Bizzare targeting pod and laser designator behavior - cannot designate, slew, guide bombs in slaved mode

[PawlaczGMD]

I will try to produce a viable track later, but maybe someone can point out what I'm doing wrong.

I'm playing the 2nd mission of MAD campaign, you have to drop GBU-12 and laser guided rockets on waypoint targets.

Here is the issue: I select the waypoint on the UFC, and slave the pod to it by selecting slave. The pod points exactly at the target (building, vehicle, etc).

But, if I touch the TDC or press it, the pod jumps to some nearby, seemingly random location.

I can only come back to the waypoint target by pressing sensor control x2, but I cannot fine-tune it at all, because any TDC input ,slew or lock, makes the pod jump far away.

What's worse, if I drop a GBU-12 or fire a laser guided rocket, the munition guides not at the target that I'm seeing in the pod, but at that random point that TGP wants to jump to.

It works fine if I designate in SP mode, I can slew, enter area track, and hit the target with both bombs and rockets.

But slaving to a waypoint, it looked to me like the pod was actually aiming at a different point than it displays.

is this a bug, or am I doing something wrong? I followed a tutorial, and it just doesn't work for me.

[Wyvern]

try going to the radar, hit the unlock, then go the pod and try slaving now, it should work now.
it may be setting the SPI to where the RDR is pointing. 

Not sure if thats intended, but thats how i was fixing it.

[PawlaczGMD]

7 minutes ago, Wyvern said:

try going to the radar, hit the unlock, then go the pod and try slaving now, it should work now.
it may be setting the SPI to where the RDR is pointing. 

Not sure if thats intended, but thats how i was fixing it.

Interesting, never used the A2G radar yet. Is it also pressing sensor control twice while radar is SOI?

I will try that, but any idea on why it's locking some random point in the area? The behavior of the pod is so weird I can't imagine it's intended. 

The diamond and circle were also aligned on the HUD, I think so at least. 

[Wyvern]

I will have to check it myself

I haven't flown the JF-17 since the update

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

[BigBorner]

1 hour ago, Wyvern said:

try going to the radar, hit the unlock, then go the pod and try slaving now, it should work now.

Thats a good hint. AG Radar likes to set SPI randomly sometimes. 

Also, make sure you are within 20nm from the Target, otherwise Pod cant lock

[Wyvern]

that too

[PawlaczGMD]

17 hours ago, Wyvern said:

try going to the radar, hit the unlock, then go the pod and try slaving now, it should work now.
it may be setting the SPI to where the RDR is pointing. 

Not sure if thats intended, but thats how i was fixing it.

I've tried it again, and I think the radar trick fixed some of the issues, but I think it's still bugged or something.

I made a quick test mission, and I had to use the radar unlock to be able to slave to waypoints other than 1, but other than that it worked fine.

However I reflew the campaign mission, and here the radar unlock was not resolving my issue. I think I've narrowed it down, and completed the mission, but the way pod tracking works is extremely frustrating and unreliable.

If you slave to a waypoint, it seems that the pod is looking at the waypoint, but actually locking some random point 50-100m away. If I press TDC lock, it will try to jump there. If that point is close enough to the target, I can manually reslew to the target, and lock it in area or point, and then it works fine. But if I can't get a point lock, I am not sure if the pod is lasing the target or some random point nearby. Playing with the radar didn't fix it for me. This is very frustrating for fast and reliable target engagement.

A few times, I fired a rocket, and it was being guided to random empty space because I didn't follow this process.

Additionally, the pod is frequently losing track when flying over the target, and will suddenly jump to some point 50-100m away with no input, which can cause misses with LGB. Not sure if this is related to the main issue described here.

So far I was only able to reproduce it in the MAD campaign mission, and the track is very long and over the file limit. If someone wants it anyway, let me know. 

[Napillo]

46 minutes ago, PawlaczGMD said:

I had to use the radar unlock to be able to slave to waypoints other than 1,

Try switching the radar between slav/sp mode instead.

[PawlaczGMD]

9 minutes ago, Napillo said:

Try switching the radar between slav/sp mode instead.

I've tried that, it does not resolve my issue with slaved waypoint being offset from where the pod is lasing/ jumping after TDC press.

[tekwoj]

2 questions. Do you have any mods installed and can you upload a track so that others can take a look at what's going on? The WMD issues sound a bit familiar but at the same time more extreme (and more consistent) than anything I had issues with.

[Dr_Pavelheer]

Try switching targeting pod between slave, snowplow and back to slave, it clears up some of the issues for me. I'll have to get around to trying to replicate them so I can post a track file

[PawlaczGMD]

20 minutes ago, tekwoj said:

2 questions. Do you have any mods installed and can you upload a track so that others can take a look at what's going on? The WMD issues sound a bit familiar but at the same time more extreme (and more consistent) than anything I had issues with.

I do not have any mods now. I wanted to post a track, but so far I only encountered these issues in the paid MAD campaign. I just started learning the JF-17. I have a track file from it but it is quite long. Would you need to have the MAD campaign to be able to replay it?

If the track would still be helpful, let me know, and I can upload it on an external website.

Otherwise, I will upload a shorter track when I manage to create such a situation again, but when I made a quick test airstart mission, I did not have these severe issues, so it is not 100% consistent.

17 minutes ago, Dr_Pavelheer said:

Try switching targeting pod between slave, snowplow and back to slave, it clears up some of the issues for me. I'll have to get around to trying to replicate them so I can post a track file

I will keep trying when this issue arises, so far I have just started to learn the Thunder, so I don't have much experience to go on.

[PawlaczGMD]

On 10/3/2024 at 2:12 PM, tekwoj said:

2 questions. Do you have any mods installed and can you upload a track so that others can take a look at what's going on? The WMD issues sound a bit familiar but at the same time more extreme (and more consistent) than anything I had issues with.

I managed to record a short track with the issues. I had a few instances of the pod jumping to a random location when switching targets/slewing.

For the first target, I had to switch to radar and unlock to resolve the issue, but it was still present afterwards, and unlocking radar wasn't helping with it.

I also had sudden jumps and loss of tracking when passing over the target with an LGB. Sometimes it jumps a little and I still hit, sometimes it jumps a lot. In a real mission, it usually jumped a lot more than the track, but it should demonstrate the issue in principle. I just also tried playing another campaign mission and it is absolutely impossible to drop LGBs, I lost tracking and missed by a 100m.

Please take a look at the track.

JF pod.trk

Edited October 7, 2024 by PawlaczGMD

[tekwoj]

That track looks more like the problems I encounter.

To reduce a bit the risk of TGP going crazy after you drop the bomb start a turn and avoid passing directly above your target. You'll still get the shaking because of the lack of stabilization, but it's less probably that it will point 100m away. It's not perfect but it maybe it will make the campaign missions less frustrating.

[uboats]

@JG54_NF2

[Netrolf]

Hi ! I had the exact same issue in the past and experienced it yesterday on the flashpoint server.

I managed to reproduce the bug several times in a custom mission editor scenario.
During the scenario, I do a cold start from batumi, take off, turn around and look at a waypoint placed on the kobuleti cross. Before proceeding to the cold start, just like I did yesterday on Flashpoint, I asked the ground crew to :

• update the INS coordinates
• remove the AR probe
• remove inlet covers and ladder

I did the exact same process 5 times in a row to see if the issue was random but the bug happened every single time. The pod looks at the correct coordinates, but it jump elsewhere as soon as I press or slew the TDC.

Since I usually never ask the ground crew for an INS update, I tried once again but this time without asking them to do so and the pod had no issue on this run and I was able to slew smoothly without it being jumpy.

Since DCS didn't record the trackfile previously, I jumped back into the game to get one. I created a similar scenario quickly, and managed to reproduce the bug one more time after asking the GC for an INS update.

TL:DR : WMD-7 jumpy behavior seems to be tied to asking the crew for INS update via the configuration pannel.

I hope those info and the trackfile can help.

LastMissionTrack.trk

Edited November 3, 2024 by Netrolf

[uboats]

@JG54_NF2

[PawlaczGMD]

On 11/2/2024 at 6:57 PM, Netrolf said:

Hi ! I had the exact same issue in the past and experienced it yesterday on the flashpoint server.

I managed to reproduce the bug several times in a custom mission editor scenario.
During the scenario, I do a cold start from batumi, take off, turn around and look at a waypoint placed on the kobuleti cross. Before proceeding to the cold start, just like I did yesterday on Flashpoint, I asked the ground crew to :

• update the INS coordinates
• remove the AR probe
• remove inlet covers and ladder

I did the exact same process 5 times in a row to see if the issue was random but the bug happened every single time. The pod looks at the correct coordinates, but it jump elsewhere as soon as I press or slew the TDC.

Since I usually never ask the ground crew for an INS update, I tried once again but this time without asking them to do so and the pod had no issue on this run and I was able to slew smoothly without it being jumpy.

Since DCS didn't record the trackfile previously, I jumped back into the game to get one. I created a similar scenario quickly, and managed to reproduce the bug one more time after asking the GC for an INS update.

TL:DR : WMD-7 jumpy behavior seems to be tied to asking the crew for INS update via the configuration pannel.

I hope those info and the trackfile can help.

 

LastMissionTrack.trk 733.33 kB · 2 downloads

 

Interesting, but when I had this issue, I never asked for INS update. In fact, my track shows it mildly happening with an airstart.