TGP Moving Target Mode incredible improved for AGM-65F usage

[Topper81]

I noticed that using the litening targeting pod in moving target mode in track mode, it's possible now since the last update to control the maverick seaker with the tdc.

That means now it's possible to assign several target without losing the track, which is great improvment

After moving the cross over the target, which appears if TGP is SOI pressing TDC down, you have to make the Maverick SOI, then it will acquire the target lock...

I haven't seen this feature somewhere else, so I made a short video...

 

Edited March 13, 2023 by Topper81

[BarTzi]

Not supposed to work like that but it's closer to a proper 'offset' than what we currently have

[NIGHTHAWK1]

I have watched your video a few times.  But - I just do not see some of the steps/target lock, soi changes etc.  Any chance you could either do it slower with explanations of each step or do a typed instructions.   thank you if you do.

[Lane]

For what i have understand you are using the offset and tdc is set as realistic ( depress for move ), meaning it redisgnate the target as you move the offset  im just not sure the Mav cross should follow as it do. I let more 

Edited March 14, 2023 by Lane

[Topper81]

4 hours ago, Lane said:

For what i have understand you are using the offset and tdc is set as realistic ( depress for move ), meaning it redisgnate the target as you move the offset  im just not sure the Mav cross should follow as it do. I let more 

 

Hi, setup as follows:

0. Create a mission with a group of severals vehicles and use litening TGP with AGM-65F and start the mission.

1. Setup: Left DDI: Store => AGM-65F; Right DDI: TGP

2. Make TGP SOI by pressing Sensor Control Swicht (=SCS) - right

3. Move the TGP over a moving target, press SCS - right twice if TGP is over the target, so that you have 2 vertical lines and the TGP follows the target

4. Press Throttle Designator Controller (=TDC) Depress, so that the offset cursor (cross) appears

5. Move the "offeset cursor" over any vehicle of the group using TDC Left / Right / Up / Down or it's axis

6. Press SCS - left to make the AGM-65F SOI. If you done everything right, the maverick is following the target

7 (Sometimes) if the Maverick does not track the target, press TDC - Depress again

8 Press Weapon Release Button

9 Press SCS - right again to make the TGP SOI

10 Repeat steps 5 - 9 for any other vehicle of the group

I also added the track of the youtube video, so you can take controll at any time or just use the mission...

Hope that helps...

mav_yt.trk

Edited March 14, 2023 by Topper81

[NIGHTHAWK1]

THANK YOU

[oldcrusty]

I didn't see any positive changes with moving target acquisition in this version of OB. If anything, the IR imaging took a step back... oh well.

The main issue for me is the pod's inability to define acquisition boundary around the target. For instance, say you have vehicles on the road (cluttered with light poles, dividers, barriers, etc.)  At certain distance, the vehicles can be picked up and locked (point track) easily. Their image 'fits' inside the pod's acq. area, around the crosshair. As you get closer, especially when zoomed in, this acquisition area remains the same but the vehicle image is bigger now and the pod has a tendency to lock any small object that fits the acq. area, instead of the vehicle. It locks on barriers, light poles and so forth.  I've seen the pod switch the PT lock on its own when getting real close or changing zoom.

The IR Mav has the same problem, although the way it should work is a bit different... where are you SMEs ?

[Lane]

9 hours ago, oldcrusty said:

I didn't see any positive changes with moving target acquisition in this version of OB. If anything, the IR imaging took a step back... oh well.

The main issue for me is the pod's inability to define acquisition boundary around the target. For instance, say you have vehicles on the road (cluttered with light poles, dividers, barriers, etc.)  At certain distance, the vehicles can be picked up and locked (point track) easily. Their image 'fits' inside the pod's acq. area, around the crosshair. As you get closer, especially when zoomed in, this acquisition area remains the same but the vehicle image is bigger now and the pod has a tendency to lock any small object that fits the acq. area, instead of the vehicle. It locks on barriers, light poles and so forth.  I've seen the pod switch the PT lock on its own when getting real close or changing zoom.

The IR Mav has the same problem, although the way it should work is a bit different... where are you SMEs ?

Ground moving target are not forcibly an easy task, never will be.  First as i see in your mention, it need be tried sometimes 2-3-5 times for get the acquisition on the target you want, let say the first tank of a 4 convoy.   at really far distance i generaly use the GMT radar for lock, make it designate the target, and for sure it will never be the first tank you want for stop the convoy but you have now a moving designation point.   the second part is slew the lighting pod to the this designation. move on and find the first tank. depending the distance you will need maybe try 2-3 times for get it.    as the radar is the designation point ( at contrario of a fixed waypoint (wupload) ), you can let it revert if you are not fast enough for move the TDC for slew ( sometimes it take the position of the "old designation" point as it is still in the GMT radar, but as it is still a moving point in the convoy, it is easy to try again lock your target.

 

I have see the same thing as you describe about the "box" size who seems totally off sometimes ( really large or really too small for pick the tank ).

 

The map marianas is a good example of how bad it can come when try pick up 4 target in a row with AGM in a coast road with cars, parking lot, and house all around the road. but im pretty sure it is realist, tpod are not a magic wand.

 

Edited March 15, 2023 by Lane

[oldcrusty]

11 minutes ago, Lane said:

Ground moving target are not forcibly an easy task, never will be.  First as i see in your mention, it need be tried sometimes 2-3-5 times for get the acquisition on the target you want, let say the first tank of a 4 convoy.   at really far distance i generaly use the GMT radar for lock, make it designate the target, and for sure it will never be the first tank you want for stop the convoy but you have now a moving designation point.   the second part is slew the lighting pod to the this designation. move on and find the first tank. depending the distance you will need maybe try 2-3 times for get it.    as the radar is the designation point ( at contrario of a fixed waypoint (wupload) ), you can let it revert if you are not fast enough for move the TDC for slew ( sometimes it take the position of the "old designation" point as it is still in the GMT radar, but as it is still a moving point in the convoy, it is easy to try again lock your target.

 

I have see the same thing as you describe about the "box" size who seems totally off sometimes ( really large or really too small for pick the tank ).

 

The map marianas is a good example of how bad it can come when try pick up 4 target in a row with AGM in a coast road with cars, parking lot, and house all around the road. but im pretty sure it is realist, tpod are not a magic wand.

 

 

Yep, 

Well, I got sort of spoiled with these IrMavs, using them on any type of targets including small and closely spaced unarmored vehicles (one missile should take care of all 4) but it's a game and I love to watch things blowing up... on a FLIR of course  

[Lane]

10 minutes ago, oldcrusty said:

Yep, 

Well, I got sort of spoiled with these IrMavs, using them on any type of targets including small and closely spaced unarmored vehicles (one missile should take care of all 4) but it's a game and I love to watch things blowing up... on a FLIR of course  

I know this feeling. This is why i was so much in love with the A10... haha.  it was really when the A10 just have been released from DCS, and honestly i don^t know if it was really realist, but it was just so much easy to take down a 8 units convoy with AGM. and whatch them hit one by one. and a little CBU 107 for for finish ?

Edited March 15, 2023 by Lane

[Topper81]

I just was happy to see some improvements here. I guess they did them but they hadn't finished them because they aren't in the logs, and there was no mini update etc. I hope to see more hornet improvements in the next updates and an explanation how it should work, but I'm still impressed by the lastest open beta and the implementation of multi threading is an acceptable reason that the Hornet needs to stand behind this time...

[CBStu]

I have had so little success w/ tpod + MavF that I just use the Mav F screen. I did notice a week or so ago that it seemed significantly easier to lock onto a line of 4 tanks one at a time. Next I will try using the tpod again. Do U prefer Litening or ATFlir?

[Lane]

On 3/21/2023 at 6:55 PM, CBStu said:

I have had so little success w/ tpod + MavF that I just use the Mav F screen. I did notice a week or so ago that it seemed significantly easier to lock onto a line of 4 tanks one at a time. Next I will try using the tpod again. Do U prefer Litening or ATFlir?

Coming from A10 and a lot of practice with it, i really like more the Lightning, but honestly i think it is just personal preferences.  As for contradict a bit myself, i can easely take down 4 moving target using the Tpod > Mav screen lock SOI > lock on Tpod again, but there's never any warranty to it, im just used to this procedure   i think it is realistic this way. There's a good benefit, let say you can't shot or you miss, you still got the target locked in the Tpod, making things easy on the second pass.  if you are unsure the Mav have lock on the right target, cage and uncage help. 

 

Not moving target but youi understand the idea:

nullnull

Edited March 24, 2023 by Lane

[oldcrusty]

I finally had a chance to run a test on Mav F slaved to ATFLIR (in ST DCS) and was nicely surprised to see the Mavs snapping to correct targets after handoff from the pod. There was no need for 'cage/uncage' insanity anymore.  

The vid also shows a heat sig test on moving and stationary vehicles. The movers started rolling from 0 mph and the recording starts about 2 min. after. Nothing new here, some vehicles show a vivid sig., mostly from engines and tires, some nothing at all. Same goes for parked vehicles.

 

[Lane]

Beautiful sky hehe