Can we get an "Experimental" clone?

[PhantomHans]

I remember reading a thread somewhere in here about R-27ER/ET/P/EP/EA/EM and R-77 for the full feature MiG-29 and the general consensus being that it wouldn't get them.

That's accurate and that's fine.

But at least for the time being, can we perhaps get a second one labeled as "Experimental" or something like that to allow access to those type of inaccurate or questionable weapons?  That way servers can simply exclude the entire A/C that may have inappropriate features, but in SP we'll have the option to include hypothetical upgrade models of the 29 in missions. 

[AeriaGloria]

I would say to definitely expect ER/ET. EP/EA are the “experimental” ones. Don’t even know difference between EM and EA. If an ARH one exists somewhere, it’s an EA I bet 

[PhantomHans]

2 hours ago, AeriaGloria said:

I would say to definitely expect ER/ET. EP/EA are the “experimental” ones. Don’t even know difference between EM and EA. If an ARH one exists somewhere, it’s an EA I bet 

Way back in rue days of LOMAC, EM was an ER with more range.  EA was an ER wirh R77 seeker head.

IMHO while the regular 29 shouldn't get things that are rumors or it can't actually use (As a 9.12A, I think somebody said only 10 got the R-77 launching upgrade), I think perhaps having a separate aircraft that can use them would be good for balance on some servers against modern NATO aircraft even if nothing else is changed.

 

This may also include guided AG weapons not normally carried by a 9.12 model.

[AeriaGloria]

1 hour ago, PhantomHans said:

Way back in rue days of LOMAC, EM was an ER with more range.  EA was an ER wirh R77 seeker head.

IMHO while the regular 29 shouldn't get things that are rumors or it can't actually use (As a 9.12A, I think somebody said only 10 got the R-77 launching upgrade), I think perhaps having a separate aircraft that can use them would be good for balance on some servers against modern NATO aircraft even if nothing else is changed.

 

This may also include guided AG weapons not normally carried by a 9.12 model.

I would personally prefer a 9.12S/9.13S add-on. Make a pure 9.13 and call it Aerges level 3 plane add on 

[draconus]

On 5/25/2024 at 6:58 PM, PhantomHans said:

But at least for the time being, can we perhaps get a second one labeled as "Experimental" or something like that to allow access to those type of inaccurate or questionable weapons?

Sure: https://forum.dcs.world/forum/69-dcs-modding/

[PhantomHans]

On 5/25/2024 at 4:18 PM, AeriaGloria said:

I would personally prefer a 9.12S/9.13S add-on. Make a pure 9.13 and call it Aerges level 3 plane add on 

I'd love to get that, but somehow I feel like getting a 9.12S or 9.13S is going to be a lot more difficult.

 

In the meantime offering some of the capabilities of the FC3 9.12S in the otherwise 9.12A module might at least mean people can fly the full featured one with newer missiles.  Provided that it's a totally separate AC so it can be excluded where desired.  Would also be a good home for things like AGM-88 or GPS bombs on MiG-29s like we've seen recently.   Stuff that you can't really model accurately right now.  Make it a bonus module, heck maybe even make it available offline only.

Perhaps it's too 'fudgy' for all the purists who don't want their AirQuake infected by anything less than 100% realism, like making educated guesses about how an R-27EP or AGM-88 on a MiG works.

Edited May 28, 2024 by PhantomHans

[Dragon1-1]

AGM-88 could work on the MiG in only one way, I think: no interaction with the aircraft at all. The MiG would see it as a dumb store (probably complete with displaying symbology for something else), and upon launch, it'd fly according to a preprogrammed profile. That's how GPS guided bombs likely work on the MiG-29A, too. No indications, no in-cockpit coordinate setting, just program on the ground and eyeball the parameters for release. As for an R-27ER, it works just like the R-27R. The only difference between those two is the motor.

[PhantomHans]

5 hours ago, Dragon1-1 said:

AGM-88 could work on the MiG in only one way, I think: no interaction with the aircraft at all. The MiG would see it as a dumb store (probably complete with displaying symbology for something else), and upon launch, it'd fly according to a preprogrammed profile. That's how GPS guided bombs likely work on the MiG-29A, too. No indications, no in-cockpit coordinate setting, just program on the ground and eyeball the parameters for release. As for an R-27ER, it works just like the R-27R. The only difference between those two is the motor.

You're probably right on the money.

My point, though, was that while I'd love to see these things added I'd like to see it added to an alternative aircraft in the list, so that a server who only wanted to allow a "factory pure" MiG-29 could simply add the normal ones,  where a server or mission maker who was OK with players running around launching JDAMs, HARMs, and R77s could add the aircraft marked "MiG-29A 9.12 (Experimental)" and have access to all the weird and unusual weapons.

[AeriaGloria]

4 hours ago, PhantomHans said:

You're probably right on the money.

My point, though, was that while I'd love to see these things added I'd like to see it added to an alternative aircraft in the list, so that a server who only wanted to allow a "factory pure" MiG-29 could simply add the normal ones,  where a server or mission maker who was OK with players running around launching JDAMs, HARMs, and R77s could add the aircraft marked "MiG-29A 9.12 (Experimental)" and have access to all the weird and unusual weapons.

You can with FC3 MiG-29 and Su-27/33 right now. Change CSID of one weapon you don’t need much (say FAB-100, RBK, R-27T), to another weapon. Then one it’s spawned with that loadout or weapon chosen, the new weapon is chosen. I believe some servers already do this for HARM. GS server already does it to add PL-12/SD-10/PL-8 to J-11A