JonTex

Well first of all dont take this the wrong way but the key word in my previous post is highlighted for you bro so the reality check is recieved in the spirit which it was given but not necessary because I realize one more time that thats life. Second I own a chevy truck and no I didnt have any input into how it would look. And yes that does suck. Now let me ask you some questions. 1.Do you like Lomac? 2.How long have you been playing flightsims? 3.Do they all seem to model the same aircraft? 4.If you see over the course of the next 10 years ,hypothetically speaking, that 30 flightsims come out and all of them feature the F15, F18, A10, and F16 as the flyables with no chance of a Harrier or hearing your input would you buy them? Why? or Why not? 5.If 30 more flightsim companies be they foreign or domestic are thinking of making a flightsim in the not too distant future and they are all unanamously are thinking of modeling the above aircraft as the flyables would you consider that a good idea? Why? Why not? Now lets hit home. lets say you plan to keep playing lockon. 6.Lets say hypothetically ED or whoever decides they are commiting the next 10 years of their services to adding 3 more aircraft to the game and they are the F15E, Su-27(hell i dont know pick a model), and Mig29K as flyables. Would you buy the addons? Why? or Why not? Now let me tell you what I would answer. 1. Yes I love it 2.5 almost six years 3.Yes 4.No, Because Ive already played quality flightsims (flightsims with good graphics and realism) that feature these aircraft. 5.No, Because the whole point of buying a NEW game is to buy something you havent played or experienced. If all these companies put out the same flyables noone will buy their games and the people who have bought their game will be forced to find a different genre of video games to invest in for the lack of variety in the flight sim genre. 6. Hell no and I think everyone knows why. They already have these aircraft, adding "New flyables" that are just different models would kill the whole idea of something new. Again this is hypothetical and I used this as an example. Like I said it sucks to not have any input and thats life but this is the point how much more money are you going to spend on Lomac and how much longer do you think your going to play Lomac if they dont put the Harrier or a different fighter in as a flyable? To be honest for me I think Ill play Lomac another 1 maybe 2 years with the way they are going now and then Ill find something else. I wonder how many others feel the exact same way. And considering the fact that Im not the only one who feels like this dont you think that would be something ED or whoever decides this stuff would want to look into? GM , Ford, Chevy they aint stupid man they know where their pockets are lined. If Ford owners said they wanted the pinto back tommorrow you better believe Ford would be breaking their necks trying to find the blueprints for a 2006 Ford Pinto buddy boy. Bottom line MONEY always has been and always will be with companies. They dont do this for free. So the question is how much more money are you going to spend? :cool:

Right on Brotha :D

Yeah cant say I didnt see that one coming :D just a shame i cant find my original post about this it would clarify if not all , the preaching to the choir bit ... hehe that was a hard one to swallow. But anyway thankyou for your answer it clarifies everything and i apologize for any inconsistency in the logic of my previous post ... umm i think we call that the confusion. The fact that we have to post in forums instead of talking face to face kind of complicates matters in the respect that people can pick apart your statements. But no harm no foul I just wanted to understand. You see had you been able to read my original post to "ALPHA" you would have seen that I made mention of the fact that I knew yall are testers and that you dont make those decisions. Hey man Ill apologize again until you see that im not trying to make this a debate but I dont know your chain of command like I mentioned before in my previous thread I realize im just another faceless registered user on your website, another licensed user attached to a serial key code of an agreement i didnt bother to read because i just want to have fun. Well all i can say is I wish i knew who to preach to, not that they would listen but at least i could state my case to them. Really sucks to have absolutely no say in the addons of flyable aircraft of a game you spend your money on and plan to spend more money on in the future. I think we call that life. But what ever happened to the customer always being right? :cool: Anway thanx again for your courtesy and patience with me. I hope one day the right person will read the many post that are just like mine in regards to the F14 being flyable it really would be nice. JonTex out

Alpha , I hate to be a pest and since other testers are probably going to respond to this before you I wouldnt be offended but this is still bothering me. I tried to find my previous post but I was unsuccesful. But if I remember correctly I asked why cant the F14 be modeled as a playable aircraft in Lock on. The response I got was overwhelming dude. I never seen so many excuses in my life in one post. 1. Its a twin seater. And im guessing that modeling a twin seater aircraft in video game is probably the equivelent of flying to the moon in a Hum-V judging from your responses. 2. You dont have the "classified" tac data. Umm ok so I assume we have room for imagination or guess work to make your lock on fans happy correct? I mean have you taken the time to count the endless number of people who would like to fly the tomcat in this game? I havent either but its a lot. Which brings me to my point. I recently read this in another post and it just shows me the big picture for the stuff that is considered to be modeled and the stuff that is not for this game. The question was asked by my former teammate since ED stated Russian HOJ systems were not passive and American F15 HOJ systems are, then why were they knowingly modeled incorrectly. Your fellow ED tester gave a great explanation including a very interesting point he made at the end of his answer that I want to focus on for a moment of your precious time. The main part of that answer that caught my attention was "When it is IMPOSSIBLE to model something accurately, such changes are made in response to reasonable requests from the user community." Oh you mean like when you dont have Tactical data to accurately model an F14 in the game as a playable because its classified? So if the "user community" said something to the affect of I would love to have the Tomcat as a flyable in Lomac within a reasonable request you would do it? I mean its obvious by now that the user community's satisfaction is your goal so whats so unreasonable about my request? Oh thats right its a two seater it wouldnt be modeled accurately. OH so since the F14 wouldnt be modeled accurate as a single seater you could improvise by modeling the F14 as a flyable with a human pilot in the front and a AI in the back? Is that what that means? If the real answer to these questions is because you dont want to do it thats fine but I just think you should be straight up with people. Im not mad I just want to understand. Oh and BTW my former teammate S77th-Goya didnt get answer to his question toward the end of his post for ED. :cool: JonTex out

lol ......... yea i give up im gonna go play some lockon and pretend the Su33 is a F14 ... sad its the closest i can get to real carrier ops. :cool:

Well Alpha, Gee man I just dont know what to say to all that well thought out technical excuse. :D But I will say this where there is a will there is a way and i know it aint impossible. BTW I mentioned in my first post that I think ED is a company that thinks outside the box. Key phrase there. All im saying and you can take this and run with it or you can keep yourself in the box here figuretively speaking, But none of us and I do mean none of us have ever flown a F-14(those who have posted in this post anyway). And Im willing to bet that even a far greater number of the gaming and simming community have never flown the tomcat or the 31. Hell Ive never flown the Su-27 , the Su33, never flown the Su25T, Su25, never flown the A10 warthog, never flown the F-15C , the F15E ..... hehe i think your starting to get the point. But let me drive it home here. The developers (God Bless their hearts) will sacrifice long nights in the office life and limb and even their company taking a nose dive into bankruptcy to model a flyable aircraft that none of the flight sim community has ever set foot in with all the tech and tac data that left them scratching their heads and cutting corners to make the codes work. in an online and single player gaming community that couldnt have told you the difference between breaking the sound barrier and a wet fart. But you try and thats commendable thats what makes you a cut above the rest but i know it can be done. You know I never even knew you used a tactical data book to model these aircraft and to be honest after flying all the flight sims that ive flown I cant tell you the difference and could care less. To be honest your Su's are modeled to be so challenging for the average arm chair pilot that I almost put the game down and never touched it again it was just that frustrating. Im not saying dont model the aircraft as closely to its real life counterpart as possible ..... never saying that. Im just saying since you dont have the tac data take what you do know about the tomcat and model it close to something you already have like the F15. Im sure the F15 and the F14 are so close in flight characteristics you will laugh when you get the tac data. Look bottom line all im saying is no one would fault you for at least trying to model it as closely as you can. In your case Im sure your best guess is as close as the tac data could ever come to modeling the F14 anway. Thanks for responding though Alpha it opens my eyes a bit more each time someone of your caliber takes the time to teach someone like me a little more than i knew before. But I still think its possible maybe one day ill try it myself only problem is I dont know where to start. Im sure everyone will laugh at first but we will see who is laughing when your all playing my game. lol :cool: P.S. And i know everyone says that since the tomcat is a twin seater that two people should be able to operate it. You know one in the front flyin and the other in the back operating the weapon systems but who said that has to happen. Why cant you just stick an AI back there and slave him to your every command in the front seat if im not mistaken since i worked on them thats how it happens anyway.

BS you can be mine :cool:

oh ... i still want to see it as a flyable. :D not interested in getting into a debate just want to see it as a flyable.

Hey Alpha, I noticed your a tester (pretty sharp Huh?). Anyhow Im frustrated and i know im preaching to the choir on this one but I know your not the only one who will hear what i have to say on this one if you know what i mean. I can tell you right now that this game is awesome bugs and all I think this game is great its frustrating with the bugs but I can live with it because I know the amount of dedication and hard work it takes to put out a game of this caliber. With that said I would warn ED to not make the same mistake that many other developers have made in the past by force feeding their consumers the same old meat loaf they have eaten for years. ED strikes me as the kind of company that thinks outside the box. A company that is prepared to go to great lengths to give a mal nourished and in this day in age of "popular games" overlooked community the chance to thrive. The flight sim community. Ive said this before and ill keep saying it till i get heard because I know there has to be at least one damn person out there who still has the gumption to give this old soldier his last wish before I give up on the gaming community all together. Yeah I hate to be the turd in the punch bowl today but I have to tell it like it is. The flight sim community is getting so repetitive is sickening. We have had the same stinking aircraft modeled year after year in game after game so many years that now game makers face a diminishing market from a consumer that wants to buy but wont buy their flight sims because they have already flown your stinking F18's and F15's and F16's so many times that they dont even need the manual for anything more than remapping the keys to their joysticks because they already have working knowledge of the systems on board. (to a certain degree of coarse but i think you get my point). I really wish they would make the F14 and the Mig31 as flyables. Im a die hard tomcat fan and its just sad when you look at the history of sims over the years that have modeled aircraft up to and around the tomcat as if it had the black plague. Its just a damn shame because that aircraft was literally the work horse of naval aviation in its day as an active fighter. And if you dont believe me I dare you to do some research on its capabilities and design. Not only that it has seen just as much action as its airforce counterparts and is so formidable and lethal it was sold to only one other country without its BVR capabilities of the Aim 54 phoenix because it was so lethal and even Iran tried to find some way to jerry rig their 14s to use make shift Hawk missles AKA a surface to air missle to utilize the 14s BVR capabilities to their fullest potential. Now The next excuse that ill get for not modeling the tomcat in a flight sim from here on out besides it being a two seater will be "sorry man the tomcat isnt an active fighter" and then they will slap me in the face with a F18 super hornet flight sim the two seater version or single seat dont matter to me. I realize im preaching to the choir or talking to the wrong person. I know that my one vote doesnt count but at least im making my vote. I know ED has what it takes to do it but will they? And I know they would not have spent all those years after making flanker improving this game and putting more flyables in like the 15 and the Hog if they werent trying to make a flight sim that would not only raise the bar but make an attempt at giving a dying flight sim community the jolt that it needed and starved for all those years in between. So if ED is listening and just by chance your still scratching your head saying gee I wonder what it was in all that hard work we did that jolted the flight sim community. Why are our numbers so high and why are these consumers so interested in our product? Why were we so succesful? Didnt we work just as hard on flanker and flanker 2.5? Well heres your answer these consumers see something different in your product they havent seen in years past and thats a chance to see something different and experience something they havent experienced in a flight sim. It might be a lot of work but It will be worth it to make the 31 and the 14 flyables. I say the 31 because it would only be fair to the Russian side of the fence in this game. Hell if you need my help I will do anything to make it possible. I realize im just another faceless name on your website. Another serial number attached to a license agreement that i didnt bother to read like all the other gamers because we just want to have fun who needs legality right? But i caution you to take me lightly because im sure others feel the same. You put a helicopter in thats a start but soon people will want to see fighters that they have never been able to fly modeled as flyables in your sim. The ball is in your court and the question is what will you do?

Hey Souless , just wanted to tell ya I quit to bro and I dont think you have access to the private section of the website anymore much like i dont only about an hour after i posted but its all good. That kinda limits you to your goodbyes when trying to say them to your teammates and all before you go. So Ill post mine here for ya so I know you get it. Been a pleasure flying with you I just didnt have the time to dedicate to the squad and some other personal reasons that i wont go into because overall S77th is the best squad around hands down. Other than that i feel your pain with the issues of lock on bro its frustrating but I aint gonna stop flying just going to take what they give and make the most of it. I wish you the best in your future endeavours and God Bless man. JonTex A.K.A. S77th-TEX