ED's "Unannounced Project"

[Krippz]

I have mixed feeling on the upcoming Flaming Cliffs update. I'm a hardcore player; never muched cared for LOMAC because of it's "survey sim status" and is why I fly exclusively Black Shark, Falcon 4.0 Allied Force and X-Plane 9. On the one hand I know that ED has to make money and this revision to Flaming Cliffs would put more money in their pockets but on the other I would rather ED focus exclusively on the DCS modules....

[EtherealN]

Well, you can look at it this way - more money possibly equals more staff which means better resources for the DCS modules. :)

[Krippz]

Haha I agree but I just feel that ED should find an identity (survey sim, or high fidelity sim developer) and stick to it.

[Glowing_Amraam]

DCS is the step forward. FC 2 will most likely be the last patch/update/end of the lockon franchise.

 

Wether or not FC 2 will be online compatible with future DCS modules is not known yet (Not counting Black Shark ofc).

[GGTharos]

ED can do both perfectly fine. What's the problem?

 

FYI, hardcore button pushing is nice, but I've seen falcon jockeys play even less realistically than we normally play on HL servers so ... the whole survey v hifi sim is pretty moot IMHO.

 

As long as the 'survey sim' can convey the correct atmosphere of combat, the rest is dressing. No, I'm not going to argue that FC/FC2 conveys it better than falcon - just addressing the whole 'survey sim v hifi sim' silliness.

 

Haha I agree but I just feel that ED should find an identity (survey sim, or high fidelity sim developer) and stick to it.

[EtherealN]

Yeah, the whole concept of "realism" is multi-faceted.

 

I suck massively at BVR combat, so I don't care how realistic of a simulator I have - until I've had a lot more practice my contribution to a fight online will not be "realistic". Most people would wonder who the hell transferred me from props and whether that commander still has a job. :D

 

It's the same thing with most simulators - especially if we are talking about combat simulators. Take IL-2 for example - it's flight models are rudimentary at best, and simulating the components of the aircraft is a bit of an "eh what?". But get 16 well practiced people up there in a multiplayer match and you can have a very realistic combat. (My wet dream is a game like IL2 that supports several hundred people on the same server - to simulate stuff like the raids on britain with human bomber pilots and somewhat correct numbers of aircraft, and preferably human intercept controllers. Such a thing wouldn't have to be massively detailed in it's simulation to still be a good combat simulation.)

 

It all goes into what the objective of the product is. Many military simulators are way less realistic in it's flight models than even LockOn - because their objective is to be a procedure trainer, so they've focused on training the pilot to handle the cockpit.

 

Hell, way way back the US Army even had a custom version of Doom on trial for training. Didn't really matter that much that realism was out the window - the point was to give some easy practice for infantrymen in supporting each other.

 

Lastly though, there is also the question of whether ED can survive as solely a "high fidelity sim developer". I think they can, but I don't know for sure. Survey sims cater to a broader market and can bring in money that can be used on multiple projects that give synergies to both types of product in the same way that they currently have synergies between the commercial and military markets that they are catering to.

Edited December 12, 2009 by EtherealN

[RedTiger]

I like to think of it in terms of a sports sim. A sim can simulate the pre-game talk from the coach, the breaks sitting on the side drinking gatorade, and the interview with the reporters after the game when you win. It can simulate the correct way to tie your shoes and exactly where you should place your fingers on the ball when you throw it. The sim can even simulate a dynamic career for your in-game avatar player/coach that changes based on your and your team's performance. However, what matters is how the actual sport-playing is simulated. Can you use real-life plays with your team vs. the the other team using real-life restraints? Will using these produce a realistic, reasonable outcome?

 

I will go one step further and say that I'd argue that everything but the sport-playing is indeed dressing and is, in fact, more intended for entertainment value than anything "hardcore". Hey, don't get me wrong, entertainment is why I'm here, it's pretty much the reason I get up in the morning. :D

 

However, everything but the sport-playing is there to provide an experience for the player, for immersion's sake. I just don't like to confuse immersion like this too much with realism because, contrary to popular belief, they are NOT the same. I can find my own way to immersion on my own, thank you very much. Just give me a simulation where all the tools are there to create it. Make sure the ball flies far when I hit it the correct way with the bat and I'll do the rest. ;)

Edited December 12, 2009 by RedTiger

[Chibawang]

This is an interesting question, and I've often wondered the same. As you said, I think ED can easily survive solely as a study sim developer, especially if they continue to win military contracts. However, if they are to not just survive but prosper, I think it is important to "cater to the masses" somewhat by focusing on both facets of the flight sim community. Obviously they are ending the Flaming Cliffs product line, and I think the way they are going about that is a very smart one.

 

That being said, once development stops on FC and they begin to phase it out with the DCS series, I really hope to see the "game mode" further refined and streamlined into something that is more entertaining and accessable for the survey sim crowd. In it's current state it comes off a bit like an afterthought. Of course I realize that software development is an ongoing effort and the main focus is on the simulation mode. As a self proclaimed realism/immersion fanatic, I wouldn't want it any other way!

 

None the less, it is my opinion that much of ED's potential for commercial success lies in versatility. DCS is the most in depth, realistic and technically advanced entertainment sim ever released. If it were packaged with a truly fleshed out game mode, that would be another first for the genre, further cementing Eagle Dynamic's status as a pioneer in flight simulation. Whatever happens, it's going to be alot of fun, and I wish the team all my best! :thumbup:

 

Lastly though, there is also the question of whether ED can survive as solely a "high fidelity sim developer". I think they can, but I don't know for sure. Survey sims cater to a broader market and can bring in money that can be used on multiple projects that give synergies to both types of product in the same way that they currently have synergies between the commercial and military markets that they are catering to.