Can I order a printed manual?

[CE_Mikemonster]

I remember doing this with M1 Tank Platoon lol, that taught me a lesson or two!

[Sunjah]

What is really sad is that the game doesn't come with a manual. A *.pdf file does not work, especially when you want to check out how to do something in the middle of the game...nothing beats having that manual at your side. I ended up having mine printed and bound, probably $50 when all was done.

 

So to have a true flight simulator you have to pay $100. Shame that the people who make such an incredible sim would not supply the manual.

[glottis]

So to have a true flight simulator you have to pay $100. Shame that the people who make such an incredible sim would not supply the manual.

 

They are going to provide it...soon apparently. Unless you meant that it should come with the game for free? In that case, they'd probably have to raise the cost of the product to around $100 anyway, just to make a profit...

[mR.Waffles]

Do we have a date that it will be provided by?

[glottis]

Do we have a date that it will be provided by?

 

Not exactly, I think the implication has been "some time around the time of the retail launch" which I think is March.

[Sinner6]

What is really sad is that the game doesn't come with a manual. A *.pdf file does not work, especially when you want to check out how to do something in the middle of the game...nothing beats having that manual at your side. I ended up having mine printed and bound, probably $50 when all was done.

 

So to have a true flight simulator you have to pay $100. Shame that the people who make such an incredible sim would not supply the manual.

 

Did you find an actual boxed version of BS?

 

I bought BS as a download and it had the only possible kind of manual...PDF. How else can you get the manual of a downloded program?

[nightlynx]

they'd probably have to raise the cost of the product to around $100 anyway, just to make a profit...

 

I know its not the 90's anymore but whenever you bought a Janes sim it came with a kick ass manual and it for sure didn't cost $100

[glottis]

I know its not the 90's anymore but whenever you bought a Janes sim it came with a kick ass manual and it for sure didn't cost $100

 

True enough - I remember that too. I guess maybe retail outlets are greedier now? Or maybe the publishers of the old games were just prepared to make less money than those that made FPS games with tiny manuals...

 

These days even strategy games come with a small quickstart manual and the main bulk in PDF form. This seems like a shame, but if you think about it a PC game has been static at around £30/$50 for the last 10 years - what with inflation, something has to give.

 

Although it's of course just opinion - I think that the current setup with Black Shark is great value for money. Plus, some people are perfectly happy with PDF manuals (run on a laptop or whatever alongside their sim PC) and wouldn't want to pay extra so everyone could get printed documentation.

[slug88]

True enough - I remember that too. I guess maybe retail outlets are greedier now? Or maybe the publishers of the old games were just prepared to make less money than those that made FPS games with tiny manuals...

 

These days even strategy games come with a small quickstart manual and the main bulk in PDF form. This seems like a shame, but if you think about it a PC game has been static at around £30/$50 for the last 10 years - what with inflation, something has to give.

 

Another major consideration is that the games of today, as complex as they are, cost far more to develop than those of the 90's. It's standard today for major titles to have development budgets in the tens of millions, something that was almost unfathomable just a decade ago. Despite this, game prices have remained relatively fixed. In fact, for this reason we're probably getting more value for our money today than we did back then, despite the lack of beefy manuals.

[Murphyd]

Another major consideration is that the games of today, as complex as they are, cost far more to develop than those of the 90's. It's standard today for major titles to have development budgets in the tens of millions, something that was almost unfathomable just a decade ago. Despite this, game prices have remained relatively fixed. In fact, for this reason we're probably getting more value for our money today than we did back then, despite the lack of beefy manuals.

 

I'm neither a games publisher nor an "Interactive Entertainment" analyst but I'd be happy to put forward the suggestion that whilst production costs have no doubt increased so too has the potential market and therefore the average unit sales for successful titles. I'm also a bit unsure about your assertion that prices have remained static in the last ~20 years.

 

--

Murphy

[RapidllBlade]

I know its not the 90's anymore but whenever you bought a Janes sim it came with a kick ass manual and it for sure didn't cost $100

 

If I remember correcty wasn't Apache or whatever it was $80 when it came out? That was a ton of money back then.

 

RB

[EtherealN]

Well, a tidbit I dug up a few years back (3-4) while working with games journalism is the somewhat alarming fact that only about 10% of games released manage to do more than break even. Many truly superb titles were allowed to reach that level of perfection simply because they had massive budgets (and of course skilled people to utilize said budgets), but that requires that they also manage to seduce an equally massive audience.

 

A game as niched as this, I am quite satisfied with a lack of physical paraphernalia even in a boxed product. It means less financial risk for ED, which means less risk that they fail to produce more of these games due to running out of money.

 

Also, do remember that on a boxed product a very miniscule amount of the money reaches the actual developer UNLESS they do like ED and self-publish, something that in itself is also a risk - though one with potentially massive rewards. (In fact, in my native sweden the one agent that gets the most money from a ~50 dollar sale is the State at a minimum of 20% of the total price thanks to the 25% sales tax. From memory the second in line is the publisher and then the importer or in the case of consoles the console manufacturer, then the retailer and then the developer...)

 

The advantage in the old days though, for the developer, was the fact that it was usually the publisher that took the financial risks in the packaging and paraphernalia, and many studios like Digital Illusions (while they were still independent) secured themselves through deals with the publisher where they got a smaller percentage in royalties but had a secured minimum pay roughly mirroring the development cost. Those days are pretty much gone though, since most publishers end up buying the developers they want and the independents more and more looking to self-publish - like ED.

 

If the pricetag on a printed manual is sane, I'll definitely buy it. I've already spent the money on a TrackIR specifically for use with this game and is thinking about a HOTAS rig as well, so the manual will be comparatively cheap. :P

[Guest]

I know its not the 90's anymore but whenever you bought a Janes sim it came with a kick ass manual and it for sure didn't cost $100

 

Four points:

 

1) Due to inflation, $60 in 1996 translates to about $80 today, so that is half of the difference right there.

 

2) Most importantly, Janes Combat Simulations is gone. Similarly, Microprose is gone. Regardless of what they did or did not do in the 90's, they obviously did not make enough of a profit to survive. If they have to charge more/not include a manual to stay in business to keep producing high quality sims, more power to them.

 

3) This is a nice free market economy. If someone thinks Black Shark is too expensive they are free to spend their money on a cheaper competing product. What is that you say, there is no competing product? Well, now you know why they can charge more.:smilewink:

 

4) Similarly, note that Steel Beasts Pro PE, a hardcore tank sim, charges $125 for the game. IMHO Black Shark is an absolute bargain.

[Vapour]

It's a real shame the manual wont be out for a bit, it will suit all those buying the DVD version of the game as it will be all new to them, but I've had this game for so long now I feel i'll give it a miss.

[deviletk]

Well it must be better to actually have the sim on your HD than the other way around.

 

I cant buy with CC atm so i have a PDF manual but not the sim. Sitting here seeing all of you flying i can assure you is a bigger pain than the other way around.

[HansRoaming]

I'd like to buy a manual as I did for Lockon as it can be used to read up whilst on the train to work or sitting with the gf while watching tv.

 

Computer time is flying time and not manual reading time for me. :)

[deviletk]

You have to look away from the screen with a printed manual as well mate. ;) So looking on a second monitor/laptop for manual isnt too bad. Also PDF have a super nice search function so you find what you need fast. Hard if you dont have a free screen though ofcourse.

 

But hey, i like printed manuals too. And would like that over a PDF anyday. Just saying though, it aint too bad until we get a printed version. :)

[glottis]

Pure conjecture, but I'm hoping that once they secure a good printing deal, it'll also make it easier/faster to churn out manuals for future DCS modules/aircraft...

[rapid]

Just found a bigger binder at work instead of using three. It seems to hold the two manuals and some othere data that I have downloaded quick nicely.

[Coolhnd1]

I'm neither a games publisher nor an "Interactive Entertainment" analyst but I'd be happy to put forward the suggestion that whilst production costs have no doubt increased so too has the potential market and therefore the average unit sales for successful titles. I'm also a bit unsure about your assertion that prices have remained static in the last ~20 years.

 

--

Murphy

 

Actually I'd say the market for PC games has shrunk quite a bit. Most people these days game on their PS3 or XBOX or Wii. Also you have to remember that the hard core flight sim market is a niche market to begin with anyway. I'm more than happy to pay for the game and manual seperately as long as we can continue to get games with the quality of Black Shark.

[LIONPRIDE]

I'd like to buy a manual as I did for Lockon as it can be used to read up whilst on the train to work or sitting with the gf while watching tv.

 

Computer time is flying time and not manual reading time for me. :)

 

 

... that being said ... I'd be mortified if they write "Game Manual" on the cover for everyone to see on the train. THIS IS NO GAME !!!! ... :joystick:

 

I've printed it out for use in a 4-inch binder. It's huge but it gets the job done while we wait.

 

 

.

[RapidllBlade]

Laser printer at Newegg.ca (for anyone from Canada or the States). $136.00 INCLUDES shipping.

 

http://www.newegg.ca/Special/ShellShocker.aspx

 

RB

Edited February 17, 2009 by RapidllBlade