High Speed Vibrations

[Latebraker]

Hi all,

 

I have experienced heavy vibrations with the K-4 at speeds above 550 km/h and I can't go faster in heights up to 5.000 ft. The vibrations suddenly come and immediately lead to a black out. While being on idle I can dive with up to max. 600 km/h - never knowing if the vibrations start or not. It is not possible to recover the plane during diving and the flight ends in a fatal crash.

 

Compared to the FW-190 (which easily reaches speeds up to 900 km/h in fast diving) the K-4 is much slower due to this issue.

 

Am I doing something wrong, is this a bug or is it normal?

 

Cheers and a happy new year to all of you,

Latebraker

[Anatoli-Kagari9]

Strange??? Never experienced that, and I surely dived at near 800km/h and was able to pull out of it, no vibrations?

 

Can it be that you forgot to retract flaps or gear after takeoff?

[Latebraker]

Hi jcomm,

 

thanks for your feedback. I am also really wondering about this issue since I expected a very fast plane. I am sure that gear as well as flaps were properly set and I observe this behaviour on a regular basis.

 

It seems to me as if some parameters are wrong, since the effect I observe seems to be what is described on page 114 in the Bf 109-Manual in the section Compressibility (reaching the sound barrier). I am definitely not able to reach the max. diving speeds as specified on page 113!

 

Btw. I am using the Thrustmaster HOTAS WARTHOG - setup, so I do not have force feedback...

 

Any recommendations?

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

[Derbysieger]

Like jcomm, I don't experience anything like this. I flew 800ish kph indicated in a steep dive last night and pulled out no problem with minimal stick movement.

I use the standard linear axis profile with the WH HOTAS stick.

 

Try to do a repair of your DCS World installation (standalone) or run the file integrity check (steam).

[Anatoli-Kagari9]

Well,

 

I just picked the default "free flight" situation of the K4 and edited it to start at 26000'

 

From there I dived ereaching in excess of 800 km/h, and on two occasions I experienced a bit of shacking, but nothing that could really affect the control response, and was able to recover.

 

But, ther can indeed be some vibrations on such dives.

 

EDIT: For my tests I even started climbing. At this higher altitudes it is very tricky to fly the K4 in DCS - even at full stab trim nose heavy settings, it wants to pitch up :-/

Also, as some others have reported, there are no condensation trails

Edited December 31, 2014 by jcomm

[ophiuchus]

Latebaker, are those values IAS or TAS? I just climbed to 12000m, and performed a dive with over 850km/h TAS @ 6000m, there was a slight buffeting but I could recover pretty easily and there was no blackout.

[Latebraker]

Hi Guys,

 

thanks for all your feedback. The speed I mentioned were from the cockpit's speed gauge, so it should be IAS. It's also correlating with the speed shown in external view (mph).

 

The vibration comes so quick and is so hard that something should be wrong with the parameters (although I didn't change anything here).

 

I also do not see condensation trails while other pilots in my formation do create some...

 

Is this all a beta thing?

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

[Latebraker]

Hi Guys,

 

I just checked the scenario jcomm used for his test. Exactly at 350 kts (it should be IAS) the vibrations black me out. This is really unfortunate...

 

P-51 just fly away...

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

[Flanker35M]

S!

 

You are sure you did not have manual prop pitch on and engine went to over-RPM situation?

[Random]

Track files may be helpful?

 

109 is a dream for me. Never misbehaves!

[Derbysieger]

I think it would be best to post a track so we can see what you're doing

[Latebraker]

Gents, pleas explain me how to create a track! I will immediately do so!

 

Thank you in advance!

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

[Anatoli-Kagari9]

At the end of your flight, in the closing screen, there's an option - "Save Track". Hit it.... :)

[Latebraker]

Hi all,

 

@jcomm, thanks for the hint. Please find attached the track from my short and fatal test flight. I am curious about your opinions.

 

Prop RPM management was definitely set to Auto. BTW where can I change it to Manual?

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

Bf-109 Test Flight Vibrations.trk

[Latebraker]

Hi all,

 

I found the knob for the setup of the RPM-Control. It is definitely set to Auto while the vibrations occur. A change to Manual does not change the vibration-issue while the revs become crazy:smilewink:...

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

[Latebraker]

Hi all,

 

I just found out that the vibration issue only shows up with activated Arcade mode (set in general Setup of DCS World). It is gone when Arcade mode is off.

Maybe you guys out there can check this out and confirm my observation?

 

Probably now the shitstorm starts :music_whistling:...

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

[golani79]

Maybe you guys out there can check this out and confirm my observation?

 

Tried it out and can confirm shaking / blacking out ...

 

lol .. this behavior is ridiculous - not sure though if it isn´t a bug.

[Anatoli-Kagari9]

Tried it out and can confirm shaking / blacking out ...

 

lol .. this behavior is ridiculous - not sure though if it isn´t a bug.

 

Me too ... Very strange.

Styarting from anty of the situations that came with the K4, or others, and even from MPsessions, I can't reproduce the same weird effect? What might that be???

[Davis0079]

...silly arcade mode users...

[Crumpp]

 

Seriously, the Simulator mode is very sophisticated and I like the possibilities it grants. On the other hand, pilots during WWII were put into the fighter after a few lessons. If the real plane was as hard to start, to fly and to land as in the simulation, the Luftwaffe wouldn't have existed...

 

 

I disagree that the difficulty is unrealistic.

 

I have quite a bit of flying time in tail draggers and even own one.

 

You have tactile clues and feel in the real thing that are missing on a computer. When I was teaching, most students are doing their own take off's by the first or second lesson. Now that is not doing them well, that is simply muddling the airplane into the air.

 

With just a few minutes instructions, I bet you could even do the complex take off procedures of a large transport category aircraft and maybe even some V1 cuts if your good.

 

In all honesty, it is much easier to take off the real thing than the DCS models. It is just not that hard to take off in an airplane. Remember, fixed wing aircraft are purposely designed to fly!

 

Does that make DCS unrealistic? NOT AT ALL.

 

DCS forces you to use the correct procedures. Sure, the consequences of not using the correct procedures might be exaggerated somewhat but that is hardly "unrealistic".

 

Unrealistic is seeing everyone muddle the airplane into the air because the FM is realistically forgiving allowing the players to unrealistically use the wrong procedures over and over again.

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2274219&postcount=396

[Latebraker]

I disagree that the difficulty is unrealistic.

 

I have quite a bit of flying time in tail draggers and even own one.

 

You have tactile clues and feel in the real thing that are missing on a computer. When I was teaching, most students are doing their own take off's by the first or second lesson. Now that is not doing them well, that is simply muddling the airplane into the air.

 

With just a few minutes instructions, I bet you could even do the complex take off procedures of a large transport category aircraft and maybe even some V1 cuts if your good.

 

In all honesty, it is much easier to take off the real thing than the DCS models. It is just not that hard to take off in an airplane. Remember, fixed wing aircraft are purposely designed to fly!

 

Does that make DCS unrealistic? NOT AT ALL.

 

DCS forces you to use the correct procedures. Sure, the consequences of not using the correct procedures might be exaggerated somewhat but that is hardly "unrealistic".

 

Unrealistic is seeing everyone muddle the airplane into the air because the FM is realistically forgiving allowing the players to unrealistically use the wrong procedures over and over again.

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2274219&postcount=396

 

Basically I do agree with you and I'd like to point out that I did not say that DCS in simulation mode is unrealistic. I have been flying glyder planes for more than 10 years now and I know exactly what you are talking about. BUT ... since the real feel is missing in the virtual world, the question is: does the simulation mode reflect on this issue in the best possible way? The missing real feel is a missing link in the loop which somehow should be reflected by the FM in a rather ergonomical way...

 

Getting back to topic: how to address the High speed vibration issue to the DCS people?

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

[Latebraker]

BTW where is my initial post?

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

[Friedrich-4B]

Getting back to topic: how to address the High speed vibration issue to the DCS people?

 

Cheers,

Latebraker

 

To get the DCS people to have a look, this topic should be under "Bugs and Problems"; a moderator can re-catergorise the thread for you 109K-4 Bugs and Problems

[Latebraker]

Hi Friedrich-4/B,

 

thank you for your feedback! It would be nice if a moderator would refer this thread to the "bugs and problems"-section.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

Cheers,

Latebraker