Hind Fuel Longevity

[Gunnar81]

Anyone know roughly how long the Hind can fly on a full tank with a tyical loadout at cruising speed?

Just looking for a rough number like 2hours or 1.5 hours...trying to make some longer missions and wondering how to plan FARPs etc.

 

Thanks.

[Raffi75]

22 minutes ago, Gunnar81 said:

Anyone know roughly how long the Hind can fly on a full tank with a tyical loadout at cruising speed?

Just looking for a rough number like 2hours or 1.5 hours...trying to make some longer missions and wondering how to plan FARPs etc.

 

Thanks.

About 2 hours

[Rainbowgirl]

Yeah, around 2 hours. It wary also at what altitude you intend to cruise over long distances.  If flying over no threat territory then you can achieve a noticeably better  endurance at altitudes of over 2 km in helicopters.

Edited November 6, 2024 by Rainbowgirl

[Gunnar81]

Thanks, I figured it was about that but good to confirm!

[admiki]

I don't know if ED tweaked fuel consumption, but I did this test when Hind first showed up.

[AeriaGloria]

3 hours ago, Gunnar81 said:

Anyone know roughly how long the Hind can fly on a full tank with a tyical loadout at cruising speed?

Just looking for a rough number like 2hours or 1.5 hours...trying to make some longer missions and wondering how to plan FARPs etc.

 

Thanks.

1 hr for 50% fuel is usually best estimate, 1000-1100 L/hr 

IMO. You will get best results from knowing your best speeds for cruise (250-270 kmh), and loiter (130-150 kmh). 140 kmh is best climb speed and most efficient descent speed 

There is also the “rotor rpm adjust” switch, which if you lower all the way can also reduce fuel consumption 2-3%, and if you raise it will increase fuel consumption same amount, but also increase lift/control 

Weapons have a surprisingly small effect, about 2-3%. The IRL manuals say the difference is so small that the range charts assume you always have payload and there are no figures/charts for being clean, as 2-3% falls within an expected margin of error. 
 

Also. Because the wings produce 25% lift at cruise, and are behind the CG/rotor, and payload their moves center of gravity back, which increases the angle of attack of the wing, increasing wing lift (which is more efficient then rotor lift), and actually increases efficiency 

Gun ammo has opposite effect since the bullets are loaded in the nose. 
 

It’s not until about 300 kmh or above that the drag outweighs the benefit of moving the center of gravity back in terms of fuel efficiency and maneuverability 

Edited November 7, 2024 by AeriaGloria

[Gunnar81]

53 minutes ago, AeriaGloria said:

1 hr for 50% fuel is usually best estimate, 1000-1100 L/hr 

IMO. You will get best results from knowing your best speeds for cruise (250-270 kmh), and loiter (130-150 kmh). 140 kmh is best climb speed and most efficient descent speed 

There is also the “rotor rpm adjust” switch, which if you lower all the way can also reduce fuel consumption 2-3%, and if you raise it will increase fuel consumption same amount, but also increase lift/control 

Weapons have a surprisingly small effect, about 2-3%. The IRL manuals say the difference is so small that the range charts assume you always have payload and there are no figures/charts for being clean, as 2-3% falls within an expected margin of error. 
 

Also. Because the wings produce 25% lift at cruise, and are behind the CG/rotor, and payload their moves center of gravity back, which increases the angle of attack of the wing, increasing wing lift (which is more efficient then rotor lift), and actually increases efficiency 

Gun ammo has opposite effect since the bullets are loaded in the nose. 
 

It’s not until about 300 kmh or above that the drag outweighs the benefit of moving the center of gravity back in terms of fuel efficiency and maneuverability 

 

I was hoping you'd comment AeriaGloria the wise sage of the Hind always has the answers. Hopefully I'll have some missions or a campaign to share with the community soon.

[Sobakopes]

What's the best altitude for cruise? 2500m?

Edited November 10, 2024 by Sobakopes

[AeriaGloria]

11 hours ago, Sobakopes said:

What's the best altitude for cruise? 2500m?

 

You gain only 10-20% fuel efficiency for cruising at 2000-3000m compared to 0-1000m. Unless traveling very far, the fuel used to climb outweighs the benefit. If you have a route in mind, I could calculate it for you. Above 3,000m efficiency decreases because you can no longer maintain best cruise speed. 

Usually, 500-1000m is best compromise. From that altitude, if you lower collective completely, hold 170 kmh (best autorotation distance speed), you can glide for quite a while. About 20-15 degree angle. 

[Raffi75]

16 hours ago, Sobakopes said:

What's the best altitude for cruise? 2500m?

 

The average cruising altitude on the route, if conditions allow, which we use in real life, is 600-800m at a speed of 220/230 km/h.

Edited November 11, 2024 by Raffi75

[AeriaGloria]

20 hours ago, Raffi75 said:

The average cruising altitude on the route, if conditions allow, which we use in real life, is 600-800m at a speed of 220/230 km/h.

 

Are you speaking from experience IRL? Most efficient speed for travel is 260 kmh at that altitude. It only goes below 240 kmh once above 3,000m alt, or 1,500m alt if above 11,500 kg weight 

[Raffi75]

I'm writing from my own experience. To be precise, I'm writing about version D, but I think it doesn't matter much.

[AeriaGloria]

3 hours ago, Raffi75 said:

I'm writing from my own experience. To be precise, I'm writing about version D, but I think it doesn't matter much.

Yes. Interesting a manual I have for it says 250 kmh for maximum range cruise speed for 700-1200m alt cruise 

[Raffi75]

You read too much and take everything literally 1:1.

In fact, 250-260 km/h is the cruising speed and the most economical according to calculations. And I'm not saying that's not how it's flown. Of course, we also fly at these speeds, but it's not always necessary. However, life shows that you can fly at other speeds. It all depends on the configuration, load, the task being performed, the weather conditions. In the flight training program for the Mi-24, there are exercises where you only fly at 150-170 km/h.

[AeriaGloria]

17 hours ago, Raffi75 said:

You read too much and take everything literally 1:1.

In fact, 250-260 km/h is the cruising speed and the most economical according to calculations. And I'm not saying that's not how it's flown. Of course, we also fly at these speeds, but it's not always necessary. However, life shows that you can fly at other speeds. It all depends on the configuration, load, the task being performed, the weather conditions. In the flight training program for the Mi-24, there are exercises where you only fly at 150-170 km/h.

Yes, I do read too much and take things too 1:1, I do not deny this I try to constantly tell myself “manual says you can fly 20 kmh from these speeds with only 2-3% difference, it matters little!” 
 

I appreciate your words of experience! 

[Raffi75]

3 hours ago, AeriaGloria said:

Yes, I do read too much and take things too 1:1, I do not deny this I try to constantly tell myself “manual says you can fly 20 kmh from these speeds with only 2-3% difference, it matters little!” 
 

I appreciate your words of experience! 

This knowledge is only a few years of working with the equipment. And I still think I know too little. 

[AeriaGloria]

I have talked to MiG-29 who said that, for the FC3 module, its flight performance is perfect according to all the manuals. But this is still slightly different from real aircraft. They might have made a perfect “by-the-book” flight model, but one completely based on reality. 

[Gunnar81]

Thanks for all the contributions by everyone here. This was an enlightening thread!