SEAD/CAS AI flights do not launch ARM

[Jambock]

Since the last update, most SEAD/CAS AI aircraft do not launch ARM.

The F-4E only fires ARM against the P-15/19 (Flat Face).

For some reason, AI does not perform the attack or carry it out partially. Then, RTB. Eventually, some fly to a random location on map and crash.

AI SEAD CAS ARM.trk AI SEAD CAS ARM.miz

[Northstar98]

Not sure what's going on here, as I'm unable to reproduce in my own missions

However, there are a couple of things I'll mention:

1. I ran into issues using attack unit/group with ARMs a few updates back, it seems that if the radar is not able to be engaged immediately upon activation of the task (for instance, if it isn't illuminating you) the AI will drop it. It's better then to use the SEAD task or the search then engage tasks, as the AI will constantly evaluate these and won't drop the task unless it reaches a stop condition (which you have to define yourself) or until it runs out of waypoints. This can be somewhat inconsistent though - I've seen identical missions sometimes work and sometimes not when testing this today.
2. The EWRs you're trying to engage are 55G6s, these radars cannot be engaged by the HARM, as the HARM's minimum frequency is greater than the frequency they operate at (or put another way, their wavelength is above the maximum that can be received by the HARM). The limitation comes from the fact that, because the HARM's diameter is fairly small, the conical spiral antenna the HARM has isn't large enough to receive such long wavelengths.

I've attached some tracks below showing AI SEAD/DEAD aircraft launching ARMs (to get the mission file, simply make a copy and change the extension to .miz instead of .trk).

AGM-45A_S-125M_AttackGroup.trk AGM-45A_S-125M_SearchThenEngage.trk AGM-88_S-125M_AttackGroup.trk AGM-88_S-125M_SearchThenEngage.trk ALARM_S-125M_AttackGroup.trk ALARM_S-125M_SearchThenEngage.trk

[Jambock]

Thank you for your answer!

[Northstar98]

13 hours ago, Jambock said:

Thank you for your answer!

No problem

Just be wary that behaviour can be somewhat inconsistent mission to mission (even within the same mission) and sometimes a particular way of setting it up works no problem and sometimes it doesn't.

But keeping fairly simple set ups, grouping radars together and using one of the search then engage tasks seems to work the best.

[Apple]

Still looks borked to me. No dice. At best an F16 fires ONE arm then turns around to fly to lala-land

[Northstar98]

Just now, Apple said:

Still looks borked to me. No dice. At best an F16 fires ONE arm then turns around to fly to lala-land

Is there a track file?

I've found that with Attack Unit/Group, the AI may drop the task if the radar cannot be engaged the moment the task is called.

I've found that Search then Engage will only have whatever group fire as many HARMs as there are threat radars.

[Apple]

I guess the point is just - doesn't work until you guessed the entry parameters right and even then it fires one HARM and flies off. Defo defunctional.

[NineLine]

7 hours ago, Apple said:

I guess the point is just - doesn't work until you guessed the entry parameters right and even then it fires one HARM and flies off. Defo defunctional.

Please supply a track. 

[Apple]

@NineLine Sure - Track One and Two, Firing off ONE missile at the SA-3 then ignoring all waypoints and flying straight ahead. No trying to get the TR or the launchers. Only if you spawn it into the sweet spot of 20-10NM from targets, we get some more action. Note - I was lucky with track one and two, more times than not it doesn't fire anything at all.

SEAD Example Track Three - SEAD Enroute - within range of SR and TR, which creates more action.trk SEAD Example Track One - F16 Flying off to the edge of the map.trk SEAD Example Track Two - SEAD Enroute only - 1 shot then F16 Flying off to the edge of the map.trk

Edited May 27 by Apple

[NineLine]

Ok, so a few things.

As far as the 1 missile thing, in most cases, this is if it's not required, the AI wont fire a second one unless you tell it to (or conditions make sense to). So in the track replays in most cases, the Search Radar is killed. One missile to kill the Search Radar is usually enough anyways. 

I found that I had to remove your custom Advanced Waypoint Actions and just set them to the default ones. In this case, in all examples, the AI launched 1 to 2 88s.

Track One had no waypoints, so the AI does whatever it wants when it feels it has completed its task. It also ended up causing it to fly well out from the target to make another run. I didnt see it flying off the map, it simply was extending very far and making another run.

Track 2, pretty much the same, but again with default SEAD commands

Track 3 was simply too close to the target; even then, it was able to get 1 88 off, but too close not to be fired upon. I doubled the distance to the target, set the default SEAD AWA and added in a second SEAD and an attack group with orders to attack Group 1, and allowed it to use all Guided. Note you also had the skill level set to Random, so that could cause you to see different results. 

In that tweak, the AI fired 2 88s, 4 mavs, killing a large portion of the group. 
SEAD Test3.trk

The AI is not self-aware; it is very much designed to do what you tell it to do within reason. If you give it less to work with, it will tend to do simplistic things; giving it more instructions and ordering them correctly makes all the difference. 

[Apple]

@NineLine Thanks but in all cases the AI had 2 waypoints, after passing wpt one it always ignores wpt 2 and doesn’t even do what AI normally does which is land at some airbase. I also dumbed down the attack profile to sead enroute only, the 1st one has had an attack group with auto weapons, 2 runs and 25ft set originally but the autocome is worse to the auto one task SEAD one. Happy to provide.