OperatorJack Posted December 13, 2016 Posted December 13, 2016 I've seen the Mirage be able to distinguish between the 3 versions of the MiG 29, and yet no other aircraft in DCS currently does. Is this correct behaviour? /да бойз/ [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
microvax Posted December 13, 2016 Posted December 13, 2016 I've seen the Mirage be able to distinguish between the 3 versions of the MiG 29, and yet no other aircraft in DCS currently does. Is this correct behaviour? If the three mig29 variants have different radars, I guess it makes sense. French ministry of defence probably wont tell us if the have the ELINT and if that ELINT has been used for the RWR. :) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] *unexpected flight behaviour* Oh shiii*** ! What ? Why ? What is happening ?
OperatorJack Posted December 13, 2016 Author Posted December 13, 2016 If the three mig29 variants have different radars, I guess it makes sense. French ministry of defence probably wont tell us if the have the ELINT and if that ELINT has been used for the RWR. :) As far as I'm aware the 3 versions all use the same radar /да бойз/ [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
ZHeN Posted December 13, 2016 Posted December 13, 2016 which versions are there in DCS ? Mig-29A, Mig-29S and the third one ? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
jojo Posted December 13, 2016 Posted December 13, 2016 MiG 29G...which is a MiG 29A Mirage fanatic ! I7-7700K/ MSI RTX3080/ RAM 64 Go/ SSD / TM Hornet stick-Virpil WarBRD + Virpil CM3 Throttle + MFG Crosswind + Reverb G2. Flickr gallery: https://www.flickr.com/gp/71068385@N02/728Hbi
MrDieing Posted December 13, 2016 Posted December 13, 2016 MiG 29G...which is a MiG 29A But a German MiG-29A :D ''Greed is a bottomless pit which exhausts the person in an endless effort to satisfy the need without ever reaching satisfaction.'' Erich Fromm
OperatorJack Posted December 13, 2016 Author Posted December 13, 2016 But a German MiG-29A :D It's the same radar in all 3 versions and yet the M2KC RWR can differentiate the 3 /да бойз/ [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
ZHeN Posted December 13, 2016 Posted December 13, 2016 (edited) well Mig-29S has an upgraded version of N019 (Rubin) ... the N019M ("Topaz") so they're different radars with different types of antennas: Cassegrain vs. slotted planar array N019M = Fox-3 capability to hit two targets simultaneously Edited December 13, 2016 by ZHeN [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
red_coreSix Posted December 13, 2016 Posted December 13, 2016 well Mig-29S has an upgraded version of N019 (Rubin) ... the N019M ("Topaz") so they're different radars with different types of antennas: Cassegrain vs. slotted planar array N019M = Fox-3 capability to hit two targets simultaneously N019M is not a slotted planar array antenna. Same as the N019, just new software and processor. The RWRs of the mirages timeframe shouldn't be able to distinguish a N019 and N001. The waveform is pretty much the same. The mirages capability to distinguish between aircraft versions is not restricted to the MiG-29. It can also be observed with the F-16 and the Su-27/33. It seems like RAZBAM just copied the airplane names into the RWR library. I would really like to see an update on this, so that a MiG-29/Su-27/33 are all displayed as "29" or "27".
ZHeN Posted December 13, 2016 Posted December 13, 2016 N019M is not a slotted planar array antenna. Same as the N019, just new software and processor. I have different information [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
OperatorJack Posted December 16, 2016 Author Posted December 16, 2016 Obviously showing the 3 aircraft types as a unique ping on the RWR is incorrect then? /да бойз/ [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
jojo Posted December 16, 2016 Posted December 16, 2016 At least MiG 29A and MiG 29G are both "9.12" variant, with the same radar. MiG 29S is "9.13" variant. I don't know if radar signal would be different enough to be recognized as such by 90' RWR... Mirage fanatic ! I7-7700K/ MSI RTX3080/ RAM 64 Go/ SSD / TM Hornet stick-Virpil WarBRD + Virpil CM3 Throttle + MFG Crosswind + Reverb G2. Flickr gallery: https://www.flickr.com/gp/71068385@N02/728Hbi
red_coreSix Posted December 16, 2016 Posted December 16, 2016 The waveform should be pretty much the same between N019 and N019M. All changes are on the receiver/processor side.
Corsair Posted December 16, 2016 Posted December 16, 2016 Even though radar characteristics (PRI, freq...) would be different enough between the two for the RWR to accurately detect it, I don't believe this would be a relevant thing to display it (information overload), not to mention that the display usually shows 1-2 digits spots.
red_coreSix Posted December 16, 2016 Posted December 16, 2016 I think you guys are overestimating the capabilities of RWRs. The A-10s AN/ALR-69 was not capable to distinguish between SA-8 and ZSU-23-4, even though there are surely some differences between the two (simply because one is meant to guide a missile and the other is for directing AAA).
OperatorJack Posted December 16, 2016 Author Posted December 16, 2016 I think you guys are overestimating the capabilities of RWRs. The A-10s AN/ALR-69 was not capable to distinguish between SA-8 and ZSU-23-4, even though there are surely some differences between the two (simply because one is meant to guide a missile and the other is for directing AAA). I agree with this. If the F-15C can't differentiate then I wouldn't expect the M2KC to be able to either. (Not based upon any knowledge I have in the subject, it's just that the F-15C is a contemporary of the Mirage and if the Yanks could have the capability they'd probably have implemented it) /да бойз/ [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Azrayen Posted December 17, 2016 Posted December 17, 2016 Guys, I think the current RWR is simply asking to DCS database. Probably it should be "upgraded" (code-wise) or "downgraded" (differentiation-wise) as to better simulate what we know of RWRs and radars from the time. Note: OTOH, the RWR should be able to differentiate RDI (2000C) and RDY (2000-5) radars. So it goes both ways. ++ Az'
Recommended Posts