[EVALUATING] ASP for A-2-A gun use incorrect / Radar

[Harle]

 

What's the point of posting these russian red covered books ("Technical Description" and "Operation & Maintenance Manual", which might contain some useful info I can translate) and showing nothing from them?

Those czech/polish (or whatever they are) scribbles are of little use to us.

[Dudikoff]

I mean the first picture by finger the book with the red envelope. Is that really not cyrillic? If so I'm sorry. Last but not least I hit the right model :)

 

Yes, you're right about that. But, I was referring to those hand written notes, as you've said "Maybe it will follow but on the pages shown..". :)

Edited March 13, 2015 by Dudikoff

[sissypilot]

The rp-21 is a fully capable search radar not a radar gunsight, and as every search radar it could be used as rangefinder for the gunsight, as search radars replaced rangefinders. Ranging a gunsight is a postwar technology it was obvious in the 70's when bis entered service and multiple russian and polish and now czech sources prove that.

This debate is like praying with a horse. LN implemented something totally faulty based on some alleged mig-21 pilots tales and now prove that it is wrong. Lets turn it around and prove that it is right not based on myths but documetnts (at least one please, as there are numerous to prove the opposite) and I will be in your team.

[FSKRipper]

Let me make something clear, I will ignore any posts which include developer bashing or insults against members of this forum. This includes your last one. Would you have tried to join in a productive discussion like finger ore some1 and bring some facts and publications instead of agitating against Novak this could have been an interesting exchange of views. I don't have an idea how old you are but looking at your join date I would recommend you carefully read the forum rules...

Edited March 13, 2015 by FSKRipper
N

[finger]

Keep calm,keep calm friends and any invective please.Co-operation will be

better.

[sissypilot]

Let me make something clear, I will ignore any posts which include developer bashing or insults against members of this forum. This includes your last one. Would you have tried to join in a productive discussion like finger ore some1 and bring some facts and publications instead of agitating against Novak this could have been an interesting exchange of views. I don't have an idea how old you are but looking at your join date I would recommend you carefully read the forum rules...

 

All neccessary documentation has already been presented I am tired of starting over with everyone you must understand. I am a customer here paid for something and unhappy about it and will not sugar coat it. The ASP is a piece of messy cr..p, fuses dont work which is also far from highy fidelity, my tires are halfway sunk into the concrete, someone cant make up his mind of a flight controll sensitivity and the list goes on...

[foxbat155]

What's the point of posting these russian red covered books ("Technical Description" and "Operation & Maintenance Manual", which might contain some useful info I can translate) and showing nothing from them?

Those czech/polish (or whatever they are) scribbles are of little use to us.

For heaven's sake give him little time, he need find information and scan this. If you are so impatient maybe you can show someting from your archive?.

 

Weapon systems yes, equipment, no. I never denied the ability of the ASP-5 to use radar information. I'm not 100% sure if all variants had the same equipments in all air forces. But the 21M and the 21MF used in the east german air force used a RP21 MA which is some kind of radar gunsight.We call it "Funkmessvisier". The RP-22 is a completely different construction site....

 

 

 

I don't say so, but since it is not my native language I would kindly request the exact page of your link stating the coherence between the gunsight and the radar. I will take the time and check this with a native speaker, ok?

 

 

 

I mean the first picture by finger the book with the red envelope. Is that really not cyrillic? If so I'm sorry. Last but not least I hit the right model :)

 

 

Edit: I don't know how good your german is finger, this is a datacard of an east german MF

 

Again, I don't deny the possibility of a radar range function. But before I join your team, convince me!

 

Sorry your datacard contains many untrue informations. MiG-21M/MF NEVER had ASP-5 gunsight ( only F/F-13, U, some US ), no difference in search range between RP-21M i RP-21MA and both are search radars not rangefinders, IFF system is SRZO-2 not SRO-2 (find the difference ). Every ( polish or czech or soviet ) military manuals stating that ASP-PFD-21 use information from radar. Those papers are OFFICIAL military documents, I don't understand why some people deny their value as a source of information.

[Flagrum]

I am a customer here paid for something and unhappy about it and will not sugar coat it.

What about just being polite and respecting the people you are ineracting with?

 

The ASP is a piece of messy cr..p, fuses dont work which is also far from highy fidelity, my tires are halfway sunk into the concrete, someone cant make up his mind of a flight controll sensitivity and the list goes on...

And this is now in which way relevant for the ASP issue?

[some1]

I don't say so, but since it is not my native language I would kindly request the exact page of your link stating the coherence between the gunsight and the radar. I will take the time and check this with a native speaker, ok?

 

 

You could start with the page I linked in the original post. Basically it says:

 

When firing guns or unguided rockets at air targets, ASP-PFD gunsight allows aiming:

 

- in "GYRO", "AUT." mode when attacking non-manoeuvring targets or targets manoeuvring with low G-forces, the range is fed from radar or manual rangefinder (if in this mode the supplied range is 600m, then there won't be "ZACHWAT" signal and the "WYCHOD" lamp won't lit).

- in "GYRO" mode when firing at a manoeuvring target with the range preset at 300m. In this mode target base (wingsapn) is set using the outer scale of the "BAZA" knob. The damping button should be off.

- in "CC" mode when firing at a manoeuvring or non-manoeuvring target using fixed and moving gunsight net, if the pilot is trained properly.

 

Another page at the bottom: http://www.muzeumlotnictwa.pl/digitalizacja_archiwaliow/katalog/1363/94.jpg

 

c) the switch "AWT. - RUC." (AUT. - MAN.) : In AUT. position - to automatically source the range from radar or slant range bloc. In MAN. position to enter the range from optical rangefinder and manual entering angular corrections during firing.

 

Sorry for not grammatically correct translation, the original document is very technical and not grammatically correct either.

[Art-J]

Sissypilot, just on a sidenote re. "tires are halfway sunk into the concrete", You can fix this part Yourself:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=140033

[sissypilot]

Sissypilot, just on a sidenote re. "tires are halfway sunk into the concrete", You can fix this part Yourself:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=140033

 

Thanks Art that is really kind, but am I alone with the feeling that editing system files for a pricey software component to work is somehow not right...

[Einherjer]

Thanks Art that is really kind, but am I alone with the feeling that editing system files for a pricey software component to work is somehow not right...

 

 

This answer is weak... I think you are just a little impatient...

[Art-J]

Thanks Art that is really kind, but am I alone with the feeling that editing system files for a pricey software component to work is somehow not right...

 

Oh, You're not alone, that is a broad subject related to many modern games nowadays, but let's not go off-topic here.

 

Still, If we can do some minor fixes in DCS modules ourselves, using only notepad++, it's better than nothing.

[Harle]

Finger, what about photos of relevant chapters from those red covered books in russian? It's been a while since you first showed them.

Edited March 15, 2015 by Harle

[finger]

Of course Harle,no problém.

[finger]

[finger]

[Harle]

But sir, this is a "bomb release electric circuit diagram". Not so relevant to the thread topic.

Isn't there anything describing the data flow between the ASP and the radar?

[finger]

Oh,sorry,I thought that your reaction is on release sequence MBD2.

[finger]

So,you can compare those two pictures(one I have to borrowed from sissypilot -I thank you sissy)You can see data flow,witch is identical.

 

-real distance of target (this is primary signal)

-LOCK TARGET

-LAUNCH

-BREAK OFF

-SARH MISSILE information

-some referential voltage

 

Well,any big surprise.This is very obsolete system.DSCN1607.JPG

[Harle]

Now that's muuuch better!

Could you please take another photo of this "diagram of interaction with ASP" from your book? Just make a better focus on the upper part. I can't quite make out some words (even when magnified).

Edited March 15, 2015 by Harle

[finger]

For sure.

[Harle]

Thanks! I'll translate it tomorrow. Gotta go to bed now.

[finger]

You do not,I understand by russian.

[Harle]

You do not,I understand by russian.

 

That much I've noticed already:D

Wanna translate it yourself for everyone else?

Edited March 15, 2015 by Harle