atsmith6 Posted October 20, 2016 Posted October 20, 2016 Quick question. Does anyone know what the minimum recovery fuel and emergency fuel levels are for the Mirage 2K? I know that the warning lights indicate the final stages of fuel at 1100kg (feeder tanks only) and at 500kg the Level light comes on but I have no idea what the operational tolerances would be. Here's what I want to achieve. Currently in the BMS F-16 I know I need to plan to arrive on final approach at no lower than 1600 lbs of fuel on a clear day. This is because the minimum landing fuel is 1200 lbs and 400 lbs is added for go-around. Now if I were to treat the two airframes as equivalent then that would imply 550 kg for minimums and 180 kg for a clear day go-around, or 360 kg for IFR conditions. Any help for better or more accurate numbers would be greatly appreciated.
Gators Posted October 20, 2016 Posted October 20, 2016 (edited) IRL never less than 400kg for landing with the 2000C Edited October 20, 2016 by Gators [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
zaelu Posted October 20, 2016 Posted October 20, 2016 What happens if you come to land with a lot less fuel? Lets say your engine dies after you stopped the landing run scenario? Is the plane harder to balance? 1600lbs of fuel seems to me a lot of fuel and if is mandatory to come back with it why not use that space or weight for other stuff? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] I5 4670k, 32GB, GTX 1070, Thrustmaster TFRP, G940 Throttle extremely modded with Bodnar 0836X and Bu0836A, Warthog Joystick with F-18 grip, Oculus Rift S - Almost all is made from gifts from friends, the most expensive parts at least
Eddie Posted October 20, 2016 Posted October 20, 2016 1600 lbs is around the same min landing fuel as most fighters/attack aircraft out there. A-10 is 1100 lbs Typhoon is 450 Kg The minimum isn't there for any reason such as stability, it's to ensure there is always enough fuel in the case of an emergency so that the aircraft isn't lost because it ran out of fuel. If your fuel level was so low you ran out on landing for any reason other than unforeseeable mechanical failure you'd be unlikely to ever fly an aircraft for the military again.
mvsgas Posted October 21, 2016 Posted October 21, 2016 (edited) Here's what I want to achieve. Currently in the BMS F-16 I know I need to plan to arrive on final approach at no lower than 1600 lbs of fuel on a clear day. This is because the minimum landing fuel is 1200 lbs and 400 lbs is added for go-around. Now if I were to treat the two airframes as equivalent then that would imply 550 kg for minimums and 180 kg for a clear day go-around, or 360 kg for IFR conditions. Any help for better or more accurate numbers would be greatly appreciated. Sorry, I know this not what you where asking, anyway, for F-16 normal, minimum and emergency fuel read para 3.33 of (direct PDF link) AFI 11-2F-16V3 13 JULY 2016 Regarding the Mirage, that would be cool to know. I have been using 800kg as the normal, 400kg as the minimum and 200kg emergency, but I am just guessing. Edited October 21, 2016 by mvsgas To whom it may concern, I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that. Thank you for you patience. Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..
zaelu Posted October 21, 2016 Posted October 21, 2016 The minimum isn't there for any reason such as stability, it's to ensure there is always enough fuel in the case of an emergency so that the aircraft isn't lost because it ran out of fuel. I thought so. So this formulation in this thread with minimum x, emergency y is not 100% correct. Emergency can be 1 gram of fuel. Because that means it was an emergency and the fuel was used. It's useless if you reached the so called Emergency value but you still can't land because of the emergency. Say one gear won't come out while the others are stuck outside... in bad weather... with some bombs that won't jettison for some reason... battle damage or something. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] I5 4670k, 32GB, GTX 1070, Thrustmaster TFRP, G940 Throttle extremely modded with Bodnar 0836X and Bu0836A, Warthog Joystick with F-18 grip, Oculus Rift S - Almost all is made from gifts from friends, the most expensive parts at least
mvsgas Posted October 21, 2016 Posted October 21, 2016 (edited) I thought so. So this formulation in this thread with minimum x, emergency y is not 100% correct. Emergency can be 1 gram of fuel. Because that means it was an emergency and the fuel was used. It's useless if you reached the so called Emergency value but you still can't land because of the emergency. Say one gear won't come out while the others are stuck outside... in bad weather... with some bombs that won't jettison for some reason... battle damage or something. Well, if you reach emergency fuel, and you are on hold pattern around an airport for some reason, now you go to the top of the priority list of the tower. Edit: One gram of fuel is no longer a fuel emergency, by that time is has long ago turn into a no engine/ "dead stick" landing or ejection. Edited October 22, 2016 by mvsgas To whom it may concern, I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that. Thank you for you patience. Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..
Chrinik Posted October 22, 2016 Posted October 22, 2016 I thought so. So this formulation in this thread with minimum x, emergency y is not 100% correct. Emergency can be 1 gram of fuel. Because that means it was an emergency and the fuel was used. It's useless if you reached the so called Emergency value but you still can't land because of the emergency. Say one gear won't come out while the others are stuck outside... in bad weather... with some bombs that won't jettison for some reason... battle damage or something. If you are on emergency and need to land, you properly announce that you are on emergency fuel, and will be coming in for an emergency landing stating the damage to your aircraft so that groundcrews can properly prepare in case of ...unforseen mishaps with the weapons/fuel in your craft. The ATC will make time. Emergency fuel is always LESS then minimum fuel...minimum is still fine, emergency is "I NEED TO LAND NOW, PLZ!" Landing on two gears is hard but possible, however, that is a landing I would only attempt with my hand on the ejection in case I mess it up XD [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] GCI: "Control to SEAD: Enemy SAM site 190 for 30, cleared to engage" Striker: "Copy, say Altitude?" GCI: "....Deck....it´s a SAM site..." Striker: "Oh...." Fighter: "Yeah, those pesky russian build, baloon based SAMs." -Red-Lyfe Best way to troll DCS community, make an F-16A, see how dedicated the fans really are :thumbup:
gospadin Posted October 22, 2016 Posted October 22, 2016 I thought so. So this formulation in this thread with minimum x, emergency y is not 100% correct. Emergency can be 1 gram of fuel. Because that means it was an emergency and the fuel was used. It's useless if you reached the so called Emergency value but you still can't land because of the emergency. Say one gear won't come out while the others are stuck outside... in bad weather... with some bombs that won't jettison for some reason... battle damage or something. Emergency fuel simply means any value less than minimum standard fuel for a normal landing procedure, and as was said, you then would declare an emergency and get priority. If you had a stuck gear AND armament you couldn't jettison, they'd likely have you eject and crash the plane off-airport to minimize potential damage to the runway and other stores/aircraft. In Vietnam it was relatively common for battle-damaged aircraft to be ditched in the ocean near the carrier, so as to not risk the boat. The support helos would then fish the pilot out of the water. --gos My liveries, mods, and missions for DCS:World M-2000C English Cockpit | Extra Beacons Mod | Nav Kneeboard | Community A-4E
mvsgas Posted October 22, 2016 Posted October 22, 2016 I do not think this is related, but when talking about inability to land and reaching fuel minimums https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2735173&postcount=351 To whom it may concern, I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that. Thank you for you patience. Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..
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