Advice on Thrustmaster Cougar vs Saitek X52

[digital_steve]

Hi,

I'm looking to get a setup for DCS: BS, as well as for use with other sims down the track (LOMAC, MS FSX etc).

I'm toying up between the Cougar HOTAS and the X52 and just wanted some opinions/advice/recommendations on the 2.

I always want to get some pedals and couldn't find any matching thrustmaster ones for the cougar setup, but came across the Saitek Pro Flight Pedals... do people use these with their cougar setup?

 

Thanks in advance folks!

[Kuky]

If the rudder pedals are USB you can use them with anything you want.

 

On the Cougar though you better do search ont he forums and you'll find plenty of opinions and facts on it... and same for X52.

[digital_steve]

I guess i'll go trawling through the forums then...

 

Does anyone use the cougar MFD's at all? Are they a worthwhile investment?

[Kuky]

Reason I did not want to give recomendations on Cougar or not (I personally have the Cougar but it's moded) is because there are few threads about it already and I never ownder X52 so can't comment on that...

[digital_steve]

No hassles mate

I also see people are using a second, networked computer to get a 2nd display in DCS BS. I want to know how to do that too!

[EtherealN]

Eh, where?

 

It is possible to export some information through LUA script to run a touchscreen for the buttons on another computer, but you cannot share the actual graphics computation of the simulator itself with another computer, as far as I know. (And if you could, you'd need two licenses.)

 

If you just want to use multiple screens all you really need is a graphics card with two (or more) out-ports, which would include most non-laptop cards, or a TripleHead2Go unit.

Edited December 4, 2009 by EtherealN

[digital_steve]

Eh, where?

 

It is possible to export some information through LUA script to run a touchscreen for the buttons on another computer, but you cannot share the actual graphics computation of the simulator itself with another computer, as far as I know. (And if you could, you'd need two licenses.)

 

If you just want to use multiple screens all you really need is a graphics card with two (or more) out-ports, which would include most non-laptop cards, or a TripleHead2Go unit.

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=787773&postcount=311

That post, down the bottom he mentions a networked secondary PC controlling the left cockpit screen

 

The reason i was interested is that i don't have 2 monitors, but i do have a spare laptop that's reasonably gutsy and it'd be awesome to have it as a secondary display

[EtherealN]

Yes, the left cockpit screen means the left side of the instrument panel. That networked machine is not running DCS, and it's not displaying any part of the DCS engine itself. Rather, it is running BSVP (Black Shark Virtual Panel - http://3dvrm.com/bsvp/). That application works through the DCS machine exporting flight information through the LUA export facility in the simulator. The other, networked, computer is then able to read this information over the network in real time, and the BSVP application interprets the exported gauge information to paint the instruments using it's own graphics engine.

 

Essentially, it is a piece of software that removes the need for separate controller cards to display the instruments in a "SimPit", where the traditional way has been to have actual physical gauges (the really hardcore people actually use real instruments and install servos and controller cards to control them).

 

It will not extend the regular cockpit view.

 

But if you want to construct a SimPit it is an awesome piece of kit. Also, if you don't have a TrackIR unit, it can be a nice way to ensure that you can always check your flight instruments without panning with a cumbersome hatswitch. (Though you can also use the numpad on your keyboard to achieve quick looks at the instrument panel.)

[digital_steve]

Aaah... i see now that there's BSVP and Touchbuddy (or touch something) that will both work in a similar fashion

So essentially, i could use either of these to display shvkal, gauges etc (not exactly 'extending' the cockpit view, but saving me from looking around) and not have to action this on the 'main cockpit' computer?

 

Forgive me if this is the most basic understanding, but i've only just got the game and am trying to get my head around it all.

[EtherealN]

It works for the gauges and PVI-800 inertial navigation computer, but I do not think you can export the Shkval screen since that one requires the DCS graphics engine. For that one you would indeed need another screen on the main computer.

 

The picture you linked seems to be a setup like this:

1) Main view. That's three screens through a Matrox TripleHead2Go. This means that to the simulator and the computer, those three screens "look" like a single screen.

2) Skhval. Looks like one of those nice little 7inch screens. Connected to the simulator.

3) ABRIS. Another regular screen. Connected to the simulator.

 

Those three can be achieved through a setting where you have essentially three video outputs from the simulator, one for main view (called "camera"), one for the Skhval and one for the ABRIS. As mentioned, the three main-view screens are probably fed through a TH2G and therefor look like a single screen to the computer and simulator.

 

And then finally:

4) BSVP screen on a networked computer. The simulating machine is set to have lua export on, and the networked computer is set to retrieve that export and display it. He has then placed the gauges on the screen so that his overlay covers that which is not an actual gauge - a neat way to create the "illusion" of physical gauges in a physical SimPit.

 

So I think your understanding is pretty much correct, except that you cannot run the Skhval nor ABRIS on the networked computer. Only gauges, buttons and so on since button and gauge states can be continually exported through LUA.

[digital_steve]

So I think your understanding is pretty much correct, except that you cannot run the Skhval nor ABRIS on the networked computer. Only gauges, buttons and so on since button and gauge states can be continually exported through LUA.

Ahh ok.

So BSVP is still valuable, but can't do the Skhval stuff.

I see now where i got confused, i thought that Touchpal could be used for the other functions on a seperate PC, but it's for monitors connected to the main PC only.

[lawndartleo]

If you can get a Cougar with good gimbals, it'll be 'da bomb. If you don't get good gimbals, I am not aware that any of the old mod makers are even make them any more so you may be pooched and have a stick with lots of center play (hence the reason so many of us bought mods).

 

I moded my Cougar with White Eagles FCC mod ($300, 4 years ago). It has zero defelction (well, not exactly zero but the rubber bushings dont allow fur much movement). Great for jet sims but not so great otherwise IMHO. Others disagree and say they love the FCC mods for all gaming. I just don't share their opinion.

 

The rest of the Cougar is very cool. Software and design/style are top shelf. It really is something that you have to try in order to understand.

 

However, I must confess that my Cougar sits idle in preference to a full CH Products setup. I have USB yoke, stick throttle, throttle quadrant and pedals. I think that in terms of overall utility, CH is the best.

[stevie52]

i have a Cougar. Only because of the weight i would get it. It's awesome. I have owned a x45 and did like it. X52 looks very futuristic. The thing with the saitek sticks is, that i never liked the spring setting. It was/is way to soft.

 

To get a cougar up and running the way it should is a little more time consuming, but very satisfying.

 

If you have seperate pedals, or planning to get them - go for the cougar.

If you don't have pedals and you aren't getting them, go for the x52 (it has twist z-axis for rudder on the stick)

 

stevie

[Conuk]

had a X52 .... was too soft....

 

CH stuff was bang on -- but felt too plasticy.... plus the throttle didnt seem to fit my hand.##Could definately fly better with Ch than the Saitek (although it was worth the money..)

 

picked up a cougar for cheap money - spent money on sensor mods and gonna throw in some more money for new gimbals because I like it that much!

 

picked up some Ch pro pedals.... and to be honest im not keen on them..... I actually preferred the G25 pedal pressure etc!

 

so may not keep these.

 

....... but all 3 are good.....

 

Cougar - if you happen to get a good one - has most potential......

CH stuff..... if you want a better out the box option but more expensive than Saitek

X52 - good - funky styling ? Best bang for buck... or pound in the uk :)

 

oh and didnt Frazer use a Saitek ?? nothing wrong with his flying!

Edited December 4, 2009 by Conuk

[digital_steve]

Thanks for the feedback folks!

[digital_steve]

Oh well, the decision as been made for me somewhat.

A mate has a new, unused FFB microsoft sidewinder2 or something, so i'll use that in the meantime and may as well wait on the HOTAS Warthog, which seems to be more appropriate, given the release of A-10c and stuff.

 

Now, if only i could get multiple monitors to work!

Using XP, i thought that was supposed to be easy! I can't get the dual monitors working, or even BSVP working on the one machine!