Considering addition Gunfighter stick for Viper

[dburne]

Ok so I have spent the last few months finally learning a module good enough to be able to do some good single player campaign flying - the Hornet. I love this jet and especially love the ability to fly carrier ops with it.

I use a VKB Gunfighter Pro Mk III with Ultimate grip and 200mm extension center mounted, for both WWII birds along with the Hornet.

 

I would like to now delve into learning another module. As much as I like carrier ops, I am thinking instead to go with the Viper for this one. In fact I already own the Viper, but also I already own the Tomcat. But I am more inclined to the Viper as it is a more modern jet and even though I will not be able to do carrier ops with it I still feel it would be a good fit for me to learn after the Hornet. 

 

What I am considering - getting another VKB Gunfighter with Ultimate grip just for the Viper. And the only reason I am even considering spending the money, is to mount it to a shorter Monster Tech table mount and have it on my right side, rather than center mounted like I have my extended Gunfighter. I would use the short table mount along with no extension, or maybe the shorter 100mm extension not real sure.

 

So am I crazy for even considering this? Or should I just continue using what I have with my 200mm extended center mount Gunfighter and save the bucks?

Ah decisions decisions...

Edited August 2, 2021 by dburne

[MAXsenna]

Ok so I have spent the last few months finally learning a module good enough to be able to do some good single player campaign flying - the Hornet. I love this jet and especially love the ability to fly carrier ops with it.
I use a VKB Gunfighter Pro Mk III with Ultimate grip and 200mm extension center mounted, for both WWII birds along with the Hornet.
 
I would like to now delve into learning another module. As much as I like carrier ops, I am thinking instead to go with the Viper for this one. In fact I already own the Viper, but also I already own the Tomcat. But I am more inclined to the Viper as it is a more modern jet and even though I will not be able to do carrier ops with it I still feel it would be a good fit for me to learn after the Hornet. 
 
What I am considering - getting another VKB Gunfighter with Ultimate grip just for the Viper. And the only reason I am even considering spending the money, is to mount it to a shorter Monster Tech table mount and have it on my right side, rather than center mounted like I have my extended Gunfighter. I would use the short table mount along with no extension, or maybe the shorter 100mm extension not real sure.
 
So am I crazy for even considering this? Or should I just continue using what I have with my 200mm extended center mount Gunfighter and save the bucks?
Ah decisions decisions...

No, you are nowhere near crazy.
But I'd suggest you go another route if money is no option. Get a Warthog/Viper grip/base and get rel4y's force mod when he releases it, or just go partial or full Realsimulator.
For me that would be the best fit for the F-16.
Cheers!

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[dburne]

22 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

No, you are nowhere near crazy.
But I'd suggest you go another route if money is no option. Get a Warthog/Viper grip/base and get rel4y's force mod when he releases it, or just go partial or full Realsimulator.
For me that would be the best fit for the F-16.
Cheers!

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk
 

 

Hmm interesting , in fact I already have a Warthog stick sitting here in retirement. Thanks much gives me another option to think about. 

Edited August 2, 2021 by dburne

[Lynchsl62]

For the Viper, and to be honest any modern FBW plane, I would only recommend the Realsimulator FSSB R3 base as a force sensing base. It is based on the Thrustmaster pin connector so is incompatible with VKB grips, but then Realsimulator make some amazing grips too, with an F-35 grip in the pipeline. I have the FSSB R3 and the Realsimulator F-18 Grip mounted on a MonsterTech with 100 mm extension, it can be used either centre mount or Right Hand mount as in the Viper etc. I do have the Realsimulator F16 grip but that is used for the Warbirds with a Brunner FFB base

 

The Thrustmaster grip is weak at the mounting point and there are reports of the grip failing at the base when used with the Realsimulator base. The Realsimulator grips have a much extended and secured collar compared to the Thrustmaster nut

 

I have the MCG Ultimate as well and it is fantastic, just incompatible with the bases I have and is sadly only really used for Russian jets Mig-19 and Mig-21. These jets use hydraulics and do not have any force feedback so the Gunfighter base and MCG Ultimate are not a compromise. Just wish that there was an interface to allow the VKB grip to be used on a Thrustmaster pin mount base

[Munkwolf]

4 hours ago, Lynchsl62 said:

For the Viper, and to be honest any modern FBW plane, I would only recommend the Realsimulator FSSB R3 base as a force sensing base.

 

[...]

 

The Thrustmaster grip is weak at the mounting point and there are reports of the grip failing at the base when used with the Realsimulator base. The Realsimulator grips have a much extended and secured collar compared to the Thrustmaster nut

 

+1 for RealSimulator. I got the FSSB base, used it with TM Warthog, and it was good but I couldn't get it to attach as solid as I wanted. There'd be a slight pop moving vertically across center I couldn't totally get rid of. Got the RealSimulator grip, and then it felt great. The Viper is slowly becoming my main because of how great it feels to fly with the FSSB + RS F16 grip.

[dburne]

It all looks very tempting just not sure I want to invest that much money in a new stick at this time.

Thanks so much for the info.

I will have to consider though...

[dburne]

Ok so, if I should get this:

https://realsimulator.com/fssb-r3-lighting/

 

I just easily replace the base of my Warthog with this and can mount it to my Monster Tech stand with Warthog plate no problem right?

[MAXsenna]

Ok so, if I should get this:
https://realsimulator.com/fssb-r3-lighting/
 
I just easily replace the base of my Warthog with this and can mount it to my Monster Tech stand with Warthog plate no problem right?

And if you're worried about metal fatigue in the Warthog grip mount, (for lack of better words), there are collars out there one can buy, or just make one yourself.
Cheers!

PS: I'm on the fence of getting the FSSB3 R3 myself. Like I wrote, I'm waiting to see if rel4y will have his version out soon. His solution will be mounted as a replacement in the original Cougar/Warthog base. And he might also have a replacement mounting collar.

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[dburne]

15 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

And if you're worried about metal fatigue in the Warthog grip mount, (for lack of better words), there are collars out there one can buy, or just make one yourself.
Cheers!

PS: I'm on the fence of getting the FSSB3 R3 myself. Like I wrote, I'm waiting to see if rel4y will have his version out soon. His solution will be mounted as a replacement in the original Cougar/Warthog base. And he might also have a replacement mounting collar.

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk
 

 

If I should do this I will likely get the RealSim F16 grip with it also.

[dburne]

2 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

And if you're worried about metal fatigue in the Warthog grip mount, (for lack of better words), there are collars out there one can buy, or just make one yourself.
Cheers!

PS: I'm on the fence of getting the FSSB3 R3 myself. Like I wrote, I'm waiting to see if rel4y will have his version out soon. His solution will be mounted as a replacement in the original Cougar/Warthog base. And he might also have a replacement mounting collar.

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk
 

 

can you elaborate a little on this rel4y version?

I must say watching some of the videos on their website it seems a fairly complex piece of hardware and software. Seems they are closed for the month of August so I have some time for deciding on this.

 

Just to be clear - should I get the FSSB3-R3 Lighting along with their F-16 Grip, I would have no need for using any of my Warthog correct? I would just simply mount it to a Monster Tech Mount with Warthog plate?

Also I would only want to use it to generate DX buttons like my other sticks, along with the axis of course, so can do that also correct?

 

I guess on the other hand I could consider just getting an F-16 TM grip to put on my Warthog and use it which would certainly be a cheaper option. But then I am back to using a Warthog for the F-16...

 

Edited August 3, 2021 by dburne

[Munkwolf]

2 hours ago, dburne said:

Just to be clear - should I get the FSSB3-R3 Lighting along with their F-16 Grip, I would have no need for using any of my Warthog correct? I would just simply mount it to a Monster Tech Mount with Warthog plate?

Also I would only want to use it to generate DX buttons like my other sticks, along with the axis of course, so can do that also correct?

 

I guess on the other hand I could consider just getting an F-16 TM grip to put on my Warthog and use it which would certainly be a cheaper option. But then I am back to using a Warthog for the F-16...

 

I find the RS F-16 grip to work a lot better than the Warthog on the FSSB. Seems to be case-by-case. When I mentioned on hoggit how I couldn't get the Warthog to seat solidly on the FSSB, some people commented they didn't have that issue. I tried it with 2 different Warthog grips, same thing, just one better/worse than the other (slight shift/pop crossing the center vertically.. I was using the angle adapter, maybe that was the issue. When using the RS F-16, it uses the straight adapter since the stick is 1:1 with proper curve so angle adapter isn't needed like with Warthog).

 

The RS F-16 also made me realize when it comes to metal vs lightness, I prefer a light grip (the RS F-16 feels like it's a tenth of the weight of the Warthog). Between how solid the attachment mechanism is for the RS F-16, and how light it is, it feels more precise than the Warthog did. Just the slightest pressure and there's response, where the weight of the Warthog kind of dampened that. The construction/feel of it reminds me of the VKB MCG Pro. (MCG Ultimate really set a new standard for feel vs weight, imo).

 

Another little side note that might be easily missed in the product details for the RS F-16 grip is all the buttons/hats are 5-ways switches (even nws and weapon release). That was big for me because I could mirror how I've got my MCG Ultimate setup (my center stick), with zoom/etc functions on the side hat. Also, under the trim hat is a rotary that allows you to easily switch between configurations.

 

Configuration software is pretty flexible with what you can do with the buttons and such. Here's a screen of it from a different thread I found via google images:

 

 

updated pic of it as my side stick and vkb as center stick in last comment in my rig thread:

 

Edited August 3, 2021 by Munkwolf

[Lynchsl62]

3 hours ago, dburne said:

 

can you elaborate a little on this rel4y version?

I must say watching some of the videos on their website it seems a fairly complex piece of hardware and software. Seems they are closed for the month of August so I have some time for deciding on this.

 

Just to be clear - should I get the FSSB3-R3 Lighting along with their F-16 Grip, I would have no need for using any of my Warthog correct? I would just simply mount it to a Monster Tech Mount with Warthog plate?

Also I would only want to use it to generate DX buttons like my other sticks, along with the axis of course, so can do that also correct?

 

I guess on the other hand I could consider just getting an F-16 TM grip to put on my Warthog and use it which would certainly be a cheaper option. But then I am back to using a Warthog for the F-16...

 

 

The standard Thrustmaster Warthog grip is the same as the Thrustmaster F-16 grip, don’t waste any money on that as it offers nothing.

 

I have the FSSB R3 mounted on the Monster Tech mount and indeed the mounting plate is all that you need to mount on the MonsterTech desk mount, though to be honest I just bought a new assembly. I think you have the long desk mount so I would order a standard desk mount. I also have a Sahaj 100 mm extension specially for the Realsimulator (i gave him the dimensions of the sleeve nut), this is because the Realsimulator F-16 and F-18 extended sleeve nut does not fit over the standard extension tubes from Virpil, MFG or even the standard Sahaj extension. See the picture of the FSSB R3/F-18 grip versus the Gunfighter/MCG Ulimate bases and rips mounted on the MonsterTech standard desk mounts

 

For the F-18 I have the standard finish and actually the rough finish is good when used, it feels strong and pleasant to use, much higher quality that the Virpil, or VKB plastics and the buttons are superb quality. The F-16 grip is the Custom Edition which has a smoother finish, which I don’t like as much as the standard finish. There is a new rubberised finish, but the cost delta is excessive. Both the F-18 and the F-16 have the Bluetooth (the reason for purchasing the Custom Edition) and can be used with any other base and still retain added functionality, but this in no use to you as the FSSB would cover the functionality. I am waiting to see the details on the F-35 grip and if it has the paddle (which the F-16 does but the F-18 grip doesn’t) I am pretty sure I will purchase it. 

 

One thing to add is the customer support, I have emailed them once and got immediate response - the trigger on the F-18 was getting sticky. They are a small company and provide excellent customer support - check out the forums - not many posts there really but they usually are addressed - better than VKB and Virpil

 

http://www.realsimulator.com/FSSB_R3_Forum/index.php?sid=863e6d618765863f3d8157a9388abe91

 

With the FSSB base you input a demand by entering a force to the grip (the extension tube helps, but the software allows you to set the force range to lower values). That input then creates a changes in state of the plane. The plane maintains that change of state even when you then remove the force on the grip, e.g there is no centering effect - where the plane attempt to restore to the original state as would be the case with a standard base. To change the plane state requires further force input. This does not sound significant but it is intuitive and makes flying FBW planes super precise. There is also no centre dead zone required

 

Edited August 3, 2021 by Lynchsl62

[dburne]

Interesting, thanks so much for the great replies guys!

I certainly have some good stuff to mull over on this one.