Hornet HMD Crosshair

[hein22]

So I never understood the point of making the crosshair go offcenter when looking up. What is that about? Is it correctly modeled? Thanks.

[Swift.]

So I never understood the point of making the crosshair go offcenter when looking up. What is that about? Is it correctly modeled? Thanks.

 

because it saves you having to angle your head all the way back, in the same way when you look at the ceiling your eyes also go up.

[hein22]

because it saves you having to angle your head all the way back, in the same way when you look at the ceiling your eyes also go up.

 

? Are you describing some sort of cheap simulation of eyes or something? Didn't catch any of what you said, sorry. Let's do it again: Is that offcenter thing a real thing in the aircraft or just in DCS? If it is real, why is it?

Edited October 3, 2020 by hein22

[Swift.]

? Are you describing some sort of cheap simulation of eyes or something? Didn't catch any of what you said, sorry. Let's do it again: Is that offcenter thing a real thing in the aircraft or just in DCS? If it is real, why is it?

 

It is something in real life.

 

Because, as I said, it's very hard to look up with only your head. The JHMCS only follows head movements not eye movements.

 

Do this little demonstration: either put on some glasses with a dot of blue tack or something in the centre, the try and put that 'reticule' over a target that is above you. Or do the same by looking at the tip of your nose and trying to put that over something above you.

 

You'll find that you cant really look above about 70 degrees. Now imagine doing the same thing, but under 7g with a kilogram of weight handing off your face.

 

Now you understand why the crosshair needs to move upwards?

[hein22]

It is something in real life.

 

Because, as I said, it's very hard to look up with only your head. The JHMCS only follows head movements not eye movements.

 

Do this little demonstration: either put on some glasses with a dot of blue tack or something in the centre, the try and put that 'reticule' over a target that is above you. Or do the same by looking at the tip of your nose and trying to put that over something above you.

 

You'll find that you cant really look above about 70 degrees. Now imagine doing the same thing, but under 7g with a kilogram of weight handing off your face.

 

Now you understand why the crosshair needs to move upwards?

 

Oh, roger. I see what you said before now. Sorry. Thanks.

[Swift.]

Oh, roger. I see what you said before now. Sorry. Thanks.

 

No worries, its hard to cross conceptualise from a game to RL sometimes.

[hein22]

No worries, its hard to cross conceptualise from a game to RL sometimes.

 

The thing is that this concept is kind of an accelerated view like track ir. And when you actually use a track ir and also have that accelerated crosshair makes it feel weird. But yeah, I see now why it was done like that... Real life applied track ir xd

[Hog_No32]

The thing is that this concept is kind of an accelerated view like track ir. And when you actually use a track ir and also have that accelerated crosshair makes it feel weird. But yeah, I see now why it was done like that... Real life applied track ir xd

 

Actually the same behavior can be observed even WHEN using TrackIR :smilewink:

 

When I have to look at an object that is exactly on my 9 o‘clock with TrackIR, I don‘t turn my head so much that I have the 9 o‘clock position in the center of my view because my eyes will already have moved to the left edge of the screen. The center of my FOV is probably at the 10 or 10.30. The same happens when I look inside for a switch deep down in the cockpit.

[hein22]

Actually the same behavior can be observed even WHEN using TrackIR :smilewink:

 

When I have to look at an object that is exactly on my 9 o‘clock with TrackIR, I don‘t turn my head so much that I have the 9 o‘clock position in the center of my view because my eyes will already have moved to the left edge of the screen. The center of my FOV is probably at the 10 or 10.30. The same happens when I look inside for a switch deep down in the cockpit.

 

Yeah that's what I wanted to say, :). That they are the same concept that overlap eachother in DCS but obviously not IRL, unless they use track ir xd

[imacken]

because it saves you having to angle your head all the way back, in the same way when you look at the ceiling your eyes also go up.

 

I'm seeing the opposite. What you say makes sense, but the HMD crosshair is about 16 degrees below not above.

 

Same in Viper and A-10C II.

[Swift.]

I'm seeing the opposite. What you say makes sense, but the HMD crosshair is about 16 degrees below not above.

 

Same in Viper and A-10C II.

 

Thats because you are looking down, the crosshair is directly in the middle of the screen.

[imacken]

That's the point, I'm not looking down. I'm looking directly at the VVI and moving my head slightly to the right. The HMD cross hair starts at around -16 degrees.

[Swift.]

That's the point, I'm not looking down. I'm looking directly at the VVI and moving my head slightly to the right. The HMD cross hair starts at around -16 degrees.

 

I'm confused, you are very clearly not looking directly at the VVI. I assume here we are defining 'looing at' as having the object in the centre of the screen. I fear this might be because the default head position for hornet has you looking down towards the UFC.

[imacken]

Sorry, I said I was looking directly at the VVI and then moving my head slightly to the right to bring in the HMD. Same horizontal orientation.

It’s the same situation in the Viper and A-10C HMCS.

[imacken]

I think I'll start another thread on this in the main DCS area, as I've wondered about this for some time now.

[Swift.]

You keep saying you are looking straight at the VVI, but you just aren't. Your "head" is angled downwards, as shown by the fact the centre of the screen is positioned over the glareshield.

 

Edit: For reference this is what 'looking at the VVI' looks like

Edited October 4, 2020 by Swiftwin9s

[imacken]

I'm not looking down. See attached. I'm staring straight at the VVI and you can see where the HMD cross is and the angle says -12.

The 2nd attachment is what I see if the HMD crosshair is in the middle of the screen. No DDIs in view.

[imacken]

Looking into this a bit more, it looks like there are loads of threads on this subject, i.e. the HMD position being too low. Also, looking at Wags' and others videos, they have the same situation on the Hornet. The HMD is very low compared to the start view.

I think the issue is that the HMD crosshair is positioned at the centre of the screen, but the VVI in normal startup view - which is what we tend to align to - is above that which causes the HMD crosshair to be low.

Attached another example from a YT tutorial.

[Swift.]

Yeah as I said, people are thrown because ED place the default view looking down. The JHMCS DAC itself is fine where it is, people just need to look up more.

[imacken]

Yeah as I said, people are thrown because ED place the default view looking down. The JHMCS DAC itself is fine where it is, people just need to look up more.

 

Fair enough, but in that case they should raise it. If one adopted a view compatible with the HMD crosshair being centred, then you can’t see any of the DDIs. Doesn’t make sense to me.

[Swift.]

If they raise the JHMCS it would go off screen when you zoom. If they raise the default head position, non head track users wouldn't be able to use the DDIs. The way it is now is fine, if you have head tracking then it no trouble to just point and shoot with the DAC

[imacken]

Well, I’m afraid I, and many others by the look of it, wouldn’t agree. I find it awkward and difficult to use as my head is tilted too far back at times. So much so, that the TIR loses contact with the LEDs temporarily.

[Svend_Dellepude]

Reposition your head position to look straight and save it pressing R_ALT + keypad 0. It's a pretty easy fix.

[imacken]

Sorry, but that is not the answer. It’s not about repositioning your head, it’s about the positioning of the HMD crosshair relative to the ‘default’ view.

 

For example, in level flight say, we tend to look at the VVI which is roughly on the horizon. Now, that is higher up than the centre of the screen so we can see the DDIs. Switch on the HMD and you’ll see the crosshair is always in the screen centre, i.e. well below where the default tends to be.

 

See the various attachments above.

[imacken]

To add to the confusion here, the HMD crosshairs are perfectly aligned with the VVI/horizon in VR. All 3 modules - A-10C II, Viper and Hornet - are all perfect.

 

So, I don't know what is going on with TIR.