Bombs will not release

[Dustbag1969]

I have recently returned to the harrier after a break of several month's.

I don't know if something has changed or I am doing something wrong but no matter what I do LGBs will not release. I get the release Que and everything looks ok but when the release bar passes through the fpm nothing happens.

I have watched every video I can find and everything looks ok but I still cannot get bombs to release.

Any ideas much appreciated.

Thanks,

Dustbag

[razo+r]

Get us a track. It seems you are missing something. 

[Dustbag1969]

Hi,

I loaded 4 bombs and created a random target point on the map and then assigned it to T1 then designated this as my target.
Everything seemed OK but when I got to the release point nothing happens even though I have held bomb release button for several seconds.

Hopefully you can see some reason why the bombs arent dropping in the attached track.

Thanks for your help

Dusty

lgb fail.trk

[gulredrel]

For me, the track didn't played well. You had no TGP attached, just 4 GBU16.

There was a TGT designated on the EHSD, but when replaying you were flying in a different direction and I saw no drop indication, just the arrow pointing to the rear left.

Have you studied Chuck's Guide for the AV-8B?

https://assets.chucksguides.com/pdf/DCS AV-8B Harrier Guide.pdf

I didn't get if you did this WP increment button long press to transfer the coordinates into this designation target 0.

I took control, set a point with the DMT and the TDC depress and with WP incr. long designated that as T0 and was able to CCRP drop on this point (of course without laser guidance, the bomb just fell like a dumb bomb in CCRP somewhere near the designated point).

[Dustbag1969]

Hi, I didn't have a TGP because I thought I could demonstrate the problem without it. I have read Chucks guide on LGB but it doesn't seem to mention anything about long press on WP increment o designate T0. Can you only drop bombs on T0 and not T1, T2 etc....

Thanks

Dusty

[gulredrel]

As of my understanding it must be this T0 coordinates and designated target for every CCRP release.

T1...T4... and such target points only work for pre-planned JDAM attacks. Even JDAM TOO mode needs this T0 as designation.

From  Chuck's Guide page 420 "Targetpoints":

Targetpoints are navigation points on which weapons can be employed . “T 0 ” corresponds to the System Designation and gets replaced/updated each time a new designation is made . “T 1 ” to “T 9 ” are targeting points that are used for multi -target drops with JDAMs . Take note Target Point T 0 is updated and memorized every time you press the Air -to -Ground Bomb Pickle Button and release a bomb in CCIP . This functionality is quite useful if you need to perform subsequent passes on a single target.

Edited January 18, 2024 by gulredrel
added targetpoint info from chuck's guide

[Dustbag1969]

Thank you for that explanation and that makes sense.

I will try again tonight using target T0 and hopefully the bombs will release. 

So if I have a waypoint and I select DESG on the EHSD to designate this waypoint and then press and hold WP increment for >0.8 seconds to set as T0 I should then be able complete a CCRP release?

 

[gulredrel]

I just checked in a simple mission.

Harrier, some waypoints, no TGP, 2xMk81, 2xGBU16, 2xMk83.

WP2 set as steer point, EHSD press OSB DESG and than WP increment long made the T0 and I was able to drop CCRP the Mk81s on this point (had to cycle release mode to get drop symbology).

WP3 set as steer point, EHSD press OSB DESG and without increment long this steer point was the designation to drop the GBU16 in CCRP on this point (they fell long without laser designation).

Third drop with Mk83s, this time selected WP3, DESG on EHSD and WP increment long again to get T0. CCRP drop near target.

With NWS / undesignate you can get rid of the designated target point and only have the normal waypoint steering information in the HUD and not the arrow pointing to T0, which you can see in the gun runs. First gun run created new T0.

20240118_AV8B_DESG_STP_WP_as_T0.trk

[Dustbag1969]

Thanks Gulredrel for taking your time to try and help me but despite many attempts I cannot get it to work.

I loaded one of the Instant action missions and selected WP2 as steer point. Selected DESG on EHSD and then held WP increment to set it as T0.
I got the bomb release line and followed it and when the drop line appeared I held the bomb released button until it passed the FPM and nothing happened. I tried it again about 4 times and each time nothing happened. On the 5th attempt the bomb dropped but I have no idea what I did differently this time. I turned back in and tried again but the bomb didnt release.
I finally gave up and loaded up the F16 which works fine for me.

Because I got the bomb to drop once it is obviously something I am doing wrong but I have no idea what.

What is strange is when I used to fly the harrier 9 months ago I didnt have a problem with CCRP bombing.

I will give it a break and try again in a few days as it was getting me very frustrated as I love the Harrier

 

[gulredrel]

Something is a bit weird. Had a different flight and needed to cycle the drop mode selector before getting the BFL, despite the selector was in AUT and HUD showed GAUT.

As RAZBAM said on discord, they will eventually do more updates. Mirage also got a bunch of upgrades. I guess, we need to be patient.

[Dustbag1969]

I watched your trak and then replicated it myself the only thing being for me the bombs did not release.
The only difference I could see is that on the run in to the target on your trak on the EHSD it said DESG STP while on my attemtp it said DESG TGT

Dont know if this is relevant but it was the only difference I could see.

 

[gulredrel]

7 hours ago, Dustbag1969 said:

EHSD it said DESG STP while on my attemtp it said DESG TGT

Yeah, on later tries both worked for me. So that should not be the problem.

As said above, I sometimes encountered the problem that I needed to recycle the release mode to get right symbology and could release. Hopefully Harrier will get an overhaul including the drop modes. There are also other things not quite right.

[pantheruler]

I have the same problem. I get all the correct symbology, the release bar dropped and nothing happened, most of the time. I have successfully release ordnance while the EHSD said either DESG STP or DESG TGT. I cannot understand what is going on. On my first attempt the bomb dropped without issue but when I pressed WP increment the second did not drop.

[whiteladder]

I'm also having this problem, with dumb bombs this seems to happen. 

If I sensor select down twice, place the flight path on the ground,  tdc depress to create a target point it will drop the bomb in auto mode.

If however I use tdc slew after the initial placement to refine the aim point it will not drop not matter if I press the tdc depress or long hold wp increment.  Also if I try to undesignate with the Nws the dmt box randomly jumps around the Hud and not back to the flight path marker.

[KFP_CHIMKIN]

On 1/22/2024 at 12:15 AM, Dustbag1969 said:

I watched your trak and then replicated it myself the only thing being for me the bombs did not release.
The only difference I could see is that on the run in to the target on your trak on the EHSD it said DESG STP while on my attemtp it said DESG TGT

Dont know if this is relevant but it was the only difference I could see.

 

Hello Dustbag1969

Did you ever get to the bottom of this issue or is it still a problem for you?

I'm relatively new to DCS and I'm having problems with bombs on the Harrier not leaving the rail even though I appear to have done everything correct.
This is ruining my enjoyment of the sim as the very first mission in the very first campaign that I bought involves dropping laser guided bombs on a target and every time I attempt it I just end up flying past with the bombs still attached to my wings! Everything looks ok but nothing happens. I have tried selecting and deselecting the special option for 'easy mode tdc' but as I'm lasing the target anyway I can't see how that would make a difference... It didn't anyway.

I have seen that there's an issue with this particular module's developer apparently abandoning DCS and therefore it isn't likely that there will be any updated documentation and many of the training missions are broken. It looks like I picked the wrong module to invest my hopes into...

Or maybe I'm wrong and it all works perfectly now and I'm just missing something stupid?

Can you let me know how things worked out for you, please?

Thanks in advance... 

[razo+r]

7 hours ago, KFP_CHIMKIN said:

Hello Dustbag1969

Did you ever get to the bottom of this issue or is it still a problem for you?

I'm relatively new to DCS and I'm having problems with bombs on the Harrier not leaving the rail even though I appear to have done everything correct.
This is ruining my enjoyment of the sim as the very first mission in the very first campaign that I bought involves dropping laser guided bombs on a target and every time I attempt it I just end up flying past with the bombs still attached to my wings! Everything looks ok but nothing happens. I have tried selecting and deselecting the special option for 'easy mode tdc' but as I'm lasing the target anyway I can't see how that would make a difference... It didn't anyway.

I have seen that there's an issue with this particular module's developer apparently abandoning DCS and therefore it isn't likely that there will be any updated documentation and many of the training missions are broken. It looks like I picked the wrong module to invest my hopes into...

Or maybe I'm wrong and it all works perfectly now and I'm just missing something stupid?

Can you let me know how things worked out for you, please?

Thanks in advance... 

Can you upload a short track? Otherwise it is impossible to tell what you might have done wrong.

[Recluse]

Just tried it. Worked fine. Didn't have to designate T0 at all (with WINC LONG), I did a DESG on a Waypoint to slave the pod, then moved the pod to the target and Designated with TDC depress (TPOD DES).

Dropped GBU-12, lased, Hit. Make sure you set the FUZE to something other than SAFE.

 

AV8BGBU.trk

Edited October 21, 2024 by Recluse

[Dustbag1969]

Hi KFP_Chimkin,

It has been a while since I have flown the Harrier but I did find a way to get the weapons to release. From what I can remember the issue for me was related to the Auto Flaps setting. Because I wasn't very good I would usually approach the target as slowly as possible to give myself as much time as possible to do everything I needed to do. Unfortunately because I was travelling so slowly the flaps were deploying to keep me airborne. I don't know 100% but I think weapons cannot be released if flaps are down. I found that if I set my flaps to cruise mode and then attempted a bomb run it worked for me. I hope this helps as the Harrier is a fantastic module to fly.

Good luck

 

[Recluse]

@Dustbag1969 Good point!  Also if the nozzles are forward by more than a certain amount (I want to say 30% but that could be wrong) you cannot release ordnance either.

[KFP_CHIMKIN]

On 10/22/2024 at 10:30 PM, Dustbag1969 said:

Hi KFP_Chimkin,

It has been a while since I have flown the Harrier but I did find a way to get the weapons to release. From what I can remember the issue for me was related to the Auto Flaps setting. Because I wasn't very good I would usually approach the target as slowly as possible to give myself as much time as possible to do everything I needed to do. Unfortunately because I was travelling so slowly the flaps were deploying to keep me airborne. I don't know 100% but I think weapons cannot be released if flaps are down. I found that if I set my flaps to cruise mode and then attempted a bomb run it worked for me. I hope this helps as the Harrier is a fantastic module to fly.

Good luck

 

Sorry it has been a while since I checked in...

I got round my problem (rather than resolving it) by simply switching to DSL mode once I was a few seconds away from the release point and then counting down to 'pickle' in my head. Bombs dropped and tracked fine. Thanks for the reply and advice all the same.