Scott-S6 Posted June 10, 2023 Posted June 10, 2023 (edited) On 6/10/2023 at 2:07 PM, BaronVonVaderham said: I like your arm support solution. Very practical! As for the rake, I unde4rstood (maybe incorrectly) that you can use thrustmaster grips on WW bases, in which case I'm sure there is an adapter that can be used to give you that rake. Not being able to judge one from another, I think I'll get the regular one. If I get an opportunity to try FSSB, then maybe I will change the base. Yes and no - where RS and virpil decided to make their attachment system TM compatible, WW's isn't. They do make a piece so that you can fit a TM grip to their bases so yes, you can sort the angle out by buying their base, their adaptor, a TM compatible grip and a 3rd party component (or their base, the adaptor and an RS grip). Can't do it using their grip with their base though. In contrast RS offer grips with the rake built in and an adaptor piece to provide the correct rake with TM compatible grips. Edited June 12, 2023 by Scott-S6
agamemnon_b5 Posted July 12, 2023 Posted July 12, 2023 On 11/29/2022 at 7:58 AM, crispy12 said: DCS Pitch expo: -5% Roll expo: -2% What is "expo"? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Swiso Posted October 27, 2023 Posted October 27, 2023 (edited) Hello @crispy12 and @Scott-S6, thanks for all these informations. I am thinking about buying a new base and I am undecided which way to go between the basic Orion 2 or the MFSSB version. I would like your thoughts about a couple of questions.. I would use that base mainly for DCS but not only for the Viper module... I also fly the Viggen, A-10, F/A-18 and the Strike Eagle. How suitable would you think it would be for these modules, apart for the Viper ? Speaking of grips... I own the TM Warthog right now, plus the TM F/A-18 Grip. I read somewhere on this forum or in Reddit that 1) if you connect a TM Grip (through the WW conversion kit) you won't be able to set key commands on SimApp software, and 2) someone said that because of the weight of TM grips, they are really not recommended for the Orion 2 base... So, in the end...if I decide to go with the WW Orion 2 base, which one you think is best suited ? Thanks ! Edited October 27, 2023 by Swiso
rob10 Posted October 27, 2023 Posted October 27, 2023 5 hours ago, Swiso said: So, in the end...if I decide to go with the WW Orion 2 base, which one you think is best suited ? Thanks ! I know you're looking at the WinWing base, but have you considered the Virpil WarBRD base? I have the WW throttle and love it, but TBH I found the WW base too "mushy" for lack of a better word vs the Virpil with TM F-18 grip. I had the Virpil 1st and at the time the WW throttle only came bundled with the base/grip so I ended up with it too. Majority of my flying is F-18, although I have dabbled with the F-16.
Swiso Posted October 28, 2023 Posted October 28, 2023 (edited) Yes, looked at Virpil too, at the T50 CM3.... look very well built... why I should go with the WarBRD instead of the T50 CM3? The main thing about going for WW is that in the coming days I will receive the F-15EX Throttle and I am tempted by the MFSSB base. Add the fact that having all the devices from the same brand mean using one software program to set them up would make this work easier. Edited October 28, 2023 by Swiso
Scott-S6 Posted October 28, 2023 Posted October 28, 2023 (edited) 19 hours ago, Swiso said: Hello @crispy12 and @Scott-S6, thanks for all these informations. I am thinking about buying a new base and I am undecided which way to go between the basic Orion 2 or the MFSSB version. I would like your thoughts about a couple of questions.. I would use that base mainly for DCS but not only for the Viper module... I also fly the Viggen, A-10, F/A-18 and the Strike Eagle. How suitable would you think it would be for these modules, apart for the Viper ? Speaking of grips... I own the TM Warthog right now, plus the TM F/A-18 Grip. I read somewhere on this forum or in Reddit that 1) if you connect a TM Grip (through the WW conversion kit) you won't be able to set key commands on SimApp software, and 2) someone said that because of the weight of TM grips, they are really not recommended for the Orion 2 base... So, in the end...if I decide to go with the WW Orion 2 base, which one you think is best suited ? Thanks ! The win wing ffb base is just weird. It's not a correct implementation at all and it just doesn't work well in my opinion. The lack of an angle adaptor is also a major negative. If you want force sensing the realsimulator is the only good one, imo. Edited October 28, 2023 by Scott-S6 1
Scott-S6 Posted October 28, 2023 Posted October 28, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Swiso said: Yes, looked at Virpil too, at the T50 CM3.... look very well built... why I should go with the WarBRD instead of the T50 CM3? The main thing about going for WW is that in the coming days I will receive the F-15EX Throttle and I am tempted by the MFSSB base. Add the fact that having all the devices from the same brand mean using one software program to set them up would make this work easier. The CM3 base doesn't really work for use on top of a desk (too tall, stiff springs, reduced range of motion to use with an extension) so if that's how you're going to use it then get the warbird instead. If you're going to be using a proper mount or putting it into a cockpit then the CM3 is great. (Same with super libra Vs Orion). One app to configure them isn't as big a deal as you'd think, don't let that stop you from getting what you want. A supre libra or CM3 with a low mount and extension plus whatever grip you prefer makes for a solid center stick. I can't comment on warbird versus Orion for use on top of a desk, I haven't had a setup like that since long before those bases were released. Edited October 28, 2023 by Scott-S6 1
Swiso Posted October 28, 2023 Posted October 28, 2023 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Scott-S6 said: The CM3 base doesn't really work for use on top of a desk (too tall, stuff springs, reduced range of motion to use with an extension) so if that's how you're going to use it then get the warbird instead. If you're going to be using a proper mount or putting it into a cockpit then the CM3 is great. One app to configure them isn't as big a deal as you'd think, don't let that stop you from getting what you want. A supre libra or CM3 with a low mount and extension plus whatever grip you prefer makes for a solid center stick. I can't comment on warbird versus Orion for use on top of a desk, I haven't had a setup like that since long before those bases were released. Hey, thanks for your inputs ! I forgot to add that the Warthog HOTAS right now is fixed on Monstertech Table mounts, so the new setup would be fixed on those mounts. Super Libra is EOL, that's why I looked at the new Orion 2....either the MFSSB or basic... Yes, I know Realsimulator, but it's too expensive for my pockets. When you say the MFSSB miss "an angle adaptor" you mean laterally or vertically ? EDIT: I think I know what you mean by angle adapter.... I have found this diagram, so basically the real F-16 stick is angled toward the right for 12 degrees. This could be solved by fixing the base to the table mount with 12 degrees right.... don't think it will be a big deal. Apart from the angle observation, were you able to find the correct settings and which mode was best for you ? Looking for reviews from people that have this stick, the vast majority had problems finding the right spot, but many say that when they found out the correct setting, it is an amazing setup. I'm curious about your experience with this point. Thanks ! Edited October 28, 2023 by Swiso
rob10 Posted October 28, 2023 Posted October 28, 2023 3 hours ago, Scott-S6 said: The CM3 base doesn't really work for use on top of a desk (too tall, stiff springs, reduced range of motion to use with an extension) so if that's how you're going to use it then get the warbird instead. If you're going to be using a proper mount or putting it into a cockpit then the CM3 is great. (Same with super libra Vs Orion). One app to configure them isn't as big a deal as you'd think, don't let that stop you from getting what you want. A supre libra or CM3 with a low mount and extension plus whatever grip you prefer makes for a solid center stick. I can't comment on warbird versus Orion for use on top of a desk, I haven't had a setup like that since long before those bases were released. From what I've read, if you intend to use an extension on your stick CM3 is the way to go, otherwise WarBRD is as good or better option. My WarBRD is on a homemade stand between my legs/in my lap. Never used a CM3 so I can't directly comment on it. Agree with the "don't worry about multiple software" comment. I run a combo of Thrustmaster grip, Virpil base and Wingwing throttle/MFD/UFC. I run the WinWIng software due to the MFD's and to sync the lights on the throttle. I don't think I've run the Virpil software since I set up the base, and basically the same could have been said about the TM software when I had my TM throttle. The only other software I run is AutoHotKey to use the secondary OSB buttons (the extra ones between the real OSB's) as Function keys for Comm's menus. The proviso to this is that I bind all buttons directly in DCS rather than using hardware provider software for binding. 1
Swiso Posted October 28, 2023 Posted October 28, 2023 49 minutes ago, rob10 said: From what I've read, if you intend to use an extension on your stick CM3 is the way to go, otherwise WarBRD is as good or better option. My WarBRD is on a homemade stand between my legs/in my lap. Never used a CM3 so I can't directly comment on it. Agree with the "don't worry about multiple software" comment. I run a combo of Thrustmaster grip, Virpil base and Wingwing throttle/MFD/UFC. I run the WinWIng software due to the MFD's and to sync the lights on the throttle. I don't think I've run the Virpil software since I set up the base, and basically the same could have been said about the TM software when I had my TM throttle. The only other software I run is AutoHotKey to use the secondary OSB buttons (the extra ones between the real OSB's) as Function keys for Comm's menus. The proviso to this is that I bind all buttons directly in DCS rather than using hardware provider software for binding. Hi, no, I don't plan to use any extension...I would mount on Monstertech Table mounts https://www.monster.tech/en/product/joystick-hotas-table-mount/ I will take a closer look at the WarBRD then. Still tempted by the MFSSB base though... Thanks for your input.
Scott-S6 Posted October 29, 2023 Posted October 29, 2023 (edited) On 10/28/2023 at 2:15 PM, Swiso said: Hey, thanks for your inputs ! I forgot to add that the Warthog HOTAS right now is fixed on Monstertech Table mounts, so the new setup would be fixed on those mounts. Super Libra is EOL, that's why I looked at the new Orion 2....either the MFSSB or basic... Yes, I know Realsimulator, but it's too expensive for my pockets. When you say the MFSSB miss "an angle adaptor" you mean laterally or vertically ? EDIT: I think I know what you mean by angle adapter.... I have found this diagram, so basically the real F-16 stick is angled toward the right for 12 degrees. This could be solved by fixing the base to the table mount with 12 degrees right.... don't think it will be a big deal. Apart from the angle observation, were you able to find the correct settings and which mode was best for you ? Looking for reviews from people that have this stick, the vast majority had problems finding the right spot, but many say that when they found out the correct setting, it is an amazing setup. I'm curious about your experience with this point. Thanks ! Yes, rotating the whole assembly including the base forward 12-13 degrees also does the trick. I recommend this for any side stick. I didn't find any mode of the ww force sensing base to be usable. It's fundamentally flawed imo (like they just read a description of how it's supposed to work and didn't understand it). Edited October 29, 2023 by Scott-S6 1
Swiso Posted October 29, 2023 Posted October 29, 2023 (edited) Thanks, Looking at Realsimulator bases i must say they are not that much more expensives than the WW MFSSB Orion 2 base.... mmmh...might have a look.... Edited October 29, 2023 by Swiso
Devil-101 Posted Wednesday at 09:19 PM Posted Wednesday at 09:19 PM On 11/16/2022 at 5:40 PM, crispy12 said: Hello gents, I've decided to make this thread as I needed help finding sufficient information and reviews on this product. I have been playing DCS for many years and have been looking at RealSimulator's FSSB for a while, but the high price tag always put me off. Winwing's price tag definitely attracted me. The Grim Reapers MFSSB video also gave me sufficient input to purchase. The hardware quality is excellent. The metal stick feels good, much better than Virpil SCG and regular MCG. The buttons have a pretty soft feel when pressed. However, they give a definite click when activated, so they are quite easy and predictable. The 2-stage trigger has a lot of travel for the 1st stage, which feels very different to the VKB Gunfighter. The grip is matte and very nice to hold, hefty and gives an impression that it could be used in a real aircraft, unlike the Gunfighter's plastic-injected grips, which feel like toys. The optional add-on hats look very ugly and are of inferior quality - the casing is plastic moulded and does not feel as premium as the stick itself. There is a rubberised plug which covers the hole for the extension. I left the joystick in the stock format as it looks better. An adjustable palm rest requires a change of screw thread - an unusual choice for Winwing but I can see how they went out of their way to make the stick as customisable as possible. The base is good but I didn't really try the gimbal as this is the MFSSB version, so I can't comment on the quality and smoothness compared to my VKB Gunfighter. Dislike the circular connector at the stick base. The pins are fragile and seem like they would be damaged with multiple reconnections, as I was planning on removing the side stick when not in use. I would have preferred thick-pronged connectors or something sturdy like VKB's version. I printed a 3D printed mounting plate which I use to mount on to my aluminum profile sim rig. The holes are the same as Thrustmaster Warthog base so that may be convenient for certain people who already have that mount. Winwing's SimApp software is straightforward yet also confusing to use. The descriptions could be more explicit and it wasn't obvious what each mode actually did. The response does update in real time after changing the setting, so it was easy to adjust the setting and then alt-tab back into the game to see the effect. Overall usage is a mixed response for me. The force-sensing mechanism is very cool; however, flying requires a lot of muscle memory retraining. I struggled with formation flying, and aerial refuelling involves a lot of effort to prevent PIOs. I can imagine how with practice how one oculd be highly proficient with it. Personally, I need a lot more hours to give a good review on usage. The overall packaging, shipping speed, build quality and experience is high. I suggest improvements in the DIN pin design for more durability, cleaning up and optimising the SimApp software for user-friendliness. Great job, Winwing I used the Winwing Orion 2 MFSSB as part of the F16EX kit; since purchased in 2023, SimApp Pro has consistently displayed unstable pressure readings that spike without touching the stick. I saw this thread, and I'm asking everyone here if you have any ideas about the cause.
Recommended Posts