China get Su-33!

[ALDEGA]

Correct. Export name Su-33UB with thrust vector engines.

 

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/flankers_pages/su-27kub.htm

It looks sick. :D

 

We definitely need a new model for Lockon ;)

[Guest IguanaKing]

Heh...D Scythe beat me to it. :D

[4c Hajduk Veljko]

Um, what? Read his post carefully again. He EXPLICITLY states that IF the Su-33 got the upgrades (like the Su-27KUB), THEN it would be able to use...whatever we're talking about.

You are right, I see your point.

 

Well, I am still asking about Alfa's source of information.

 

Never, never doubt Alfa on Russian naval equipment ;)

Really, why not? Nevertheless, I have full respect for Alfa.

[Kusch]

Well, I am still asking about Alfa's source of information.

 

Example:

 

Lotnictwo nr 04/2003

Suchoj Su-33

Piotr Butowski (Red star Guru :) )

 

 

http://sklep.magnum-x.pl/product_info.php?cPath=23_55&products_id=273

[hitman]

I call on Alfa to write a book on this sort of thing. That way he has the authority to tell people where to stick their "whats your reference" questions. :)

[4c Hajduk Veljko]

I am preparing to write a letter to Yefim Gordon (YG) and Peter Davison (PD). Does anybody on this forum have a credible source so that I can point it to the YG and PD and ask for a correction in their book?

 

Kush, you mentioned Piotr Butowski. Do you know if there is an English translation of his Su-27 book?

 

Does anybody else on this forum have a book in English that specifically state that current Su-33’s require further upgrades to be able to carry and launch 3M80 “moskit”?

[Dudikoff]

I agree with Veljko here: unless someone points to a valid source stating SU33 cannot carry Moskit, I'll belive Yephim Gordon who has, afterall, written 'few' pages on the matter.

 

LOL, if it was anyone else but Yefim.. I'll give an example of his MiG-29 book where he gives comparisons between MiG-29A/M and other fighters and it's embarassing to say the least.

 

If you want a more serious Flanker book, get Flanker Story by Andrei Fomin. This book, for instance, states that Moskit capability was a part of suggested Su-33 upgrade program (among other upgrades) which never happened.

[Alfa]

LOL....thanks for the confindence guys :) .

 

Vejlko,

 

Well, I am still asking about Alfa's source of information

 

I have no single source of information I can just point you to mate :) .

 

Anyway, the Su-33 can indeed carry the Moskit - there was an early effort to equip it with this weapon and mounting devices were made for the purpose......but it cannot deploy it because:

 

a). The SUV-33 radar/weapons control system of the Su-33 is all but identical to that of the Su-27S - including the NIIP-N001 radar which doesn't support the missile nor has air-to-surface modes to find targets for it.

 

Quick link:

http://www.airshow.ru/expo/111/prod_778.htm

 

Not a very indept account for the SUV-33, but it does mention the differences between the SUV-27 and evolved SUV-30/SUV-33, for which a more powerful version of the EOS is the most significant feature - the radar(N001 shown on the photo) is the same.

 

b). An airlaunched version of the Moskit was under development but, according to Raduga(the designer), this development was suspended - partially due to the lack of funds after the demise of the Soviet Union and partially because the navy came to the conclusion that such a weapon would be "unpractical" operational load for the Su-33. The 3M80E "Moskit" is currently operational only in its SSM form(P-270) - equipping ships such as Pr. 956("Sovremenny-class") destroyers and Pr. 1242.1 ("Tarantul-III") missile boats.

 

There was an early proposal to upgrade the Su-33 with a "multirole" firecontrol system including the "Zhuk-27" radar(upscaled version of initial N010 "Zhuk" for the MiG-29M/MiG-29K), but it was never pursued for the operational Su-33s. A lot of the incorrect references to a multirole capable Su-33 you can find on the internet stems from those proposals and anticipation of their realisation.

 

The closest to a realisation of a multirole Su-33 is the new twin-seat Su-27KUB prototype, which was equipped with the Zhuk-MS radar(refined and modernized version of the "Zhuk-27").

 

 

I believe the Su-27KUB has since had its Zhuk-MS replaced by the further developed electronically scanned phased array version of this called "Zhuk-MSF".

 

My point was that if China indeed does procure new-built single seat Su-33s, there is a chance that they would be equipped with radar/weapons control system similar to that of the Su-27KUB and thus be capable of deploying anti-ship missiles :) . But considering the large size/weight of the Su-33, the ramp launch method and the relatively moderate amount of Su-33s the Varyag can accomodate, I would consider the use of smaller ASMs such as Kh-35 or Kh-31As(which are more in line with operational load realised with currently operated Russian Su-33s) to be a more realistic/practical scenario than a revived airlaunched version of the Moskit.....or Yakhont for that matter(for which an airlaunched version does exist) :) .

 

Cheers,

- JJ.

[Kusch]

Kush, you mentioned Piotr Butowski. Do you know if there is an English translation of his Su-27 book?

 

Ask self Piotr Butowski on this forum ;)

 

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=5

 

Piotr Butowski, nick name PiBu, example this thread:

 

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/showthread.php?t=63065&page=1

[HRZ]

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Cheers,

- JJ.

 

Alfa, are you by any chance born on an aircraft carrier??

[ALDEGA]

Alfa, are you by any chance born on an aircraft carrier??

His real name is Admiral Kuznetsov.

[Alfa]

Alfa, are you by any chance born on an aircraft carrier??

 

LOL.....no but I do have a thing for them :wub: .

 

Cheers,

- JJ.

[hitman]

His birth was the result of a MiG-29 and an Su-33 dogfighting mother-nature style.

[Force_Feedback]

His birth was the result of a MiG-29 and an Su-33 dogfighting mother-nature style.

 

Lol, did the tailpipes match? :megalol: