Noobie Problem

IKROKODIL · December 27, 2015

Hello! I got the A-10A after playing the SU-25t for for about 20-30 hours and everything goes smoothly except for the landing. For some reason my plane (well after I've slowed down) pitches backwards and decides to have a little sit down... ...on it's tail.

Anyone got any advice on what I may be doing wrong? I don't think the trim has anything to do with this as my speed is quite low when this happens...

Shadow KT · December 27, 2015

Well, as a A-10C pilot I'd say that you are stalling out. You are probably going under 120 knots. Try following the speed indicators on the left. Adjust your speed with pitch and your glide with power

mwd2 · December 27, 2015

Touchdown Speed to low (no weapons: speed 130-140 kts) and AoA (Angle of Attack) to high?

IKROKODIL · December 27, 2015

I want to mention that this happens ON the runway and after I've touched down and applied a pretty good amount of brake... Could it still be the low speed???

Edit: After I put my front wheel down as well...

Edit 2: Did it again and it happened at 45 knots after I used the brakes; when I released the brakes to roll some more on the runway the nose just started going "up, up and away".

Edited December 27, 2015 by IKROKODIL

Fab · December 27, 2015

I want to mention that this happens ON the runway and after I've touched down and applied a pretty good amount of brake... Could it still be the low speed???

Edit: After I put my front wheel down as well...

Edit 2: Did it again and it happened at 45 knots after I used the brakes; when I released the brakes to roll some more on the runway the nose just started going "up, up and away".

Was your trim in netrual ?

Shadow KT · December 28, 2015

can you provide a track ?

Exorcet · December 28, 2015

Your cg is behind the rear wheels, lower the nose before you begin to lose pitch authority.

Shadow KT · December 28, 2015

Yeah you probably come in with a low speed and you are trying to pitch up to compensate for it and by that you do a tail strike on landing and that increases your braking power so you loose speed quickly. A tap on the brakes or increase in throttle should work

Ironhand · December 28, 2015

I want to mention that this happens ON the runway and after I've touched down and applied a pretty good amount of brake... Could it still be the low speed???

Edit: After I put my front wheel down as well...

Edit 2: Did it again and it happened at 45 knots after I used the brakes; when I released the brakes to roll some more on the runway the nose just started going "up, up and away".

Given the details you've provided, there is nothing you are doing wrong. But there is something wrong with your installation. Try repairing it: Using DCS Updater to repair, Update....

boedha68 · December 28, 2015

Hello! I got the A-10A after playing the SU-25t for for about 20-30 hours and everything goes smoothly except for the landing. For some reason my plane (well after I've slowed down) pitches backwards and decides to have a little sit down... ...on it's tail.

Anyone got any advice on what I may be doing wrong? I don't think the trim has anything to do with this as my speed is quite low when this happens...

There is a option training and missions. Look learn play. you look to movies on youtube dcs tutorials on landings. I did played dcs for a year before a got a proper landing. :D And...sometimes it still goes wrong...lol

Exorcet · December 28, 2015

Given the details you've provided, there is nothing you are doing wrong. But there is something wrong with your installation. Try repairing it: Using DCS Updater to repair, Update....

I'm not sure as I've seen this behavior with the A-10. I think with low fuel, the cg moves quite a bit back. You need to be careful with the aircraft's attitude. That said, popping up at 45 knots seems a bit excessive. I'd like to see a track. Would also be good to hear from anyone involved in the A-10 FM to confirm where the cg is/moves between.

Ironhand · December 28, 2015

I'm not sure as I've seen this behavior with the A-10. I think with low fuel, the cg moves quite a bit back. You need to be careful with the aircraft's attitude. That said, popping up at 45 knots seems a bit excessive. I'd like to see a track. Would also be good to hear from anyone involved in the A-10 FM to confirm where the cg is/moves between.

At 45 knots (51 mph or 83 kph) I can't imagine there being enough air moving over the control surfaces to lead to that sort of behavior...not unless there's one hell of a headwind that's unaccounted for. That's why I was thinking it was an installation problem. But it's also been ages since I was last in the A-10 pit. So I could be wrong...

It'll be tomorrow morning before I can jump into the cockpit and do any testing myself.

runny · December 28, 2015

This happens to me too. It'll even happen standing still with the park brakes on. It's funny to tip yourself back using the elevators :P

I assumed it was a bug. I can't see how your airplane randomly falling backwards onto the tail could be any type of 'feature'.

Exorcet · December 28, 2015

This happens to me too. It'll even happen standing still with the park brakes on. It's funny to tip yourself back using the elevators :P

I assumed it was a bug. I can't see how your airplane randomly falling backwards onto the tail could be any type of 'feature'.

I've only had it happen when trying to aerobrake on landing. I get to the point where I want to nose down, but can't. It acts as you would expect if the cg shifts behind the rear wheels. The problem for me is, I wouldn't expect a plane to be built that would allow that. If it was built that way, it should be mentioned in the manual, but I don't recall any mention in the DCS A-10 manual.

Shadow KT · December 29, 2015

can we see a damn track of this ?

Ironhand · December 29, 2015

A track might be helpful. Either that or the mission itself. I spent some time this morning in the pit and couldn't reproduce the OP's behavior. I have to get up to roughly 100 KIAS to get the nose wheel off the ground (low fuel, with and without weapons) and that takes holding the stick full back in my lap. As soon as I let it go, the nose wheel drops back to the ground. Tried landing several times. Taxiing at different speeds, etc. Couldn't get it to happen without forcing it and never at anything remotely close to 45 knots.

Given Runny's experience, too, this sounds more like either a bug or warped install more than anything else. If this is only happening in a particular mission or missions, that could be the culprit as well. There are some compatibility issues across the various versions of the sim. So, I suppose, that could be a third possibility as well. But, again, I don't think it's anything the OP is doing wrong.

Stuge · December 29, 2015

If you use wheel brake after touchdown it shouldn't pitch up. And like others have said, maybe your airspeed is too low during touchdown? That results in a very nose-up attitude.

Exorcet · December 29, 2015

A track might be helpful. Either that or the mission itself. I spent some time this morning in the pit and couldn't reproduce the OP's behavior. I have to get up to roughly 100 KIAS to get the nose wheel off the ground (low fuel, with and without weapons) and that takes holding the stick full back in my lap. As soon as I let it go, the nose wheel drops back to the ground. Tried landing several times. Taxiing at different speeds, etc. Couldn't get it to happen without forcing it and never at anything remotely close to 45 knots.

So you tested while taking off, if I read correctly?

What about with landing trim? Or maybe use incorrect trim and hold landing attitude on approach to runway with manual stick input?

I can't do anything myself, I don't have access to my DCS computer.

Also, perhaps this should be posted in the bug section to get the attention of a dev.

EDIT -

Found a video on youtube pretty quickly happens at the very start, and possibly later (didn't watch the whole thing yet):

[ame]

[/ame]

EDIT 2 -

Looks like it is just at the start, sadly there is no lead up so I can't tell what caused it.

Edited December 29, 2015 by Exorcet

Ironhand · December 29, 2015

So you tested while taking off, if I read correctly?

What about with landing trim? Or maybe use incorrect trim and hold landing attitude on approach to runway with manual stick input?

I can't do anything myself, I don't have access to my DCS computer.

Also, perhaps this should be posted in the bug section to get the attention of a dev.

EDIT -

Found a video on youtube pretty quickly happens at the very start, and possibly later (didn't watch the whole thing yet):

EDIT 2 -

Looks like it is just at the start, sadly there is no lead up so I can't tell what caused it.

Tried it taking off and taxiing. Always needed at least 100 KIAS to get the pitch up with stick full back in my lap. I could hold that as long as the stick was pulled back. As soon as I released the stick, the nose dropped back down. But I'm pretty sure that I didn't try slowing down to see how long I could force it to last. Sorry, I was still on my first cup of coffee at the time

As tried landing 3 times. Believe me, it's been so long since I've been in the pit that none were done by the numbers. Nothing unusual happened. The OP doesn't seem to have a problem getting down to the ground. It's later while slowing that the issues occur. In fact, he states in one post that all three wheels were on the ground and his speed was about 45 knots. At that point attitude isn't an issue.

As I'm writing this, I'm wondering if he has a force feedback stick and that is somehow creating the issue?

Edited December 29, 2015 by Ironhand

runny · December 30, 2015

I should mention that my experience with it was all from months and months ago in 1.2. I haven't flown the A-10A for a very long time and I don't even have 1.2 installed anymore.

From what I remember, all you had to do was take off and land again and it would reproduce every time. Maybe it also made a difference to have no weapons and be out of gun ammo. Sorry I have no tracks or videos.

Ironhand · December 31, 2015

So. I was finally able to do it and have attached a track. No weapons and, just to be safe, no cannon shells as well. Started rolling and pulled the nose up until the tail hit. Immediately throttled down and let my speed decay. I noticed that anytime I started to release back pressure on the stick, the nose would start coming down.

So...I extended flaps and, from then on, the nose stayed up on its own as my speed decayed with the stick at neutral. However, all I had to do to bring the nose down was tap the brakes (which is what I did at the end).

So I could force the behavior but it still doesn't seem to be exactly what was described because tapping the brakes brings the nose down immediately.

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