Beating MiG-29 with F-4

[Civetta_ITA]

Hi everyone — I’ve been trying to settle a question that’s been bugging me in DCS: is it realistically possible to beat a MiG-29 in a dogfight flying an F-4 (in a head on merge)?

I’ve been using one of the preset F-4 vs MiG-29 missions included in the F-4 package and every time I get into a visual dogfight with a MiG-29 I end up getting out-turned or killed despite trying my best. 

I’m not trying to argue realism here — I know the Phantom is an older airframe — but I’d like to know if anyone has reliable tactics that make an F-4 competitive in a pure dogfight.

I try to keep my energy and avoid sustained turning fights but the MiG usually manages to force a turning engagement or get behind me quickly after the initial pass. 

Thanks in advance.

[Hiob]

"It's not the plane, it's the pilot!" (Rooster)

I'd rather sit in the Fulcrum though, if I had to choose....

[Smokin1469]

Unless the Fulcrum pilot makes a major mistake, your chances of beating a Fulcrum in a visual fight (while flying an F-4) are almost nil.  Fulcrum has significant advantages in turn rate and radius, thrust to weight, and weapons.  I know a pilot who's flown both the Fulcrum and Viper and he says the Fulcrum is very hard to beat in a visual fight, even against the F-16.  

[TheBiggerBass]

I guess the F-4 would just be prey for a MiG-29. The F-16 as a 4th gen aircraft too and F-4 successor will have an equal chance

Edited Thursday at 08:58 PM by TheBiggerBass

[Civetta_ITA]

Thanks for your replies...now I feel less incompetent eh eh

[Istari6]

It's a generational leap, and the Fulcrum wasn't just 4th generation, it was perhaps the best pure WVR dogfighter of the 4th generation.  The Phantom was 3rd generation, and it wasn't even particularly good at WVR dogfighting in the 3rd generation - see MiG-21 for a better 3rd gen dogfighter.  So it's not just 3rd gen vs 4th gen, it's "average" 3rd gen dogfighter versus the "best of the best" 4th gen dogfighter.  That's a big leap in technological quality, and unless the other pilot makes major mistakes, you're likely doomed.  

[Raven (Elysian Angel)]

I managed to beat a MiG-29 once in a dogfight. The other times, I got my behind handed back to me

[Mud]

4 minutes ago, Raven (Elysian Angel) said:

I managed to beat a MiG-29 once in a dogfight. The other times, I got my behind handed back to me

Let me fly that MIG-29 and you'll win every time. I promise!

[Raven (Elysian Angel)]

3 minutes ago, Mud said:

Let me fly that MIG-29 and you'll win every time. I promise!

It’s a date!