Detecting enemies; Labels-on to easy, Labels-Off to hard

[Belphe]

Am I being too patriotic or is this Hind Polish? ;>

[ZaltysZ]

Am I being too patriotic or is this Hind Polish? ;>

 

I think it is Hungarian.

[Jg2001_Rasputin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mangaroca

Am I being too patriotic or is this Hind Polish? ;>

 

I think it is Hungarian.

 

dunno, theres a simmilar hungarian

 

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[eV1Te]

he's in the bottom right corner

 

Bottom right corner.

 

1. The helo does not move on the screenshot, which makes it hard to spot.

2. A helo is painted with camo, so an overflying plane does NOT see it. If you'd see it easily, the designers should reconsider camo-colors.

3. You're way too high for a helo :D

 

That's correct, you must have laser targeting eyes, the reason I didn't take the screenshot in another angle is because I couldn't spot him myself (even though I used external view on him and myself) before he was this close. :music_whistling:

 

(Also in the upper parts of the HUD you have an entire air force base with 10+ incoming tanks/trucks/AAA, and the only thing you can spot from them is the fire from the already killed ones, which is well below 10 km away)

 

I only wanted to make a point to the guys that said that it was to easy to spot enemies in the game, when flying an a hilly landscape and in some other weather than plain daylight which this is, then the helos are always seen with the ground as the background and they are almost impossible to spot.

 

Edited January 14, 2009 by eV1Te

[deviletk]

I have always been amazed about pilots that do this in real life. They sure have more training then most of us in spotting, and its probably harder in real life to do this.

 

They do have something that we dont have as much of - communication with ground/air that can tell the pilot about land marks and what direction/distance from that landmark the target is. I too have really hard time with this in sims. Like flying the A-10 and spot targets that are on the move. So the briefing just tells you ABOUT where they should be, but since theyve moved even more because i was intercepted on the way... Well its hard. :) Hats of to the real pilots that do this in sharp situations. Briefings are being skipped many times by some players, and they are what really gives you the beefy info on what to expect, and where to expect it.

 

Maybe some day there will be a computer cheap enough for us that can run a simulator the same way as armed assault but with DCS realism in all parts. Then you can send out your forward observer teams - human controlled! ;)

[RedTiger]

Comparing real-life spotting ability with what you see in game, either way you slant it, is a bad idea.

 

If BS handles objects like LOMAC did, there are some inherent problems already in the sim. Objects in LOMAC on higher settings tend to become nearly invisible at even moderate ranges because the engine is attempting to render them in full detail instead of scaling them down to just a black blob place holder object. Aircraft even "close", close enough that an actual fighter pilot would be expected to see them (under 4nm) appear to be a few translucent pixels. Spotting these aircraft is very, very difficult.

 

It isn't so hard when you see them flying around in a somewhat parallel way, where their movement is very apparent. Its when they're flying right at you and not moving very much relative to you that I find difficult. Unfortunately this usually happens when they're shooting at you.

 

Depth perception on a monitor sucks. It sucks really, really bad. If I get killed by something I didn't see, its usually in the cases where depth perception is needed to see it. I purposely run LOMAC on a low LOD setting (in other words, the setting that determines how far out objects are rendered vs. how far out they appear to be black blobs) to compensate for this.

 

It makes air to ground too easy since vehicles stand out from far away, but it makes air to air more believable to me. I haven't played too much with the BS config settings, does it have a LOD setting like this?

Edited January 14, 2009 by RedTiger

[ddahlstrom]

I'm not a pilot, but I've taken a few flying lessons. Got as far as landing a plane once. One of the things I recall as being very difficult was looking for other air traffic in my flight path. My instructor would see a plane somewhere out there and point right at it, and even then I would have the hardest time seeing it. And even when I finally did, I was often surprised that he was ever able to pick out such a small speck in such a big sky. Of course, if I had continued, I'm sure that I would have gotten better at this, but it takes practice; so I don't think that I'd say that real life is dramatically easier. I would also take a small issue with the previous post about the lack of depth perception in the sim. By the time you get a few hundred feet away from your vehicle in real life, it's too far away (and your eyes are too close together) for depth perception to matter much. On the other hand situational awareness of the "big picture" is better in real life (although TrackIR makes up for some of this). But the bottom line is, whether its real life or a sim, locating distant objects while flying is not easy and takes practice to do it well.

[RedTiger]

The depth perception I'm talking about is when you have a fighter sized object on an intercept course for yours. It isn't moving relative to your canopy. Its just a handful of greyish pixels out in the wide blue sky. It is hard to convey the image of something that large getting bigger as it gets closer to you.

[geogob]

The depth perception I'm talking about is when you have a fighter sized object on an intercept course for yours. It isn't moving relative to your canopy. Its just a handful of greyish pixels out in the wide blue sky. It is hard to convey the image of something that large getting bigger as it gets closer to you.

 

Well what you describe here as being in game, I could say about exactly the same about an aircraft moving towards you in real life. Those are the hardest to spot because they don't move in your field of view. We use to say that nothing looks more like another aircraft moving towards you than a bug on your windshield.

[ZaltysZ]

Depth perception is overrated thing. It works good while playing basketball or driving car, however its usefulness decreases as range increases. In case when other aircraft is far away, not the eyes, but your brains are determining the range based on observed size of object (when true size is known). True measurement by eyes begins when they are focused to something closer than infinity.

 

In game the problem is not that you see only the dot, but that dot does not grow nicely: dot, dot, still dot, object. It means that there is problem determining the range if object flies into you or runs from you when it is at range between Max_object_range and Max_dot_range. We need to wait for future hardware. :)

Edited January 15, 2009 by ZaltysZ

[159th_Viper]

Turn the labels off and practice :)

 

I recall the first time I flew an Op sortie in LockOn.......I was useless, could'nt spot a building, never mind a Hostile Ground Unit........and got hopelessly lost to boot.....Ended up at Simpferpol IIRC, heading to Krymsk :music_whistling:

 

Now I can hold my own in most situations and very rarely fail to spot Units in time, often well out of WEZ parameters - all it takes is Virtual Flight Hours.

Edited January 15, 2009 by 159th_Viper