Building an integrated SAM air defense system in a mission

[Bahger]

I want to use a radar command post, or hub of some kind, as a target, which, when destroyed, will incapacitate a network of associated missile launchers. I know I can accomplish this in the ME by making a trigger that will disable AI for all the satellite units once the hub is destroyed but is there a more authentic way to do this? Is there any way to build a network of low-to-medium altitude SAM systems (such as the SA-9) that are connected to a hub and which would become degraded/disabled if the hub were hit? In other words, do the EWR and radar command posts in the sim have any practical function beyond being targets?

[jeffyd123]

any luck with this? If you want help testing let me know...

[Bahger]

Thanks, jeffyd.

 

For example, if I select an "Igla comm" (presumably this means "Command" unit, it's not in the encyclopedia, will destroying it degrade any Igla units I place on the map? Ditto the "Stinger comm" unit.

[aaron886]

Been wanting to know what those are myself...

[nomdeplume]

For example, if I select an "Igla comm" (presumably this means "Command" unit, it's not in the encyclopedia, will destroying it degrade any Igla units I place on the map? Ditto the "Stinger comm" unit.

 

I don't think so, I haven't noticed any difference in performance between groups that have just the MANPADS and those who also have the commander. I think the function of this unit is to act as a reload source for the MANPADS. Not sure if they can reload from trucks like other units do. Maybe they can, but it saves you having to park a truck next to all your MANPADS.

[jeffyd123]

i dont know but your idea of disabling the AI sounds like a good idea.

[slug88]

What about: have two hidden groups, containing identical copies of your proposed SAM defense. Except set the units in one group to High or Excellent skill, and set the units in the other group to low skill. A trigger can decide which group to activate and spawn. Thus you have the same makeup of air defenses, but significantly degraded performance when command goes down.

[Bushmanni]

In DCS BS (according to some ED staff member) the MANPADS command unit was supposed to increase the detection radius of the missile unit. Haven't verified it myself but I see no reason for it not to be true for Warthog also. Also some search radars supposedly increase the detection radius of SAM batteries if placed in the same group.

 

Changing the skill level of AD units would seem the most logical and realistic way to simulate degraded command and control. Disabling AI sounds overkill to me.

[Yskonyn]

^I seem to recall as well that command or radar units in a SAM installation made it more effective. Can't find the post, however.

 

So while you wouldn't cripple the installation totally by removing the commanding unit (would that be realistic anyway?) you do make it less effective.

[Grimes]

A sam network from hell could be created via LUA scripts. Could combine the information of several radar sources, LOS detection, range, bearing, and define AI on/off behavior to give the AI defenses a tad bit strategy to their defense.

 

To a lesser extent this could be done via triggers, but it would be a MASSIVE pain in the arse to build.

[MadTommy]

SA3 system could do the job...that is reliant on its radar.

[Wags]

An IADS builder is something that we have already designed ( similar to the one I worked with during JF/A-18 ). I am not sure when, but it will be implemented at some point.

[Speed]

A sam network from hell could be created via LUA scripts. Could combine the information of several radar sources, LOS detection, range, bearing, and define AI on/off behavior to give the AI defenses a tad bit strategy to their defense.

 

To a lesser extent this could be done via triggers, but it would be a MASSIVE pain in the arse to build.

 

^^What he said.

 

You could make a much more simple air defense network through triggers quite easily. Basically, have all SAM AI off until a player comes within a lethal zone, then you suddenly turn it on. Make this dependent on an early warning radar that is supposedly sending coordinates of enemy aircraft to SAMs. You kill that radar, and then all the SAM radars turn on.

 

That is how you could do a simple one. But a really good one could be made through lua scripting.

 

All that said, the cruise missiles, stealth aircraft, F-16Cs, Tornadoes, F-18s, etc, would be disabling this integrated SAM defense system before they sent in the A-10Cs. But if you want a challenge, then you can fly against one. No one makes us fly this realistically if we don't want to.

Edited March 22, 2011 by Speed

[GGTharos]

Wonderful news. The one in JF-18 had some very nice features :)

[GGTharos]

Do I remember correctly that you can turn SAM radar on/off in triggers? You don't need to turn off SAM AI. Just their radars - and then only in 'activate radar to guide' mode.

 

^^What he said.

 

You could make a much more simple air defense network through triggers quite easily. Basically, have all SAM AI off until a player comes within a lethal zone, then you suddenly turn it on. Make this dependent on an early warning radar that is supposedly sending coordinates of enemy aircraft to SAMs. You kill that radar, and then all the SAM radars turn on.

 

That is how you could do a simple one. But a really good one could be made through lua scripting.

[Speed]

Do I remember correctly that you can turn SAM radar on/off in triggers? You don't need to turn off SAM AI. Just their radars - and then only in 'activate radar to guide' mode.

 

You can do that now? I thought that you could only set EMCON kinda options with aircraft.

[MadTommy]

An IADS builder is something that we have already designed ( similar to the one I worked with during JF/A-18 ). I am not sure when, but it will be implemented at some point.

 

IADS? IHNIWTSF.

 

Translation: I have no idea what that stands for.

 

Any chance of having a translation of IADS.

[Grimes]

Changing their ROE also seems to effect their radar use habits. Leaving their AI on, but still capable of reacting to a threat would probably be the ideal situation. If LUA can detect if a unit fired their weapon we could probably enable shoot-n-scoot tactics to annoy the player even more. That is as long as we keep their speed low enough to not cause a massive cloud of dirt.

[Eddie]

IADS? IHNIWTSF.

 

Translation: I have no idea what that stands for.

 

Any chance of having a translation of IADS.

 

Integrated Air Defence System.

[Grimes]

Any chance of having a translation of IADS.

 

 

According to google, "IADS" is an Apple product.

 

 

 

 

Wags, what have you done!!?!?

[Creelers]

IADS? IHNIWTSF.

 

Translation: I have no idea what that stands for.

 

Any chance of having a translation of IADS.

 

Integrated Air Defence System.

 

Well, I'm pretty sure that is what it is, I've seen it used before for NATO's IADS in the 50s as a precaution against Russian bombers.

 

 

EDIT: Ninja'd :P

[Speed]

Integrated Air Defence System.

 

Well, I'm pretty sure that is what it is, I've seen it used before for NATO's IADS in the 50s as a precaution against Russian bombers.

 

 

EDIT: Ninja'd :P

 

lol NATO IADS. Ok, maybe they had one, but not compared to the Soviets.

[GGTharos]

I suggest reading up.

 

lol NATO IADS. Ok, maybe they had one, but not compared to the Soviets.

[Speed]

I suggest reading up.

 

Well, I always got the impression that the NATO SAM IADS was quite small compared to the Soviet one. Maybe it's just the myriad of SAMs that the Soviets/Russia can employ.

[GGTharos]

The concepts are different, and with the phasing out of HAWK the US military certainly had a gap in medium altitude coverage, but NATO as a whole has had a whole bunch of SHORAD and MEDRAD. US always had a huge datalinked IADS system, and right now everything - and I mean everything - plugs into link16, making everything and everyone part of your IADS.

 

Russia had (and for the moment still has) the better part of mobile IADS meant to defend moving ground forces. NATO's offerings are there, but not as developed.

 

Enter the SLAMRAAM.

 

Well, I always got the impression that the NATO SAM IADS was quite small compared to the Soviet one. Maybe it's just the myriad of SAMs that the Soviets/Russia can employ.