Slightly confused by the drone debate

[Conure]

Hi guys,

 

Looking for a bit of debate I guess - about the rapidly progressing area of drones. The main reason I'm interested is because I'm coming to a close of my Software Engineering degree and the significant AI influence in it leads me on to a number of careers in the area which is big for drones - BAE systems being one.

 

I keep reading things about drones being used to kill innocents, but a lot of the time it seems quite obscured by either hyper liberal or conservative thinking.

 

For example, I'm sure these drones aren't intentionally targeting civilians, so why are they hitting them? Are they definitely hitting them?

 

To somebody ignorant of drone use, it seems to me that it's effectively the same as flying in F16s, without any pilot risk. It will eventually completely remove human error from the process of assaulting war targets etc.

 

The arguments from the (less that knowledgeable) keep implying terminator like scenarios - but these drones have about the same chance of deciding to turn on us, as our toasters do. We are so (so, so, so) far from any form of sentient AI it's not even worth considering.

 

 

Also, how about the weaponisation of ground units:

 

For example:

 

And

 

 

What are you thoughts on the use of drones? pros, cons, general opinions?

[NineLine]

This is my only opinion, but I would assume part of it is the feeling the more removed a combatant is from a war zone and the more automated things become the less compassion/care they might feel for what they are doing or who they are doing it too...

 

I dont really have a personal opinion on that either way, honestly I dont see much difference between a drone pilot and a pilot dropping bombs from high altitudes, I think its more the idea of drones that scare people.

 

As I side note, I am pretty sure my toaster is out to get me :helpsmilie:

[sobek]

The arguments from the (less that knowledgeable) keep implying terminator like scenarios - but these drones have about the same chance of deciding to turn on us, as our toasters do. We are so (so, so, so) far from any form of sentient AI it's not even worth considering.

 

You don't need sentient AI for things to go haywire. Just think of the first patriot software suite that was able to autonomously do friend or foe recognition and fire. Promptly downed a Tornado with a defect IFF transponder (IIR the incident correctly).

[Conure]

I can understand your points of view - Sobek, I can agree regarding the bugs, that could be a huge problem. I suppose a solution would be to have a human monitor every single drone decision but even then it's a huge logistical ask.

 

Sith - It seems like it's a complete advantage for 'us' and complete misery for 'them'. For example, our soldiers won't get PTSD, we won't even need to train many of them - the few operating/overseeing the drone force could sit back in a recliner drinking coffee whilst systematically wiping out a small town.

 

The destructive capacity of these machine is pretty terrifying - with the range of vision modes they have (IR, EM, NV and more) + instant connectivity to every other drone, I think any future wars may very quickly turn into complete and utter annihilation of an enemy with close to zero causalities inflicted...(in theory at least)

[Speed]

You don't need sentient AI for things to go haywire. Just think of the first patriot software suite that was able to autonomously do friend or foe recognition and fire. Promptly downed a Tornado with a defect IFF transponder (IIR the incident correctly).

 

Wow... I never knew about this. There was also an incident where a Patriot downed an F-18, killing the pilot, and another indicent where a Patriot went berserk and an F-16 had to put it down with a HARM:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-173545/F-16-fires-Patriot-radar.html

 

Kinda reminds me of a rare Falcon 4 Allied Force where your AI wingmen would go rabid and try to kill you with guns. In one mission, I had to kill two of my wingmen when two of them went crazy at the same time. Maybe they didn't appreciate my leadership skills, if so, you can hardly blame them.

Edited March 7, 2013 by Speed

[NineLine]

 

Sith - It seems like it's a complete advantage for 'us' and complete misery for 'them'. For example, our soldiers won't get PTSD, we won't even need to train many of them - the few operating/overseeing the drone force could sit back in a recliner whilst systematically wiping out a small town.

 

The destructive capacity of these machine is pretty terrifying - with the range of vision modes they have (IR, EM, NV and more) + instant connectivity to every other drone, I think any future wars may very quickly turn into complete and utter annihilation of an enemy with close to zero causalities inflicted...(in theory at least)

 

But I think thats where the porblem comes from some people... you already have people growing up desensitized to violence, now you can play a video game, shooting the bad guy from 1000 of miles away, if you make a boo boo, its just some glowy globs on the screen, the impact of a civilian kill might be lost on someone... Now I am not sure I agree with that, but I think thats where most of this comes from....

[monotwix]

Make as many robots as you can with functions and ideas,..