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Uncontrolled Descent


doveman
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This is probably not a bug but whilst I was testing earlier, I opened the Controls Indicator (Rctrl+Enter) and was checking the stick and pedals. Then I tested the Collective by dropping it down to minimum, which naturally caused me to start to descend but then I increased it and the helo just kept descending and wobbling about rather strangely until it crashed.

 

I've attached a trk of it, so if someone could take a look and see if they can explain what happened and how I could have recovered from it (assuming it's a flight issue rather than a bug), that'd be great. It's at the end (right before I plummeted into the ground!) so hopefully you can skip past all the boring parts.

Uncontrolled Descent.trk

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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No thanks, I've just eaten :megalol:

 

If that's what it was, could I have recovered from it?

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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Without any doubt you falled in the Vortex Ring State.

If your IAS is less than 50 Km/h your descent rate must be kept below 5 m/s.

Check the chapter 13 of the manual.

 

Thanks, I'll go and have a read :thumbup:

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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Yes, if you were high enough.

Recovery:

 

Decrease collective to 0 and put your nose down.

Thus you will continue to descent, but eventually leave the vortex ring. After reaching some forward airspeed gently increas collective again and you are good to go again.

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[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] ЯБоГ32_Принз





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Yes, if you were high enough.

Recovery:

 

Decrease collective to 0 and put your nose down.

Thus you will continue to descent, but eventually leave the vortex ring. After reaching some forward airspeed gently increas collective again and you are good to go again.

 

Cool, thanks. I'll remember that for next time :thumbup:

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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Certainly it is better to remind not to get in the vortex ring state at all! *g*

 

Sure, I only dropped the throttle suddenly because I was testing the Controls Indicator. I'm don't normally move it so drastically :joystick:

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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There is value in learning vortex ring recovery, just as there is a value for spin recovery in fixed-wing aircraft. There are many pilots who believe that learning to avoid spins is sufficient, and that learning to recover from spins is unnecessary; however, this strikes me as ignorant. If you ever do find yourself in a spin, for any reason, your survival is dubious if you've never tried it before. And, at that point, "You shouldn't have gotten into the spin" won't help you much. I'd say the same goes for vortex ring state.

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There is value in learning vortex ring recovery, just as there is a value for spin recovery in fixed-wing aircraft. There are many pilots who believe that learning to avoid spins is sufficient, and that learning to recover from spins is unnecessary; however, this strikes me as ignorant. If you ever do find yourself in a spin, for any reason, your survival is dubious if you've never tried it before. And, at that point, "You shouldn't have gotten into the spin" won't help you much. I'd say the same goes for vortex ring state.

 

Well sure, it's good to know how to recover from it but it's still valid to say "Best to avoid getting into it in the first place" which is all I think JaBoG32_Prinzartus was saying ;)

 

I certainly wouldn't want to be in an aircraft piloted by someone who'd never bothered to learn how to recover from such problems :helpsmilie:

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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I certainly wouldn't want to be in an aircraft piloted by someone who'd never bothered to learn how to recover from such problems

 

Completely agreed. Unfortunately, as I understand it, nearly all pilots in the U.S.A. trained in the last 15+ years have neglected to practice even a single spin recovery. When I was taking flight lessons back in 1999, I was told that the FAA no longer required spin recovery, and most instructors did not teach it. The reason given was the one I objected to in my previous post: "Best to avoid getting into it in the first place." That sentence may technically be true under some circumstances, but taking that notion literally--universally rather than situationally--has resulted in a giant backward step for the state of aviation.


Edited by Echo38
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