Ryzen 9 5900x vs Ryzen 7 5800x3d

[Thinder]

On 10/20/2022 at 11:53 PM, shastasm said:

Hey all.

I've been considering getting a Ryzen 7 5800x3d for DCS & MSFS2020.  I am currently running a Ryzen 9 5900x and getting good performance, but would like to understand if there is a big performance gain for DCS if I switch to the R7 5800x3d.  

Appreciate any feedback from anyone that has made this switch.  

Consider first upgrading your RAM for a B.die kit. Best gains with Ryzen are obtained with a 1 bank X 4 sticks (interleaving) 3200MHz ,especially with the Ryzen CPUs due to their architecture (Infinity Fabric), their controllers (4 banks maximum regardless of the number of sticks and 3200MHz limit).

With B.die you will have a lot wider range of settings available to keep your frequency at 3200MHz UNDER LOAD which is an important detail since with a conventional RAM kit, your CPU will throttle back and start narrowing channels at this point, unless your RAM can provide it with the right setting in BIOS, B.Die being a much more stable material will allow for that.

This is the gain I managed with such a kit, tested back to back right before and after upgrade from a Crucial kit running at 3200MHz.

Note that because the CPU doesn't limit the GPU channel there is also a gain of 1.33% in graphics, the whole test was 4K, some would chose to watercool their CPUs but not only they would lose the warranty but also the average gain for watercooling O.C is just above 5%, to me it was always a no brainer....

I'd advise GSkill kits but there are also aa couple of other manufacturers using the Samsung B-Die material that you can find here.   B-Die Finder

Edited November 3, 2022 by Thinder

[McGraw]

Are either of these CPUs worth buying for a new build today?

Moving from a 4790k with 16gb 2133hz.

Or should I just spend a bit extra and get a 7600x or 13600KF?

I game at 4k with a 3070. Not giving Nvidia any money this time.

I just want a bit more consistency and smoothness, I'm not expecting higher frames.

Should I be upgrading?

[EightyDuce]

1 hour ago, McGraw said:

Are either of these CPUs worth buying for a new build today?

Moving from a 4790k with 16gb 2133hz.

Or should I just spend a bit extra and get a 7600x or 13600KF?

I game at 4k with a 3070. Not giving Nvidia any money this time.

I just want a bit more consistency and smoothness, I'm not expecting higher frames.

Should I be upgrading?

Depends on the amount of money you're looking to spend. 

 

While it's EOL, AM4+5800x3d can be had on a very reasonable budget. Another thing to consider, a 13600K which trades blows with 5800X3D in gaming. Both AMD and Intel offerings are dead end sockets with similar performance, honestly can't go wrong with either for gaming. If you're on Win11 and do any productity, I'd say go with 13600k as it spanks in multithreading with e-cores. 

 

Now, if budget isn't an issue, I would wait for 7X00x3D as they should be gaming monsters. That being said, that means a roughly $300-400 motherboard, $400-500 CPU, $200-300 DDR5. Then another $800-1200 GPU. 

[Thinder]

5 hours ago, McGraw said:

I game at 4k with a 3070. Not giving Nvidia any money this time.

You're already below what is required to play at 4K reliably, plus CPU are not the only thing that will get you there at 4K, it would have ben useful to know what motherboard you're using and if it can be fitted with the equivalent of a Ryzen 5, depending on the model, some motherboard supports the upgrade, it's the case for mine despite being the cheapest of the serie but only up to 5600X.

At 4K your CPU will be pushed to its maximum (be under load), so as I pointed out previously, one of the best things to do is to bound a proper RAM kit to it, and it's a B.die kit, a 7500X will clock at Up to 5.3GHz boosted or 4.7GHz non boosted, to this you might substract up to 6.4% or more if you use a non B.die RAM kit because your controller with meets is limitation earlier.

Thats the low option, EightyDuce   gave you a higher option.

If you wonder if I can play DCS at 4K with my rig, yes but with a few options down and not PVP, the limitation there being my GTX 1080Ti which is the bottleneck, my CPU with this RAM can cope with a 3080 and still not be the bootleneck, bootelnecks are what you need to avoid and/or eliminate.

I tested this combo with CPU bench and got those results for a stock CPU running at 3.7GHz/4.6GHz, mine was running at 4.595GHz..

Edited November 4, 2022 by Thinder

[McGraw]

21 hours ago, Thinder said:

You're already below what is required to play at 4K reliably, plus CPU are not the only thing that will get you there at 4K, it would have ben useful to know what motherboard you're using and if it can be fitted with the equivalent of a Ryzen 5, depending on the model, some motherboard supports the upgrade, it's the case for mine despite being the cheapest of the serie but only up to 5600X.

At 4K your CPU will be pushed to its maximum (be under load), so as I pointed out previously, one of the best things to do is to bound a proper RAM kit to it, and it's a B.die kit, a 7500X will clock at Up to 5.3GHz boosted or 4.7GHz non boosted, to this you might substract up to 6.4% or more if you use a non B.die RAM kit because your controller with meets is limitation earlier.

Thats the low option, EightyDuce   gave you a higher option.

If you wonder if I can play DCS at 4K with my rig, yes but with a few options down and not PVP, the limitation there being my GTX 1080Ti which is the bottleneck, my CPU with this RAM can cope with a 3080 and still not be the bootleneck, bootelnecks are what you need to avoid and/or eliminate.

I tested this combo with CPU bench and got those results for a stock CPU running at 3.7GHz/4.6GHz, mine was running at 4.595GHz..

 

Thank you. I did say I was using a 4790k which obviously means I definitely can't upgrade z97 to anything better. 

At this stage I'm mainly thinking of retiring my generally struggling CPU (igp has failed and it runs extremely hot even after a delid I tried to prolong its life) with a view to be able to upgrade my GPU a couple of times without bottlenecking the GPU. I can probably get £50 for the platform while it will works though.

However, if I will see zero benefit from doing so I will probably run it until it dies. I strongly believe my experience will improve somewhat with a platform upgrade though and I can't use this system forever plus I want something to mess around with.

I'm happy with a locked 30fps, I appreciate a 3070 is not really a 4k card but DCS is not pretty enough for its system requirements anyway and I won't overspend for this sim, especially as optimisations could eventually improve things.

Edited November 4, 2022 by McGraw

[McGraw]

On 11/3/2022 at 8:32 PM, EightyDuce said:

Depends on the amount of money you're looking to spend. 

 

While it's EOL, AM4+5800x3d can be had on a very reasonable budget. Another thing to consider, a 13600K which trades blows with 5800X3D in gaming. Both AMD and Intel offerings are dead end sockets with similar performance, honestly can't go wrong with either for gaming. If you're on Win11 and do any productity, I'd say go with 13600k as it spanks in multithreading with e-cores. 

 

Now, if budget isn't an issue, I would wait for 7X00x3D as they should be gaming monsters. That being said, that means a roughly $300-400 motherboard, $400-500 CPU, $200-300 DDR5. Then another $800-1200 GPU. 

Thanks. I'm hoping for max £750 for CPU/mobo/ram. I get more enjoyment from bang for buck even though I could technically spend more if I needed to.

My 4790k is still soldiering on but it would seem a bit silly to get say a 5070 in the future and pair it with this platform so I have to upgrade eventually and my 3070 definitely has life left in it especially as the 40 series seems vastly overpriced like the 20 series (I might consider rdna3 but I like DLSS). I feel like a platform upgrade would improve my minimums etc. Although going gsync display felt like a massive upgrade on its own.

I don't think I'd upgrade a 7600x before a couple of gpu swaps so it seems pointless getting one when the 5800x 3d would be cheaper and could win over time due to the extra cores. I don't do any productivity but psychologically cannot wait 8 years to replace my 4c/8t CPU for a 6c/12t cpu when the 8700k is already something many have upgraded from.

It's hard enough to choose components at the moment if I was buying my first pc from scratch, let alone when I have a working system that I could keep running until the perfect time

[EightyDuce]

10 minutes ago, McGraw said:

Thanks. I'm hoping for max £750 for CPU/mobo/ram. I get more enjoyment from bang for buck even though I could technically spend more if I needed to.

My 4790k is still soldiering on but it would seem a bit silly to get say a 5070 in the future and pair it with this platform so I have to upgrade eventually and my 3070 definitely has life left in it especially as the 40 series seems vastly overpriced like the 20 series (I might consider rdna3 but I like DLSS). I feel like a platform upgrade would improve my minimums etc. Although going gsync display felt like a massive upgrade on its own.

I don't think I'd upgrade a 7600x before a couple of gpu swaps so it seems pointless getting one when the 5800x 3d would be cheaper and could win over time due to the extra cores. I don't do any productivity but psychologically cannot wait 8 years to replace my 4c/8t CPU for a 6c/12t cpu when the 8700k is already something many have upgraded from.

It's hard enough to choose components at the moment if I was buying my first pc from scratch, let alone when I have a working system that I could keep running until the perfect time

Trust me, I get it. I've been kicking a similar can down the road for some time. I was in a 7700k and 1080ti, both on water for close to 5 years. Broke everything down to re-fit a new case once all the new stuff came out. Now my plan, unless 7900XTX turns out to be a bust somehow, is 7700/7800X3D 7900xtx, 32/64 GB DDR5... Then I sit on that for the next 3-4 years. 

The only thing I can think of that would derail the plan is if the new X3D refresh turns out to be meh... Then I'm strongly considering a 13600K with DDR5 +7900XTX.

[EightyDuce]

Interesting read. 

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/rtx-4090-53-games-core-i9-13900k-vs-ryzen-7-5800x3d/3.html

[McGraw]

35 minutes ago, EightyDuce said:

Trust me, I get it. I've been kicking a similar can down the road for some time. I was in a 7700k and 1080ti, both on water for close to 5 years. Broke everything down to re-fit a new case once all the new stuff came out. Now my plan, unless 7900XTX turns out to be a bust somehow, is 7700/7800X3D 7900xtx, 32/64 GB DDR5... Then I sit on that for the next 3-4 years. 

The only thing I can think of that would derail the plan is if the new X3D refresh turns out to be meh... Then I'm strongly considering a 13600K with DDR5 +7900XTX.

Thanks. Why are you looking at a much shorter cycle for your next upgrade?

[EightyDuce]

12 minutes ago, McGraw said:

Thanks. Why are you looking at a much shorter cycle for your next upgrade?

Not set in stone or anything; while the last upgrade lasted me for close to 5 years, it was showing its age by year 4. 

[Thinder]

On 11/4/2022 at 11:50 PM, EightyDuce said:

Not set in stone or anything; while the last upgrade lasted me for close to 5 years, it was showing its age by year 4. 

True, if you're a gamer, it mostly depends on the development of games...

Edited November 6, 2022 by Thinder

[EightyDuce]

Also a good watch:

 

 

[SkateZilla]

5800X3D should also be hitting $300 or less soon

[Thinder]

21 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

5800X3D should also be hitting $300 or less soon

£349.99 today at AWD-IT (UK).

I'm running a 5600X and will upgeade my GPU for an RX 7900 XTX so I'll need a bit more performances to make sure I don't have too much of a CPU bottleneck, but I'm wondering if the difference between the two aa 4K while gaming is worth the price...

[skypickle]

so did you get the 3d chip?