Missile warning's or RWR question.

[Crazyowl]

So... I'm having this problem or curve learning that its making my training slower.

 

My expirience with FC3 specialy the F15 is that everytime I fly around I get shoot down by unknow missiles and also my RWR or radar don't pick them up. I'm using track-IR and for that reason no padlock lock on missile view available. Its very dificult to visual lock a missile cause when the white smoke stop showing and is realy small you end up not knowing where the missile is coming so I'ts vey difficult to evade it succefuly.:noexpression:.

 

How I can succefully evade a missile in FC3?,

Those the RWR suposse to always keep a warning if I have a lock on or incomin missile? "Is this a bug if not happening or is not the level of funtionality or detail in this model of DCS?

 

in my tactics, I don't whant to drop to level ground and loose the advantage of altitude just for traying to evade a single missile. Also to add, sometimes I can evade the first one "sometimes", is the second or third one that don't come with a warning. Or lest say that sometimes I notice that for some missile I have a warning "long missiles" and for the close ones the RWR idont pick nothing.

 

Any help from the people that know's how to evade a missile will be appritiated! <S>:book::thumbup:

 

Sorry for my writting, english is not my first.

[Exorcet]

At long range you're being shot at with radar guided missiles. These missiles use active guidance which generates a signal that the RWR can detect. At shorted ranges Infra-red missiles can be used. These are passive missiles that produce no signal, and the RWR cannot detect them. There are systems that can detect them, but none are available on FC3 aircraft.

 

As far as missile evasion goes, that's always a last step. Your focus should be on finding a favorable shot for your missile while at the same time denying the enemy a good shot. In the current version of DCS World (1.2.3) the F-15 has it a bit hard because the AIM-120 is very weak. The R-27ER will be able to launch at you first, and there are some missiles with even longer range (R-33 and AIM-54).

 

I was going to make a long post, but it's late, so I'll upload a track instead. Bascially do the following:

 

1 - Always keep an eye on your target, don't lose lock

2 - Don't shoot until your missile has a chance at hitting

3 - Always stay on the defensive when you're not shooting

Missile demo.trk

[Crazyowl]

Thanks man I know is late and maybe tomorrow you can answer me this. <S>

 

Its there a way to keep track of the jet and the missile's without zooming in so crazy becoming very hard to fly or using padlock track view "not real"?. I'm using Track IR and a zoom scroller that help me in distance view, buut, when I zoom in I can't fly correctly cause off confusing direction.

 

FLARES/CHAFFS?

 

I havent found a good explanation on whend and on what to use them? I think I have the concept but is not working for me in FC3.

 

CHAFFS are for blocking or confusing Radars?

FLARES are for confusing and incoming missile? "dont know when exactly to use them causing in a big amount of waste".

 

If this correct then I'm very bad or this elements are not working correctly in FC3.:doh:

Let me kow,

and Thanks for your spare time!

[Azraeil]

 

How I can succefully evade a missile in FC3?,

Those the RWR suposse to always keep a warning if I have a lock on or incomin missile? "Is this a bug if not happening or is not the level of funtionality or detail in this model of DCS?

 

IR missiles and (some long-range missile-radar systems like an SA-10) will not give a warning on the RWR. I would say you are being hit either by ground based strela's or the infrared missiles of russian cap fighters. Check the kill feed to see what missile hit you, this way you can identify what killed you and how you might have gone wrong.

 

In bvr, or wvr combat, some missile shots cannot be evaded. The aim of missile fighting in some sense then is to enable a missile shot for yourself while denying your opponent said shot. This is often not possible and in reality, especially when the fight starts head to head. In this case you want to force a situation where your opponent has successively less time to re-acquire you as a target, relative to you re-acquiring him, after each missile exchange and defense maneuver.

 

1v1 BVR fighting is a fairly procedural affair (unlike WVR gun fights) where there is a set guideline you can follow to eliminate things that will guarantee you being killed. Things become more fluid as you add aircraft into this mix but, there is plenty of literature out there on the web which can take you through procedures in both cases such as this excellent post

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=32019

[159th_Falcon]

Pretty sure the SA-10 should give a lock and later an launch warning on the RWR.

 

If its not doing so in FC3 then that is most likely a bug.

[Haukka81]

Pretty sure the SA-10 should give a lock and later an launch warning on the RWR.

 

If its not doing so in FC3 then that is most likely a bug.

 

 

Nope, SA-10 wont give launch warning.. least later versions don't :book:

[GGTharos]

Says who's RWR?

 

Nope, SA-10 wont give launch warning.. least later versions don't :book:

[Crazyowl]

Thanks guy's, for all the replies. If you like to keep adding feel free.

 

I just stumble today with a couple of 1v1 F15 vs Su27, first me flying the F15 versus a good SU pilot, he took me out most of the time from long range and close range, seems they have better lock-on on me. I went in revers flying the SU-27 and it feels that the Russians have better and stronger missiles in FC3.

 

Hopefully they fix it in 1.2.4 patch specialy the Allies missiles "120". I'm trying not to get frustrated with this, cause I'm going or trying only to be in MP since single player flying the F15 against lets say 6 su-27 and a couples of Allies jets it's nonce's. All of the Allies get shoot down fast and with no mercy :huh:

 

<S> All

[fitness88]

The problem with the missiles is that there is no consistency from update to update which forces you to relearn their new characteristics.

 

Some call it improvement some call it frustrating.

[Exorcet]

I just stumble today with a couple of 1v1 F15 vs Su27, first me flying the F15 versus a good SU pilot, he took me out most of the time from long range and close range, seems they have better lock-on on me. I went in revers flying the SU-27 and it feels that the Russians have better and stronger missiles in FC3.

For online, I would use the AIM-7 when flying online. It is harder to out maneuver than the AIM-120 in the current patch. However the new 1.2.4 patch is coming soon and is supposed to be the final and most accurate patch for missile kinetic performance (although guidance is still being tuned).

 

For countermeasures, chaff and flare are both for evading missiles, but they work on different types of missiles. Chaff works on radar guided missiles, flares on IR guided missiles. Use chaff when your RWR warns you of a missile, but make sure you are also keeping the missile on your wing and that you are maneuvering. It's a little harder to figure out how to use flares since IR missiles give no warning. What I do is assume a missile is coming when I am close enough to an enemy. The good thing with flares at current is that they are very effective against IR missiles. If you catch an IR missile launch there is a good chance of defeating it with a combination of flares, maneuvering and managing your IR signature (turn off the afterburner).

[maturin]

If you read about the Tunguska a bit on the internet, you'll find some statistic analysis the Russians did on the superiority of 30mm over 23mm shells against aircraft.

[Crazyowl]

What is a good server to learn or where you guy's go to practice. It will be cool if there's a flying school server or something similar.

 

Or any good squadron looking for new players not so new? I always end up in a squadron realising they are interesting in flying diferent planes that I don't fly.

 

<S> All

[159th_Viper]

realising they are interesting in flying diferent planes that I don't fly.

 

Which airframe do you inhabit?

[Haukka81]

Says who's RWR?

 

 

Least F-16 Block 50 RWR in Falcon BMS..

 

The Flap Lid (FCR) tracks both the missile and the target to fly the missile into the target by radio control. This means that the FCR ground station can change frequencies and strength to spoof the target’s RWR.

 

 

A-10 RWR may be more advanced. :music_whistling:

[GGTharos]

Least F-16 Block 50 RWR in Falcon BMS..

 

What it does in a game means nothing.

 

The Flap Lid (FCR) tracks both the missile and the target to fly the missile into the target by radio control. This means that the FCR ground station can change frequencies and strength to spoof the target’s RWR.

 

Can, maybe, could've/should've/would've ... this again means nothing.

 

A-10 RWR may be more advanced. :music_whistling:

 

They use the same-ish RWR.

[whiteladder]

The Flap Lid (FCR) tracks both the missile and the target to fly the missile into the target by radio control. This means that the FCR ground station can change frequencies and strength to spoof the target’s RWR.

 

The RWR isn`t using the just frequency to classify the radar, it is analysing the pulse frequency, the modulation of the signal, etc and comparing this with a library of know threats. Also the signal strength will alway be stronger at the RWR than the transmitter, again would have no effect on classification.

 

Many Russian SAMs have a WAR setting, which is designed only to be used in a conflict ( and the normal setting under peace time training conditions), that use a complete different set of parameter in an attempt to fool the libraries of opposing forces. The effectiveness of this is limited.

 

Hopping frequency would make it harder to jam, but have no effect on classification.

[Crazyowl]

Which airframe do you inhabit?

 

I whant to be good at the F-15, but I would not mind learning the SU-27 but in this one I will wait dor the 6dof cockpit, I use TRACK IR and I'm use to the all freedom movement.

 

I use to fly the A-10 but is a long time that I dont fly it so I have to go back to training. Also the

ka-50 but I want to fly fast movers now.

 

So basicly F15 :pilotfly: