Mirage F1 Sidewinder lock

[SuperKermit]

A bit late to the party, but does the 530 IR uncage? Couldn’t find anything in Chuck‘s manual. 

[kontiuka]

5 hours ago, SuperKermit said:

A bit late to the party, but does the 530 IR uncage? Couldn’t find anything in Chuck‘s manual. 

I'm too lazy to check but I think it is always uncaged.  The Aim-9s are caged and can be uncaged with the 300-600m gun range button.

[RyanR]

Cage and uncage has confused me for some time, as the manual and Chuck's guide don't go into it. What is the order of operations with the F-1. With the F-1, do you get tone and then uncage (as with the F-5)?.... or uncage first? Do different IR missiles work differently? Magic II seems to find things "automatically".  

-Ryan

[kontiuka]

1 hour ago, RyanR said:

Cage and uncage has confused me for some time, as the manual and Chuck's guide don't go into it. What is the order of operations with the F-1. With the F-1, do you get tone and then uncage (as with the F-5)?.... or uncage first? Do different IR missiles work differently? Magic II seems to find things "automatically".  

-Ryan

ya, the Magic isn't caged.  As for the sidewinder, I can't remember.  would be pretty easy to test.  just put a cargo plane in front of you, place it in the centre of the HUD so that it isn't locked and then uncage the sidewinder to see if it locks it.

[SuperKermit]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb kontiuka:

just put a cargo plane in front of you, place it in the centre of the HUD so that it isn't locked and then uncage the sidewinder to see if it locks it.

Uncage and SEAM is not the same thing though. I.e. as I understand you have to lock first, then uncage. In planes without SEAM (like the F-1?) an un-locked and un-caged seeker just floats randomly around IMHO. 

Edited August 3 by SuperKermit

[kontiuka]

1 hour ago, SuperKermit said:

Uncage and SEAM is not the same thing though. I.e. as I understand you have to lock first, then uncage. In planes without SEAM (like the F-1?) an un-locked and un-caged seeker just floats randomly around IMHO. 

Yes, I assume that to.  That the seeker head, when uncaged, just floats around until it finds something.  But we'd have to test it.

[Bremspropeller]

Hitting the cage button prematurely can actually help locking up a little sooner as you don't have to fly the boresight onto the bogey first. I usually hit the button when the other guy's sitting on top of the HUD glass. ('ish...)

Results may vary.

[RyanR]

On 8/3/2025 at 10:50 AM, kontiuka said:

ya, the Magic isn't caged.  As for the sidewinder, I can't remember.  would be pretty easy to test.  just put a cargo plane in front of you, place it in the centre of the HUD so that it isn't locked and then uncage the sidewinder to see if it locks it.

 

Great idea!

I did just this. I guess the question is if the "cage" button does the same thing for all Sidewinders. With the 9J, the seeker is uncaged only once you get a tone and only while the button is pressed. Release the button when the target is off bore, and you lose tone. This is just like the F-5.... which makes sense, since it's the same missile.

Magic II seems to look at what the radar grabs. 

-Ryan

[Bremspropeller]

Have you tried the JULIs yet? As they have the Lima seekers, it might also SEAM. Never tried it TBH.

[kontiuka]

5 hours ago, RyanR said:

 

Great idea!

Thanks for testing!

[RyanR]

One age old DCS question: Does the P5 beat the JULI? (We have the P5 for the F-1?.... I can't remember).

-Ryan 

 

Edited August 5 by RyanR

[SuperKermit]

I am a bit confused by the functionality of the 300-600m gun range button with the different IR missiles.

What I (think I have) learned:

• AIM-9B: no function
• AIM-9P, J: uncage (once a lock-on is achieved), only as long as the button is pressed
• AIM-9JULI: SEAM?
• R.550: boresight mode with reduced 5° FOV (from 20°) as long as the button is pressed
• R.530F IR: no clue. What does it do?

Is that correct? Could anybody please elaborate on the 530F IR?

[Harlikwin]

3 hours ago, SuperKermit said:

I am a bit confused by the functionality of the 300-600m gun range button with the different IR missiles.

What I (think I have) learned:

• AIM-9B: no function
• AIM-9P, J: uncage (once a lock-on is achieved), only as long as the button is pressed
• AIM-9JULI: SEAM?
• R.550: boresight mode with reduced 5° FOV (from 20°) as long as the button is pressed
• R.530F IR: no clue. What does it do?

Is that correct? Could anybody please elaborate on the 530F IR?

Its correct for the 9B, it can't uncage. 9P/J can uncage once locked (others too) IDK on JULI, maybe thats right. Correct for the 550. I don't think the 530F had anything like uncage, it was a really primitive missile.