correct as-is TRIM nullify user inputs

[daemon1808]

Hi,

I have figure out why it is very hard to use the trim in this helo, and maybe the reason that other players have similar problems.

Sorry, but I can't share a track because it needs "user" inputs to reproduce this behaviour and it happens only sometimes.

- Using VR, Hotas X and "Central position trimmer mode" both for strick and rudders

- After a short flight trying to stop and hover again.

- Move the rudder to the left one cm or so (example)

- Click on trim hold mode R/Up to trim that position, and release the rudder.

- The rudder is now locked in that point, as the X show in the "control indicator" diagram (as expected)

- Try to move the rudder again in the same direction (left)

- It doesn't adknowledge user left input, no matter how far you go left with the rudder. Until you input right with the rudder, it seems to ignore the left inputs.

-It happen the same with the stick: ie: you trim stick forward, release stick. Try to go forward again with the stick, but it ignore your forward input, until you input backward and then forward again.

Very weird and hard to tell under what circunstances it happens.

 

[cow_art]

You probably have the central trimmer mode enabled. In that mode you need to re-center your controls after pressing the trim button. Until you do that, all inputs are ignored.

It's meant to emulate a force trim system with regular spring-joysticks. In this mode  "trim up" essentially sets a new center point for your virtual controls and then waits until you have centered your physical stick/rudder pedals. Once you get used to it, it works alright. But it's a bit of a confusing and error-prone system nevertheless. I wish they would add an option where the physical controls are only disabled for a short time instead of turning them off until you have precisely hit the center point of your controls...

Edited March 19, 2022 by cow_art

[daemon1808]

 

You mean recenter physically the stick/rudders? I'm releasing the controls after every trim (what makes the controls to recenter, thanks to the springs)

Check my steps.

Rudder left, trim, release controls (they recenter by themselves), left again(not working), right, left again(now it works)

Same for the stick: forward, trim, release controls (recenter by itself), forward (not working), backward, forward again (now it works)

Maybe the auto-recentering is so quick that the game does not take it?

[cow_art]

Are you sure your controls REALLY recenter completely when you release them? Perhaps you don't have them calibrated perfectly and they don't go precisely to the center point. (check in the control indicator and if they don't snap back to the exact center, then perhaps add a little bit of deadzone).

[daemon1808]

Yes, completely recentered and calibrated (checked in windows configuration).

And yes, I have tried with a deadzone of 3-5 (for the laughs, because up today they doesn't need to) ^_^

[daemon1808]

After some trial and error, I have found that this behaviour is caused by the quick movement of the controls returning to the central position.

Sometimes, the time span between the click for the trim and the release of the control is so tiny, that the game doesn't notice it.

So, sometimes the user inputs are ignored because the game doesn't realize that the controls have been recentered. Another times the trim is done after the release of the controls (in this cases the trim doesn't change the position of the detent)

The "workarround" is lengthening the time between the "trim click" and the release of the controls, but is a pain most of the times. It's a pity because in flight forward the apache is very nice to fly (good work ED), but trying to stop into a hover sometimes is suicidal.

Curious thing is that the huey have a similar trim system, but this doesn't happen to it. Should it be possible to match more closely the trim system to the one in the huey? ^_^

[shagrat]

vor 17 Stunden schrieb daemon1808:

After some trial and error, I have found that this behaviour is caused by the quick movement of the controls returning to the central position.

Sometimes, the time span between the click for the trim and the release of the control is so tiny, that the game doesn't notice it.

So, sometimes the user inputs are ignored because the game doesn't realize that the controls have been recentered. Another times the trim is done after the release of the controls (in this cases the trim doesn't change the position of the detent)

The "workarround" is lengthening the time between the "trim click" and the release of the controls, but is a pain most of the times. It's a pity because in flight forward the apache is very nice to fly (good work ED), but trying to stop into a hover sometimes is suicidal.

Curious thing is that the huey have a similar trim system, but this doesn't happen to it. Should it be possible to match more closely the trim system to the one in the huey? ^_^

For me it helped, to press and hold the Force Trim Release button depressed, whenever you maneuver, turn, etc. and release it only, when you reach a stable attitude. The trim action happens in release of the button.