How to communicate with team members

[Maximus_Lazarus]

Ok, so you and a teammate are flying to the objective .

 

You spot some enemies , communicate it with him or vice versa.

 

But... then what ?

 

Do you make a plan ? Do you both attack ?

Ok i guess you can make that up as you go , but when everybody is fighting, i find that communicating efficiently is , challenging.

 

You lost eachother, both busy fending off incoming missiles ... It's not super easy to fly with another person i found. It takes quite some brain power to keep also track of him, and be usefull to eachother at the same time .

 

Is this something that comes with practice, routine ?

 

I understand this is a vague question, and it's probably second nature to the people that have been flying in groups since forever, but i'd still like some pointers, if there can be given any.

 

How to make the most of flying with someone else , and also how do you not lose eachother in the commotion ?

[Flagrum]

I would assume, there are basic roles that define your basic responsibilities - therefore the distinction between flight lead and wingman. One attacks, the other covers, etc.

 

And for reacting to threats, I would assume, ideally you (as in "team") plan ahead of the sortie what you might encounter and how to react then.

 

.. but ... layman alert ... I am not so much into MP and flying together with others (yet? :p)

[Blooze]

So much of this comes easier when you fly with the same people on a regular basis. If you are using the same group id number it is easy to see where everyone is as a blue symbol on your TAD screen as well. I recommend using the EXP1 mode for better situational awareness.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Blooze

[159th_Viper]

Plan the Flight and Fly the Plan.

[Frostie]

Is this something that comes with practice, routine ?

 

Absolutely, more practice the more accustomed you become to each other and what to do to stay together.

 

If you're talking about A2A engagements without datalink then co-ordinate your headings, if you engage different targets then sort who is on which and announce necessary tactics such as pincer, cross block or crank together so you can build a picture of you flights shape. Extend together on announced identical headings, if not together then still match extend and hot bearings so you will be in line. Doing this should allow you to use radar to find each other comfortably, but don't waste too much time doing this. Eventually having practiced this you will become accustomed to the shape you're flying, so even if you don't know where he is you should be able to stay in relative good shape through matching patterns.

[Maximus_Lazarus]

k thx good tips (especially frostie)

 

I'll try next time to agree on a plan that is as basic as possible. Very simple to execute. The simpler the better. ("drag @ bag" or how you guys call it , or even simpler one goes high other goes low, as long as it is very basic)

 

And second make agree on a retreat point , not so hard since mostly when flying say north, you'd be retreating to south, right ? So a previous landmark between destination and base to meet up so you always know which way you are both flying ?

 

Basically try to keep things as simple as possible

[TAW_Blaze]

i find that communicating efficiently is , challenging

 

I don't think anybody thinks otherwise, describing what you know or think in words is simply an extremely difficult task. Doing that in a fight, well you can guess.

 

If you have absolutely no clue where he is you can reference any waypoint, add your heading and altitude, if he has a slight clue how navigation works he'll have a rough idea where you are. If you usually reference a specific waypoint on said mission it'll be faster (for instance, on 104th missions WP1 for the F-15s is usually bullseye)

 

The simpler the better. ("drag @ bag" or how you guys call it , or even simpler one goes high other goes low, as long as it is very basic)

 

The most important is that you trust your wingman. But he has to earn that. A number of people that I fly with for a long time I still have a hard time trusting in the fight because they don't always communicate the information that I /need/ in case of being the bait. If I'm dragging someone that has been spiking me for over 30 seconds and I know he was around 20nm when I started the drag and my wingman hasn't said a word I'll be extremely nervous nearly every time.

 

Try to keep the talk short and clear, brevity is a great tool but not mandatory. Forcing brevity in the fight can result in confusion and misunderstanding if the other guy isn't fluent with the terms you're using.

 

And second make agree on a retreat point , not so hard since mostly when flying say north, you'd be retreating to south, right ? So a previous landmark between destination and base to meet up so you always know which way you are both flying ?

 

How you extend will depend on your SA. Before you jump in the fight you want to figure out what is your exit direction if things go wrong.

[sUrge0n]

Maybe this helps:

 

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/3827739/Re_Circle_orbit_2_ship

 

FL calls "TWO......CIRCLE". --> setup circle orbit.

Now you have time to sort out the target(-s), and hand them over to your wingman. Tell what you see. For example "group of tanks, just south of the lake". And give him his target. For example "your target is the most western tank". Coupled with a SPI send, he should find it.

FL: "call when target is captured"

WM: "captured"

FL: "you are cleared to attack"

 

Wingman tips in, rolls out call "contact target" and attack the most western tank. FL is in orbit, and watches the surroundings for manpad launches, AAA etc.

WM: calls "tipping in from the North", "contact target", "bombs away", "off" and climb back to orbit altitude.

 

Next target will be...... etc.

 

or use:

http://www.fsgoggles.com/combatforum/index.php?topic=21.0

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/3822174/Re:_4-ship_tactical_turns#Post3822174

 

check this Youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isnmXeTTQKk&feature=youtu.be

 

From "line abreast".

FL: calls "TWO.... CROSS turn" --> perform cross turn (= one end of the racetrack)

After about 3-5 nM ( shorter or longer, whatever you need) he calls another cross turn (= other end of the racetrack)

Now during the legs of the racetrack:

FL: goes heads down for target sorting

FL: calls SPI send, with target desription. For example: "two, SPI send, AAA just south of a bend in the road". Call when captured.

WM: search for his target and calls "captured".

FL: call "TWO......TAC turn left/right", to turn towards the target in line abreast.

WM: focus on target attack, when "contact target" and after call FL "cleared to attack", and within release parameters he calls "rifle" (= Mav launch)

(FL: : contact target = call "cleared to attack". FL is responsible for the lookout.)

After weapon release:

FL calls "TWO .......HOOK left/right", both a/c make a hookturn back to the racetrack.

Ivo the racetrack FL calls "TWO......TAC left/right" to get back into the racetrack.

 

Whenever you want to attack yourselves, just call "shooter-cover you will cover".

Or want a simultanious attack just call "shooter-shooter".

 

A nice vid with comms about capturing SPI:

A nice vid how to hook your wingman, and some wingman contract:

Edited May 5, 2014 by sUrge0n

[Maximus_Lazarus]

whoa hold it there, that's WAY out of my skill zone :huh: :joystick:

 

I'm sure it's an excellent post, but way too complicated for me , thx anyway though :)

[TAW_Blaze]

Google brevity, you'll find a bunch of long pdfs that explain them. There'll be some difference now and then since some aspects of brevity vary from squadron to squadron but there are a lot of things that are the same, so definitely not a waste learning some of it.