not infinite depending how it is calculated.

[MARLAN_]

On 6/24/2022 at 4:23 AM, BIGNEWY said:

Hi,

it is not on range only in DCS

There are 10 tracks in total. 2 are L&S and DT2, the rest are simply assigned a rank depending on:
1) HAFU - hostile the highest, then unknown and the ambiguous, last - friendly
2) Time to target
3) direction of the target

thanks

Hi, @BIGNEWY looks like ranking is correct as is, assuming that your quote is correct. The ranks do change based on TTG currently.

However, it looks like TTG in the first place is not calculated correctly, it appears it is not taking into account velocity at all. A contact traveling at Mach 2.2 vs a contact traveling at Mach 0.5 is assigned the same TTG despite all other factors being equal (hot aspect, altitude, etc.)

I will make a different thread regarding that, thanks.

[BIGNEWY]

TWS rankings are being investigated internally at the moment.

thanks