Ракеты в DCS

[Irisz]

 

R-27R or R-27ER information, knowledgeable people know what it is!

Link: https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/69/d1/79/4740f42ef147c3/RU2259536C1.pdf

[tavarish palkovnik]

...

 

Edited April 23 by tavarish palkovnik

[F-2]

11 minutes ago, tavarish palkovnik said:

One more motor, AMRAAM the ''B'' one...I hope Chinese didn't fail with cross cut  but indeed it fits very well with this configuration

 

 

 

 

 

 

Anyway it came out with 50,2 kg of propellant like this, 121,3 kNs at sea level and 129,5 kNs at 15 km. Very reasonable and fair and quite natural.

 

Just to repeat pressure-to-time diagram of R-27ER one more time

 

 

 

You see how one gravitates to 69 bar and other to 40 bar  ... and that is just as expected, 69:1 is American standard while 40:1 is Russian standard and indeed both motors works very nice at low altitudes as well in comparison to some (Phoenix for sure is one of these) which are choked down there

 

Development of a Air-to-Air Missile Simulation Program for the Lethality Evaluation.pdf

I sent this a month or so ago. It’s a Korean paper with information on the AIM-120B with info from the weapons employment manual used with permission. It should be possible to do it very well.

[tavarish palkovnik]

...

Edited April 23 by tavarish palkovnik

[F-2]

My paper is from Journal of The Korean Society for Aeronautical & Space Sciences

[Irisz]

Overall, I would like to make forum members aware that if someone searches or talks about R-27 missiles marked 1 on this forum, it is not about the OLD Soviet missiles. So in the case of ED, if you use these missiles as information about what it can do, you create a fantasy missile in DCS World. Because the Su-27 - Su-33 MiG-29 missiles use OLD Soviet Vympel missiles manufactured around 1990. However, if ED uses the data of the current EXPORT missiles, the homing head of the missile is from 2024, and its export engine is from 1990! Su-27SK weakened manual Export not oroginal and better Su-27S manual! MiG-29 9-29B Export manual (weakened export) not original and better Soviet MiG-29 9-12 or 9-13 or 9-13S product!

This is the problem, that's why the range of the missiles is reduced!

I don't understand why this doesn't bother anyone! Meanwhile, the Russian and Ukrainian missiles went through development, where the Ukrainian developed a proven better R-27ET1 homing head and active homing head R-27 missile! You don't need to create a new CFD simulation for these, just use designation 1 and update the missiles homing heads of the Ukrainian Su-27 and Fulcrum! China manufactures its own R-27 missiles by licensing them from Ukraine, so the J-11A should also receive these new R-27 1 designation missiles.

If no one here is interested in this, then as a business decision ED weakens the R-27 missile as it wants, in order to sell more NATO products in the ED shop.

Therefore, FC2024 is not attractive because it does not solve any problems that have accumulated over the years. It's only good for attracting lay new users who don't know anything!

German MiG-29 (9.12A) - Downgraded export version of the MiG-29 (9.12)

MiG-29G the main upgrade in this variant is the availability of the R-27ET1 and R-27ER1 and R-73E missiles which its older predecessor, the MiG-29 (9.12) lacked. The true advantage in this model lies in its airframe type; while the older East German MiG-29 and its Soviet counterpart, the MiG-29 (9.13) lack the advanced R-73 and R-27ET missiles.

To make the DCS world authentic with the MiG-29G, there is neither R-27ER1 R-27ET1 nor R-73E among its weapons!

So he uses unmarked missiles. As the R-73L appeared recently in the DCS World game files, these missiles could also appear. Again, these are just renamings, and based on the available data, a developer will rewrite the homing head parameters in 10 minutes and add real value to the FC2024, which will make it attractive to more people to buy and those veteran DCS World users will not uninstall DCS World because the current FC3 product is not fun and enjoyable!

Edited June 10, 2024 by Irisz

[Chizh]

2 hours ago, Irisz said:

Overall, I would like to make forum members aware that if someone searches or talks about R-27 missiles marked 1 on this forum, it is not about the OLD Soviet missiles. So in the case of ED, if you use these missiles as information about what it can do, you create a fantasy missile in DCS World. Because the Su-27 - Su-33 MiG-29 missiles use OLD Soviet Vympel missiles manufactured around 1990. However, if ED uses the data of the current EXPORT missiles, the homing head of the missile is from 2024, and its export engine is from 1990! Su-27SK weakened manual Export not oroginal and better Su-27S manual! MiG-29 9-29B Export manual (weakened export) not original and better Soviet MiG-29 9-12 or 9-13 or 9-13S product!

This is the problem, that's why the range of the missiles is reduced!

I don't understand why this doesn't bother anyone! Meanwhile, the Russian and Ukrainian missiles went through development, where the Ukrainian developed a proven better R-27ET1 homing head and active homing head R-27 missile! You don't need to create a new CFD simulation for these, just use designation 1 and update the missiles homing heads of the Ukrainian Su-27 and Fulcrum! China manufactures its own R-27 missiles by licensing them from Ukraine, so the J-11A should also receive these new R-27 1 designation missiles.

If no one here is interested in this, then as a business decision ED weakens the R-27 missile as it wants, in order to sell more NATO products in the ED shop.

Therefore, FC2024 is not attractive because it does not solve any problems that have accumulated over the years. It's only good for attracting lay new users who don't know anything!

German MiG-29 (9.12A) - Downgraded export version of the MiG-29 (9.12)

MiG-29G the main upgrade in this variant is the availability of the R-27ET1 and R-27ER1 and R-73E missiles which its older predecessor, the MiG-29 (9.12) lacked. The true advantage in this model lies in its airframe type; while the older East German MiG-29 and its Soviet counterpart, the MiG-29 (9.13) lack the advanced R-73 and R-27ET missiles.

To make the DCS world authentic with the MiG-29G, there is neither R-27ER1 R-27ET1 nor R-73E among its weapons!

So he uses unmarked missiles. As the R-73L appeared recently in the DCS World game files, these missiles could also appear. Again, these are just renamings, and based on the available data, a developer will rewrite the homing head parameters in 10 minutes and add real value to the FC2024, which will make it attractive to more people to buy and those veteran DCS World users will not uninstall DCS World because the current FC3 product is not fun and enjoyable!

 

We have significantly more documentation than you listed. Not only export, but also domestic Russian documents.
And there are enough of them for the R-27.
You are wrong about designation "1". The R-27R1 is not a modified missile, but an export version. Typically an export version adds the letter "Э", but an exception was made for the R-27R/T1 missile.

This year we plan to transfer the R-27 family missiles to a new modular system and new FM

[okopanja]

16 minutes ago, Chizh said:

We have significantly more documentation than you listed. Not only export, but also domestic Russian documents.
And there are enough of them for the R-27.
You are wrong about designation "1". The R-27R1 is not a modified missile, but an export version. Typically an export version adds the letter "Э", but an exception was made for the R-27R/T1 missile.

This year we plan to transfer the R-27 family missiles to a new modular system and new FM

Is the modular system granular enough for the implementation of Barker-7?

[Irisz]

38 minutes ago, Chizh said:

We have significantly more documentation than you listed. Not only export, but also domestic Russian documents.
And there are enough of them for the R-27.
You are wrong about designation "1". The R-27R1 is not a modified missile, but an export version. Typically an export version adds the letter "Э", but an exception was made for the R-27R/T1 missile.

This year we plan to transfer the R-27 family missiles to a new modular system and new FM

Thanks for the reply! I tried to gather all the information to ask the question! Thank you for informing the forum about what is happening with the Soviet and Russian missiles. Is it possible for this mark 1 to appear in DCS World? Perhaps the appearance of the Ukrainian R-27ET1 with a more modern better homing head is possible? This would benefit the J-11A and other Ukrainian aircraft as well. As I said, Ukraine uses these and China bought the license to produce them itself! I don't think it violates military secrets. I see this one rocket as an opportunity to be a real blood update with the release of FC2024. Perhaps it could also appear as R-27ET and without the 1 marking? I just want FC2024 to be attractive when it comes out!

Basically ED rejects all such questions and requests to get a more modern R-27 missile into DCS World? I think there is enough evidence on the Internet that these are not 34 year old missiles preserved in wooden boxes!

The bottom line is that I want, and I think many others want, that anything, whatever is possible, for us Flanker fans to be a little better when FC2024 comes out!

Unfortunately, there is no reassuring information about FC2024 that has been published so far! The new R-73L is quite attractive among game files, if perhaps its homing head is better and more modern!

1984
R-73 used the Mayak-80 (MK-80) seeker which is a single-block single-channel seeker. Lockon range is 8-12km, off-boresight capability +-45 deg, field of view +-45 deg. It still used to this day on R-73E missiles in production.

Mayak-80M (MK-80M) appears to be a version modified for use on the R-27T/ET, which replaced the earlier 36T seeker at some point, rather than an an upgraded seeker for the R-73.

1995-1996 Improved R-73M mentioned. R-73M1 and R-73M2 designations used by Janes (erroneously) for basic and improved R-73, with the latter having increased off-bore capability of +-60 deg. Trials said to have begun in 1994.

Edited June 10, 2024 by Irisz

[Irisz]

 This is exactly what I'm talking about! MiG and Su aircraft types can aim at 60 degrees with a helmet sight!

Edited June 10, 2024 by Irisz

[Chizh]

21 minutes ago, Irisz said:

Thanks for the reply! I tried to gather all the information to ask the question! Thank you for informing the forum about what is happening with the Soviet and Russian missiles. Is it possible for this mark 1 to appear in DCS World? Perhaps the appearance of the Ukrainian R-27ET1 with a more modern better homing head is possible? This would benefit the J-11A and other Ukrainian aircraft as well. As I said, Ukraine uses these and China bought the license to produce them itself! I don't think it violates military secrets. I see this one rocket as an opportunity to be a real blood update with the release of FC2024. Perhaps it could also appear as R-27ET and without the 1 marking? I just want FC2024 to be attractive when it comes out!

Basically ED rejects all such questions and requests to get a more modern R-27 missile into DCS World? I think there is enough evidence on the Internet that these are not 34 year old missiles preserved in wooden boxes!

The bottom line is that I want, and I think many others want, that anything, whatever is possible, for us Flanker fans to be a little better when FC2024 comes out!

Unfortunately, there is no reassuring information about FC2024 that has been published so far! The new R-73L is quite attractive among game files, if perhaps its homing head is better and more modern!

1984
R-73 used the Mayak-80 (MK-80) seeker which is a single-block single-channel seeker. Lockon range is 8-12km, off-boresight capability +-45 deg, field of view +-45 deg. It still used to this day on R-73E missiles in production.

Mayak-80M (MK-80M) appears to be a version modified for use on the R-27T/ET, which replaced the earlier 36T seeker at some point, rather than an an upgraded seeker for the R-73.

1995-1996 Improved R-73M mentioned. R-73M1 and R-73M2 designations used by Janes (erroneously) for basic and improved R-73, with the latter having increased off-bore capability of +-60 deg. Trials said to have begun in 1994.

 

You are very mistaken about modifications of Soviet missiles. Yes, advance research was carried out both in Kyiv and Moscow back in the 90s, but none of that appeared in the series. R-27 missiles are still the same as they were at that time. In particular, because the Russian Ministry of Defense was already planning to migrate to the R-77 missile, and Ukraine did not pay due attention to the rearmament of the Air Force.
We do not plan to introduce export missiles with the designation "1" because they are worse than the original Soviet ones.
There was no new seeker for the R-73 missiles.

1 minute ago, Irisz said:

This is exactly what I'm talking about!

Not everything that is shown at exhibitions later appears in the army.

[Yayo1]

5 часов назад, Chizh сказал:

 

This year we plan to transfer the R-27 family missiles to a new modular system and new FM

Отличные новости

[Chizh]

5 hours ago, okopanja said:

Is the modular system granular enough for the implementation of Barker-7?

I dont know what is Barker-7

[Flаnker]

5 часов назад, Chizh сказал:

There was no new seeker for the R-73 missiles.

Есть Р-74М

Edited June 10, 2024 by Flаnker

[Harlikwin]

50 minutes ago, Chizh said:

I dont know what is Barker-7

Datalink correction signal for R-27 series of missile. Surely you have this information in those vast archives you mention, and I'm sure you will do a great job implementing this unique capability for the missile in the DCS Mig-29 module.

[okopanja]

57 minutes ago, Chizh said:

I dont know what is Barker-7

I meant the code used to transmit corrections for R-27

[Chizh]

44 minutes ago, Flаnker said:

Есть Р-74М

 

Это уже не Р-73.
Скорее РВВ-МД.

[Chizh]

23 minutes ago, Harlikwin said:

Datalink correction signal for R-27 series of missile. Surely you have this information in those vast archives you mention, and I'm sure you will do a great job implementing this unique capability for the missile in the DCS Mig-29 module.

Sure

[FlankerFan35]

14 hours ago, Chizh said:

We have significantly more documentation than you listed. Not only export, but also domestic Russian documents.
And there are enough of them for the R-27.
You are wrong about designation "1". The R-27R1 is not a modified missile, but an export version. Typically an export version adds the letter "Э", but an exception was made for the R-27R/T1 missile.

This year we plan to transfer the R-27 family missiles to a new modular system and new FM

Will you rename missiles to R-27ER/ET and ER1/ET1 and such to denote differences between home and export variants, would be very cool.

[Chizh]

5 hours ago, FlankerFan35 said:

Will you rename missiles to R-27ER/ET and ER1/ET1 and such to denote differences between home and export variants, would be very cool.

We don't know these subtleties and I don't see the point in it.

[N8AHbl4]

@Chizh Здравствуйте. В игре AGM-114K ограничена 45 секундами времени работы. Эта цифра скорее всего некорректна. У меня нет документа, который бы однозначно подтвердил реальное ограничение по времени работы, но есть высказывания разных пилотов OH-58/AH-64, цитаты из обучающих материалов. Ракета должна быть ограничена 65 секундами работы пневматических приводов рулей.

Спойлер

>The maximum engagement range is dependent upon the kinematic limits of the missile and by the effective flight time limit imposed by the HELLFIRE missile pneumatic control system (approximately 65 seconds).

>When launched from high altitude, the missile is capable of gliding farther. The kinematic maximum range increases with increased altitude above the target at the rate of 0.4 kilometers per 1,000 feet altitude. The kinematic range also increases with air temperature at the rate of 0.5 kilometer per 50 degrees F. However, for increased launch altitudes, the maximum absolute range (independent of altitude) is time-of-flight limited at approximately 65 seconds. This limits kinematic max range at approximately 12 kilometers.

Спойлер

https://quizlet.com/268458611/mq-9-weapons-flash-cards/



https://quizlet.com/gb/330415730/agm-114-hellfire-flash-cards/

 

Edited June 11, 2024 by N8AHbl4

[FlankerFan35]

23 hours ago, Chizh said:

We don't know these subtleties and I don't see the point in it.

Vast majority were just a rename for export, but that change alone would be cool I think, especially on the J-11. 

[Chizh]

36 minutes ago, FlankerFan35 said:

Vast majority were just a rename for export, but that change alone would be cool I think, especially on the J-11. 

Why do you need the R-27R1 missile, which will be just a copy of the R-27R?

4 hours ago, N8AHbl4 said:

@Chizh Здравствуйте. В игре AGM-114K ограничена 45 секундами времени работы. Эта цифра скорее всего некорректна. У меня нет документа, который бы однозначно подтвердил реальное ограничение по времени работы, но есть высказывания разных пилотов OH-58/AH-64, цитаты из обучающих материалов. Ракета должна быть ограничена 65 секундами работы пневматических приводов рулей.

  Reveal hidden contents

>The maximum engagement range is dependent upon the kinematic limits of the missile and by the effective flight time limit imposed by the HELLFIRE missile pneumatic control system (approximately 65 seconds).

>When launched from high altitude, the missile is capable of gliding farther. The kinematic maximum range increases with increased altitude above the target at the rate of 0.4 kilometers per 1,000 feet altitude. The kinematic range also increases with air temperature at the rate of 0.5 kilometer per 50 degrees F. However, for increased launch altitudes, the maximum absolute range (independent of altitude) is time-of-flight limited at approximately 65 seconds. This limits kinematic max range at approximately 12 kilometers.

  Reveal hidden contents

https://quizlet.com/268458611/mq-9-weapons-flash-cards/



https://quizlet.com/gb/330415730/agm-114-hellfire-flash-cards/

 

 

Спасибо. Будем искать подтверждения.

[FlankerFan35]

10 minutes ago, Chizh said:

Why do you need the R-27R1 missile, which will be just a copy of the R-27R?

 It's just a small detail that could be cool to see for a nerd like me  

[Chizh]

5 minutes ago, FlankerFan35 said:

 It's just a small detail that could be cool to see for a nerd like me  

It's not worth the cost of having to maintain two sets of missiles.