TCS abilities.

[QuiGon]

It can perhaps do with a bit of clarification in that paragraph, but the Operation section further down clearly describes how to use it.

Yeah, the controls description is a bit missleading currently, while the operation section is right on :thumbup:

[gyrovague]

Yeah, the controls description is a bit missleading currently, while the operation section is right on :thumbup:

 

I've left a note for the documentation guy, he is currently not available. Will probably be fixed by the next release patch I guess.

[QuiGon]

I've left a note for the documentation guy, he is currently not available. Will probably be fixed by the next release patch I guess.

Awesome, thanks! :thumbup:

[gyrovague]

Upon re-reading the last two pages of this thread, I think I need to state some further clarification: The AUTO and AUTO SRCH ACQ modes will indeed automatically try to get a TCS contrast lock on a target IF you're in the TCS slave mode (i.e. TCS slaved to radar, AND radar has STT, and TCS not already tracking). The MAN ACQ mode together with TCS slave and radar STT will only follow the radar and not acquire a TCS lock by itself, and this is the combination used for boresight trim alignment.

 

In the independent and radar slave modes, it requires half-action to slew TCS and full action to initiate an AUTO or AUTO SRCH or MANUAL acquisition.

 

The next patch also includes a small fix, the TCS LoS was accidentally not displayed on the HUD in the TCS slave mode.

[QuiGon]

Upon re-reading the last two pages of this thread, I think I need to state some further clarification: The AUTO and AUTO SRCH ACQ modes will indeed automatically try to get a TCS contrast lock on a target IF you're in the TCS slave mode (i.e. TCS slaved to radar, AND radar has STT, and TCS not already tracking). The MAN ACQ mode together with TCS slave and radar STT will only follow the radar and not acquire a TCS lock by itself, and this is the combination used for boresight trim alignment.

Thanks for pointing this out. Although I was talking about radar independent usage of the TCS on the previous pages, it's good to be aware of these specifics when it comes to slaved usage :thumbup:

 

In the independent and radar slave modes, it requires half-action to slew TCS and full action to initiate an AUTO or AUTO SRCH or MANUAL acquisition.

Yeah, I was hoping that the TCS AUTO SRCH would work entirely by itself, so that in independend mode you could have the TCS automatically searching for targets up front, while manually working with the radar meanwhile. Unfortunately that is not how it works as I have learned from this thread.

 

The next patch also includes a small fix, the TCS LoS was accidentally not displayed on the HUD in the TCS slave mode.

Awesome, that will address the second issue of this thread: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=253231

Thanks a lot! :thumbup:

[lucky-hendrix]

 

The next patch also includes a small fix, the TCS LoS was accidentally not displayed on the HUD in the TCS slave mode.

 

What do you mean exactly ? It seems that currently only in Sidewinder mode the pilot had a HUD diamond in TCS lock.do you mean that in the future the TCS lock will be visible by the pilot when other weapons are selected ?

 

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[QuiGon]

What do you mean exactly ? It seems that currently only in Sidewinder mode the pilot had a HUD diamond in TCS lock.do you mean that in the future the TCS lock will be visible by the pilot when other weapons are selected ?

 

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

That's wrong. The pilot already has a TCS lock indicator in the HUD, regardless of weapon selected, but the actual symbol depends on the selected weapon. When PH/SP or no weapon is selected, the TCS lock will be indicated by the big + symbol in the HUD, when SW is selected, the TCS lock will be indicated by the diamond symbol (unless a radar lock exists in which case there will be no indication for TCS as both symbols are already in use for other things).

 

It's explained in the manual: http://www.heatblur.se/F-14Manual/weapons.html#hud-symbology-for-air-to-air-missiles

The Movable Reticle (called pipper for air to ground and gun employment) and the Target Designator can show different things depending on current situation. The Movable Reticle shows current TCS line of sight if it exists at the same time as a radar STT lock except for when AIM-9s are selected. In the AIM-9 case it instead shows current AIM-9 seeker head line of sight.

The Target Designator diamond shows current radar STT line of sight if present and if not it instead shows the current TCS line of sight.

So effectually the TCS line of sight can be shown either by the movable reticle or the target designator depending on if a radar STT is also present and if a radar STT is present with AIM-9 selected it’s not shown at all.

The problem, which will be fixed in the upcomming patch, is that the TCS lock indication is entirely missing in TCS SLAVED mode and is currently only displayed in INDEPENDENT or RDR SLAVED mode (a switch in the rear cockpit). That has nothing to do with weapon selection.

Edited October 28, 2019 by QuiGon

[Top Jockey]

Upon re-reading the last two pages of this thread, I think I need to state some further clarification: The AUTO and AUTO SRCH ACQ modes will indeed automatically try to get a TCS contrast lock on a target IF you're in the TCS slave mode (i.e. TCS slaved to radar, AND radar has STT, and TCS not already tracking). The MAN ACQ mode together with TCS slave and radar STT will only follow the radar and not acquire a TCS lock by itself, and this is the combination used for boresight trim alignment.

 

In the independent and radar slave modes, it requires half-action to slew TCS and full action to initiate an AUTO or AUTO SRCH or MANUAL acquisition.

 

The next patch also includes a small fix, the TCS LoS was accidentally not displayed on the HUD in the TCS slave mode.

 

Outstanding!

 

By the way now that we are at it, sometimes the TCS LoS ceases to appear after roughly 10 minutes of testing with it, (in either of the acquisition or slave modes).

 

I'm not sure if I read that the TCS has some overheating time failure implemented or so, eitherway it's an heads-up.

 

I believe it came to appear again, after tweaking with the master modes - slecting AG mode and coming to AA mode again.

Edited October 28, 2019 by Top Jockey

[QuiGon]

Outstanding!

 

By the way now that we are at it, sometimes the TCS LoS ceases to appear after roughly 10 minutes of testing with it, (in either of the acquisition or slave modes).

 

I'm not sure if I read that the TCS has some overheating time failure implemented or so, eitherway it's an heads-up.

 

I believe it came to appear again, after tweaking with the master modes - slecting AG mode and coming to AA mode again.

Never encountered such an issue myself. Maybe the TCS has just lost it's lock or you have been using a wrong master mode?

[Top Jockey]

Never encountered such an issue myself. Maybe the TCS has just lost it's lock or you have been using a wrong master mode?

 

About the wrong master mode, it's possible but I don't remember right now.

On the TCS lock, is was maintained as the target bomber was still locked at the VDI; just the TCS LoS cross didn't apear on the HUD after some 10 minutes experimenting or so.

 

But I'll have to experiment more to be sure.

[Hummingbird]

Is it possible to get Jester to put the TCS into search mode so that you can search for a target with your radar off, kinda like the Su27 uses its EO system?

[QuiGon]

Is it possible to get Jester to put the TCS into search mode so that you can search for a target with your radar off, kinda like the Su27 uses its EO system?

AFAIK you can't tell Jester to do that (yet), but I'm not sure as I don't fly with Jester. A human RIO can do so and it's great fun to conduct sneak attacks, although you got to get pretty close, as the Tomcat doesn't have the long range IR missiles of the Su-27.

[Banzaiib]

Is it possible to get Jester to put the TCS into search mode so that you can search for a target with your radar off, kinda like the Su27 uses its EO system?

 

While they're at it, I sure would like to be able to "unlock" the TCS. Very often I'm in a dog fight and lock a buddy, then unlock him, but the TCS stays on him, even after i've re-STT locked another target.

[QuiGon]

While they're at it, I sure would like to be able to "unlock" the TCS. Very often I'm in a dog fight and lock a buddy, then unlock him, but the TCS stays on him, even after i've re-STT locked another target.

That sounds like a bug, because if the TCS is in TCS SLAVED mode (as it always is when Jester acts as your RIO as far as I know), then it should always lock on the target that is locked by the radar, unless the new target is in very close prximity to the old target, so the TCS can't really distinguis which of the two has been locked by the radar. I have never personally experienced such behaviour though :dunno:

[Hummingbird]

That sounds like a bug, because if the TCS is in TCS SLAVED mode (as it always is when Jester acts as your RIO as far as I know), then it should always lock on the target that is locked by the radar, unless the new target is in very close prximity to the old target, so the TCS can't really distinguis which of the two has been locked by the radar. I have never personally experienced such behaviour though :dunno:

 

It does happen quite often, sometimes the TCS will even lock on to your own missile you just fired instead of the target locked by the radar.

[TLTeo]

AFAIK you can't tell Jester to do that (yet), but I'm not sure as I don't fly with Jester. A human RIO can do so and it's great fun to conduct sneak attacks, although you got to get pretty close, as the Tomcat doesn't have the long range IR missiles of the Su-27.

 

 

You could probably fire a Phoenix in ACM mode while doing that. Not as reliable as an R-27T, but it could be a terrifying combo in the right situation.

[QuiGon]

It does happen quite often, sometimes the TCS will even lock on to your own missile you just fired instead of the target locked by the radar.

Right, I have had this happening before, indeed. That happens, because the missile will block the entire LOS of the TCS and so the only thing the TCS can see is the missile and hence it follows it. It should lock on another target though as soon as you lock one up with your radar.

 

 

You could probably fire a Phoenix in ACM mode while doing that. Not as reliable as an R-27T, but it could be a terrifying combo in the right situation.

It will warn the enemy though, because of teh active radar of the Phoenix. So it's pretty much the same as locking someone up with your onboard radar and launching a normal radar guided missile (e.g. a Sparrow) at them. That's one of the great advantages of the IR missiles, as they don't warn the enemy (unless they have an MWS which is rather seldom).

[TLTeo]

True, but on the bright side the enemy only knows of the Phoenix's radar rather than yours, and also it has way more energy available than an R-27T. I'm just saying, if I was trying to sneak up on someone like that, that's what I would try first.

[QuiGon]

True, but on the bright side the enemy only knows of the Phoenix's radar rather than yours, and also it has way more energy available than an R-27T. I'm just saying, if I was trying to sneak up on someone like that, that's what I would try first.

Fair enough :thumbup:

[Hummingbird]

True, but on the bright side the enemy only knows of the Phoenix's radar rather than yours, and also it has way more energy available than an R-27T. I'm just saying, if I was trying to sneak up on someone like that, that's what I would try first.

 

But are the Phoenixes active off the rails in ACM mode?

[QuiGon]

But are the Phoenixes active off the rails in ACM mode?

Yes, that's what ACM mode is all about.

[Top Jockey]

It does happen quite often, sometimes the TCS will even lock on to your own missile you just fired instead of the target locked by the radar.

 

I suppose that the TCS lock changing to the instantly fired missile, might also be because of the missile's very bright exaust flame (which does a considerable image contrast)... so it somewhat makes sense.

[Top Jockey]

Yes, that's what ACM mode is all about.

 

I'm not much of an expert on radar-guided missiles, but I thought that to fire the AIM-54 with its own radar active off the rails was instead "boresight mode"...

[QuiGon]

I'm not much of an expert on radar-guided missiles, but I thought that to fire the AIM-54 with its own radar active off the rails was instead "boresight mode"...

That is true, but it's a function of ACM mode: http://www.heatblur.se/F-14Manual/weapons.html#acm-active

[Top Jockey]

That is true, but it's a function of ACM mode: http://www.heatblur.se/F-14Manual/weapons.html#acm-active

 

Yep that's right, I didn't recall it because I rarely use the ACM switch - I use to go directly to the "missile mode" pushbutton (NORM / BRSIT).

 

Interesting to see the AIM-54 lock and track a target even with the AWG-9 radar completely switched off.

Also tried with the AIM-7, but being a SARH missile obviously can't do that.