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FPS limiters and Track-IR performance


bandit648

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I'm seemingly on a never ending mission to get the smoothest possible experience out of DCS with TrackIR. To get smooth TrackIR performance I have to limit my FPS to 60 in DCS. I can get buttery smooth trackir tracking when I set my 144hz monitor to 60hz and then lock the fps at 60 as well.

 

This all works great flying around on an empty map. As soon as I load up my AI-heavy test mission I start running into trouble. Frequent dips to 55-59 fps cause annoying micro-stuttering. My system is easily capable to maintain above 85 fps in the same mission if I uncap the fps.

 

So, that makes me wonder why I can't maintain a solid 60 fps under load? Is it due to the fps limiting method? Or is it because my gpu isn't running at full performance when capping fps at 60? I normally see 50-70% GPU utilization when capped at 60. If I could maintain a solid 60 fps somehow in heavy missions I'd be very happy with performance.

 

I've tried limiting fps with Graphics.lua, NVInspector, MSI Afterburner and V-sync and pretty much get the same results with all of them. I'm curious what other people are using and what the results are.

 

I'm starting to hate TrackIR. We need a new head tracking solution that's compatible with modern variable refresh rate monitors.

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maybe try locking your fps at 62,

 

i too have this issue, but g sync helps alot with it. i just cap mine at 100 (my monitors maximum) and the judder from track ir panning isn't so bad.

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emh emh there are severala threads about this issue, I along with other have tried to figure it out , but in 2 years of several attempts the only solution we've found out is to cap fps @60 via msi riva turner which has the lowest input lag detected.

 

 

I have a 165hz asus rog pg278qr monitor gsync , 1080ti and a 5.0ghz oc 8700k + 32 gb ram @3600mhz.

 

 

There is no solution to this problem, natural point from trackir never akcnowledged the problem, and I am quite sure it is a hardware limitation of the trackir itself.

To be more clear : the game operates in D3D , trackir in Opengl :)

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emh emh there are severala threads about this issue, I along with other have tried to figure it out , but in 2 years of several attempts the only solution we've found out is to cap fps @60 via msi riva turner which has the lowest input lag detected.

 

 

I have a 165hz asus rog pg278qr monitor gsync , 1080ti and a 5.0ghz oc 8700k + 32 gb ram @3600mhz.

 

 

There is no solution to this problem, natural point from trackir never akcnowledged the problem, and I am quite sure it is a hardware limitation of the trackir itself.

To be more clear : the game operates in D3D , trackir in Opengl :)

 

Yes, I've read all of the threads on subject. I realize I have to lock at 60 fps to get smooth trackir, but I'm wondering if there's any way to maintain a constant 60 fps without dips into the 50's.

 

If I uncap my fps I never dip below 60 even with heavy missions. When capped with riva fps fluctuate from 55-60 fps unless I'm flying around an empty map. This may just be a DCS thing and no way around it.

 

Has anyone tried any trackir alternatives? I wonder if there is a hands-free mouse or something that would work better. It's so frustrating to be stuck with this!

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Yes, I've read all of the threads on subject. I realize I have to lock at 60 fps to get smooth trackir, but I'm wondering if there's any way to maintain a constant 60 fps without dips into the 50's.

 

If I uncap my fps I never dip below 60 even with heavy missions. When capped with riva fps fluctuate from 55-60 fps unless I'm flying around an empty map. This may just be a DCS thing and no way around it.

 

Has anyone tried any trackir alternatives? I wonder if there is a hands-free mouse or something that would work better. It's so frustrating to be stuck with this!

 

 

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Yes, I've read all of the threads on subject. I realize I have to lock at 60 fps to get smooth trackir, but I'm wondering if there's any way to maintain a constant 60 fps without dips into the 50's.

 

If I uncap my fps I never dip below 60 even with heavy missions. When capped with riva fps fluctuate from 55-60 fps unless I'm flying around an empty map. This may just be a DCS thing and no way around it.

 

Has anyone tried any trackir alternatives? I wonder if there is a hands-free mouse or something that would work better. It's so frustrating to be stuck with this!

 

 

You should use msi riva turner fps OSD and you wll figure out that even if you uncap the fps some times it drops below 60 :)

 

 

the only way to keep smooth is cap @60, sometime it drops below 60, you could try msa2x and ssaa to 0, shadows to flat :):thumbup:

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You should use msi riva turner fps OSD and you wll figure out that even if you uncap the fps some times it drops below 60 :)

 

 

the only way to keep smooth is cap @60, sometime it drops below 60, you could try msa2x and ssaa to 0, shadows to flat :):thumbup:

 

I do use the OSD, that's how I know what's going on :). Occasionally the game will just drop fps into the 40's and stutter. Nothing we can do about that.

 

However, I've found that when using rivatuner to cap fps at 60, the framerate will fluctuate from mid 50's to 60 fps. This occurs more frequently when under load in a heavy mission. Most of the time it just flips between 59-60fps on my rig. If I uncap in the same mission I find I'm not dropping below 60 so the system SHOULD be able to maintain a solid 60 fps in most situations. The problem is actually rivatuner itself.

 

The solution for me has been to switch to using NVInspector and capping fps at 60 with "Limiter V2 - Force Off". This option seems to work much better at locking a constant 60 fps on my system. Riva was driving me nuts with that 55-60 fps crap.. I've spent days troubleshooting this thinking something else was causing the fluctuation. :cry:

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I do use the OSD, that's how I know what's going on :). Occasionally the game will just drop fps into the 40's and stutter. Nothing we can do about that.

 

However, I've found that when using rivatuner to cap fps at 60, the framerate will fluctuate from mid 50's to 60 fps. This occurs more frequently when under load in a heavy mission. Most of the time it just flips between 59-60fps on my rig. If I uncap in the same mission I find I'm not dropping below 60 so the system SHOULD be able to maintain a solid 60 fps in most situations. The problem is actually rivatuner itself.

 

The solution for me has been to switch to using NVInspector and capping fps at 60 with "Limiter V2 - Force Off". This option seems to work much better at locking a constant 60 fps on my system. Riva was driving me nuts with that 55-60 fps crap.. I've spent days troubleshooting this thinking something else was causing the fluctuation. :cry:

 

You say you've read all the threads on this, but in order to get Gsync working correctly you need to limit your fps to 58, not 60. At 60, Vsync kicks in and spoils the party.

Also, for reasons I can't remember, it is not recommended to use Nvidia Inspector. Use Rivatuner @ 58fps.

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You say you've read all the threads on this, but in order to get Gsync working correctly you need to limit your fps to 58, not 60. At 60, Vsync kicks in and spoils the party.

Also, for reasons I can't remember, it is not recommended to use Nvidia Inspector. Use Rivatuner @ 58fps.

 

If you don't want to be bothered by v-sync you can just force it off in NVCP. The only reason to run with V-sync on is if you were running with uncapped fps and expected to be exceeding your monitor's refresh rate. Then v-sync will kick in and prevent tearing. This is generally not a concern in DCS

 

58 fps with rivatuner has the same results as 60 fps with rivatuner. Framerate fluctuates and doesn't stay locked on solid 58. 58 fps also results in not very smooth TrackIR so I don't recommend anyone doing that.

PC Hardware: Asus Maximus XIII Hero / i9-10900K / 64 GB DDR4 3600 MHz / NVIDIA RTX 3090 FE / Samsung 960 NVMe / LG OLED48CX / Reverb G2

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You say you've read all the threads on this, but in order to get Gsync working correctly you need to limit your fps to 58, not 60. At 60, Vsync kicks in and spoils the party.

Also, for reasons I can't remember, it is not recommended to use Nvidia Inspector. Use Rivatuner @ 58fps.

 

The reason was input lag.

 

From what Guru3d says, RivaTuner adds the least lag into the feed when capping at any fps.

 

If that is true, I guess.

 

 

BTW, mine are capped at 60 as well, for TiR5, with RivaTuner.

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If you don't want to be bothered by v-sync you can just force it off in NVCP. The only reason to run with V-sync on is if you were running with uncapped fps and expected to be exceeding your monitor's refresh rate. Then v-sync will kick in and prevent tearing. This is generally not a concern in DCS

 

58 fps with rivatuner has the same results as 60 fps with rivatuner. Framerate fluctuates and doesn't stay locked on solid 58. 58 fps also results in not very smooth TrackIR so I don't recommend anyone doing that.

 

No it doesn’t have the same effect. 60 makes vsync kick in, 58 ensures that GSync does.

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No it doesn’t have the same effect. 60 makes vsync kick in, 58 ensures that GSync does.

 

That is nonsense. All you have to do is turn on the G-sync indicator in NVCP to see whether or not it's working. How does v-sync kick in when it's forced off in NVCP?

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The reason was input lag.

 

From what Guru3d says, RivaTuner adds the least lag into the feed when capping at any fps.

 

If that is true, I guess.

 

 

BTW, mine are capped at 60 as well, for TiR5, with RivaTuner.

 

What I read on blurbusters was that the NVInspector Limiter V2 was supposed to have lower input lag, but they hadn't confirmed it because they didn't test it. In the testing they did do, rivatuner had the lowest.

 

What I'm saying is that riva doesn't hold a solid 60 fps lock very well. NVInspector "Limiter V2 - All Off" option appears to be doing a much better job at that then riva.

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That is nonsense. All you have to do is turn on the G-sync indicator in NVCP to see whether or not it's working. How does v-sync kick in when it's forced off in NVCP?

It is certainly not 'nonsense' if you are using a 60Hz monitor. And, you shouldn't be disabling vsync anyway. Anything above 60fps on a 60Hz monitor is not a good thing.

Frames should be limited to 58 in Rivatuner and vsync kept on when using a 60Hz Gsync monitor.

This is standard Guru3D advice.

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What I read on blurbusters was that the NVInspector Limiter V2 was supposed to have lower input lag, but they hadn't confirmed it because they didn't test it. In the testing they did do, rivatuner had the lowest.

 

What I'm saying is that riva doesn't hold a solid 60 fps lock very well. NVInspector "Limiter V2 - All Off" option appears to be doing a much better job at that then riva.

 

I have a rock solid 58fps with Rivatuner. Never goes above, and very rarely goes below, and when it does, it's only in low altitude, dense terrain flying.

Another standard piece of advice on Guru3D is never use Nvidia Inspector as it lags badly.

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It is certainly not 'nonsense' if you are using a 60Hz monitor. And, you shouldn't be disabling vsync anyway. Anything above 60fps on a 60Hz monitor is not a good thing.

Frames should be limited to 58 in Rivatuner and vsync kept on when using a 60Hz Gsync monitor.

This is standard Guru3D advice.

 

Right, anything above 60 fps on a 60hz monitor will result in screen tearing unless v-sync is enabled. That's the only reason to leave it on, as I said before.

 

I don't believe the Guru3D advice is based on running DCS with TrackIR. As myself and many other forum members have observed, TrackIR in DCS runs the smoothest at 60fps.

 

As far as input lag goes, blurbusters said they hadn't confirmed what the input lag is with the new LIMITER V2 option in NVInspector.

 

As of Nvidia Profile Inspector version 2.1.3.6 and Nvidia driver branch R381 or later, a new “Frame Rate Limiter Mode” dropdown has been introduced with a “Limiter V2 – Force Off”

 

This option claims to reduce the limiter’s input lag; exactly by how much, and with what combination of settings, remains to be determined.

 

I'll try the 58 fps advice and report back. I'll set my 144hz monitor to 60hz, Enable G-sync Full screen mode, Enable V-sync in NVCP, and cap fps with rivatuner at 58 fps.

 

Not expecting the smoothest TrackIR experience but who knows...

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Right, anything above 60 fps on a 60hz monitor will result in screen tearing unless v-sync is enabled. That's the only reason to leave it on, as I said before.

 

I don't believe the Guru3D advice is based on running DCS with TrackIR. As myself and many other forum members have observed, TrackIR in DCS runs the smoothest at 60fps.

 

As far as input lag goes, blurbusters said they hadn't confirmed what the input lag is with the new LIMITER V2 option in NVInspector.

 

As of Nvidia Profile Inspector version 2.1.3.6 and Nvidia driver branch R381 or later, a new “Frame Rate Limiter Mode” dropdown has been introduced with a “Limiter V2 – Force Off”

 

This option claims to reduce the limiter’s input lag; exactly by how much, and with what combination of settings, remains to be determined.

 

I'll try the 58 fps advice and report back. I'll set my 144hz monitor to 60hz, Enable G-sync Full screen mode, Enable V-sync in NVCP, and cap fps with rivatuner at 58 fps.

 

Not expecting the smoothest TrackIR experience but who knows...

Yes, exactly, vsync is only set to on as anything over 60fps on a 60Hz screen is not good, and The 58fps limit is just so gysnc is always on (no vsync) when under 60fps. As an aside, you mentioned the Gsync setting in NVCP to show Gysync is working, but that does nothing. It shows no matter what the fps is. It's just a flag I think.

I have never seen any issue with TrackIR at 58fps.

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Yes, exactly, vsync is only set to on as anything over 60fps on a 60Hz screen is not good, and The 58fps limit is just so gysnc is always on (no vsync) when under 60fps. As an aside, you mentioned the Gsync setting in NVCP to show Gysync is working, but that does nothing. It shows no matter what the fps is. It's just a flag I think.

I have never seen any issue with TrackIR at 58fps.

 

I just gave 58 fps lock a quick try and it didn't seem as smooth to me as 60. I'm curious what others will report if they try this. I also get a lot more fps stuttering with rivatuner then I get with NVInspector Limiter v2.

 

I have a heavy test mission where a large number of Russian armored units are advancing on Tbilisi. There's also MRLS positioned on the hills to the North so there's lots of smoke, explosions, etc. When running this mission, I've found that uncapped, I never dip below 60 fps. If I cap with riva, I get stuttering because fps fluctuates a few fps below the cap. NVI Limiter V2 seems to do a better job of hold the fps at whatever I lock it to.

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I just gave 58 fps lock a quick try and it didn't seem as smooth to me as 60. I'm curious what others will report if they try this. I also get a lot more fps stuttering with rivatuner then I get with NVInspector Limiter v2.

 

I have a heavy test mission where a large number of Russian armored units are advancing on Tbilisi. There's also MRLS positioned on the hills to the North so there's lots of smoke, explosions, etc. When running this mission, I've found that uncapped, I never dip below 60 fps. If I cap with riva, I get stuttering because fps fluctuates a few fps below the cap. NVI Limiter V2 seems to do a better job of hold the fps at whatever I lock it to.

 

It makes no sense for a solid 58fps to be less smooth if you are running GSync. It is designed for that purpose and is vastly superior to vsync which is what you will be using at 60.

You shouldn’t be seeing any fps stuttering at all, whether with RTSS or Nvidia Inspector if GSync is being invoked.

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It makes no sense for a solid 58fps to be less smooth if you are running GSync. It is designed for that purpose and is vastly superior to vsync which is what you will be using at 60.

You shouldn’t be seeing any fps stuttering at all, whether with RTSS or Nvidia Inspector if GSync is being invoked.

 

The problem is TrackIR. Many of us that use it see microstuttering when running at anything other than 60 fps.

 

I'll record fps with Uncapped vs Limiter V2 vs Riva and post the results. Of course if I fly around on an empty map then Riva can maintain a pretty solid lock. The problem occurs when under load in a heavy mission.

PC Hardware: Asus Maximus XIII Hero / i9-10900K / 64 GB DDR4 3600 MHz / NVIDIA RTX 3090 FE / Samsung 960 NVMe / LG OLED48CX / Reverb G2

Flight Controls: Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog / VKB T-RUDDER MKIV / Cougar MFD Set

DCS Modules: F-14 Tomcat / F/A-18C Hornet / AV-8B NA / F-5E Tiger II / A-10C Warthog / F-16C Viper / UH-1 Huey / LOFC3 / Spitfire LF Mk. IX / P-51D Mustang / WWII Assets Pack / Normandy 1944 / NTTR Map / Persian Gulf Map / Syria Map

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Alright gentlemen, I did some benchmarking tests with a mission I made on the Caucasus map. The mission has 145 units total. I flew for 5 minutes with heavy action and saved the recording to use for the test. The total time of each test was 5 minutes.

 

In my experience, 60 fps locked with NVInspector is the smoothest. The test results also show that NVI maintained a better lock on 60 fps than Rivatuner. Rivatuner 58 fps lock with v-sync on in NVCP didn't work well for me. 60 fps appears much smoother.

 

You can open the attached files with MSI Afterburner for graph view, or just view them as a regular text file.

rivatuner_60fps_lock_144hz_vsync_off.txt

NVI_LimiterV2_60fps_lock_144hz_vsync_off.txt

uncapped.txt

PC Hardware: Asus Maximus XIII Hero / i9-10900K / 64 GB DDR4 3600 MHz / NVIDIA RTX 3090 FE / Samsung 960 NVMe / LG OLED48CX / Reverb G2

Flight Controls: Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog / VKB T-RUDDER MKIV / Cougar MFD Set

DCS Modules: F-14 Tomcat / F/A-18C Hornet / AV-8B NA / F-5E Tiger II / A-10C Warthog / F-16C Viper / UH-1 Huey / LOFC3 / Spitfire LF Mk. IX / P-51D Mustang / WWII Assets Pack / Normandy 1944 / NTTR Map / Persian Gulf Map / Syria Map

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I am not seeing what you are, and your results go against the advice at Guru3D and other sites, but whatever works best for you is what you should use!

As an aside, how do you produce those results showing in the text files?

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My lock is pretty much rock solid at 60 fps. My Gsync is always on, 2d or 3d, always, as indicated by the red LED on my screen. I do not have Vsync turned on, all default but the Performance Mode is set to HighPerformance and the fps are locked at 60 in RT. Aero is disabled in DCS, Vsync unchecked, FS unchecked as I use SRS Overlay so I usually fly FSBW and not FS.

 

But I will check if it dumps under heavy load and if, use NV Inspector, which I actually never did before.

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I am not seeing what you are, and your results go against the advice at Guru3D and other sites, but whatever works best for you is what you should use!

As an aside, how do you produce those results showing in the text files?

 

I encourage you to do your own testing on this subject. You should be able to run G-Sync at 60hz / 60 fps just fine. TrackIR is certainly smoother at 60 fps. Download the Nvidia Pendulum demo and do some tests and see what works and what doesn't. My Monitor, runs G-Sync perfectly at 60hz. I have the LG 32GK850G 32-Inch 1440p/144hz G-Sync Monitor.

 

https://www.nvidia.com/coolstuff/demos#!/g-sync

 

I suspect advice on sites like Guru3d is geared towards the masses playing first person shooters and not guys running flight sims with TrackIR in the mix.

 

You can setup logging in MSI Afterburner to track your fps. Just go to settings, monitor tab and select a location for your log file. Then setup hotkey's to turn it on/off.

 

How do you like your Acer XB321HK? I used to have that monitor. I owned it for around 6 months before forcing Acer to give me my money back on it. The monitor has this intermittent artifact glitch that Acer apparently had no interest in fixing. Lots of discussion about it on the Acer forums.

PC Hardware: Asus Maximus XIII Hero / i9-10900K / 64 GB DDR4 3600 MHz / NVIDIA RTX 3090 FE / Samsung 960 NVMe / LG OLED48CX / Reverb G2

Flight Controls: Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog / VKB T-RUDDER MKIV / Cougar MFD Set

DCS Modules: F-14 Tomcat / F/A-18C Hornet / AV-8B NA / F-5E Tiger II / A-10C Warthog / F-16C Viper / UH-1 Huey / LOFC3 / Spitfire LF Mk. IX / P-51D Mustang / WWII Assets Pack / Normandy 1944 / NTTR Map / Persian Gulf Map / Syria Map

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My lock is pretty much rock solid at 60 fps. My Gsync is always on, 2d or 3d, always, as indicated by the red LED on my screen. I do not have Vsync turned on, all default but the Performance Mode is set to HighPerformance and the fps are locked at 60 in RT. Aero is disabled in DCS, Vsync unchecked, FS unchecked as I use SRS Overlay so I usually fly FSBW and not FS.

 

But I will check if it dumps under heavy load and if, use NV Inspector, which I actually never did before.

 

The Gsync light being on is meaningless. It is on no matter what the frame rate if you have selected it in NVCP. And it has no effect in VR, if that is what you mean by 3D.

Intel i7 12700K · MSI Gaming X Trio RTX 4090 · ASUS ROG STRIX Z690-A Wi-Fi · MSI 32" MPG321UR QD · Samsung 970 500Gb M.2 NVMe · 2 x Samsung 850 Evo 1Tb · 2Tb HDD · 32Gb Corsair Vengance 3000MHz DDR4 · Windows 11 · Thrustmaster TPR Pedals · Tobii Eye Tracker 5 · Thrustmaster F/A-18 Hornet Grip · Virpil MongoosT-50CM3 Base · Virpil Throttle MT-50 CM3 · Virpil Alpha Prime Grip · Virpil Control Panel 2 · Thrustmaster F-16 MFDs · HTC Vive Pro 2 · Total Controls Multifunction Button Box

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