Decibel dB Posted June 29, 2018 Posted June 29, 2018 On the last mini update from Matt he says the CBU accuracy as been fixed but I can't hit anything with them, I alright with the rest but not with the CBU's any pointer? I am doing it CCIP, MFUZ to VT and HT 300. Quote from Matt "In addition to the nice update this week, the team is working furiously on many other items to get the Hornet foundation solid by the end of the month. Here are some items already resolved internally that will be pushed soon to an update: 2- Canister munitions (MK-20 and CBU-99) are now much more accurate. Note that you’ll need to set the MFUZ to VT. You can then set a Height Of Burst (HOB) using the HT function on the SMS page."
backspace340 Posted June 29, 2018 Posted June 29, 2018 We haven't had the update with that change in yet - last open beta update was on the 20th, his post is from the 22nd. It'll be in the next update which is hopefully today?
Oban Posted June 29, 2018 Posted June 29, 2018 or ....on the 4th July, which would be quite appropriate :D AMD Ryzen 9 7845HX with Radeon Graphics 3.00 GHz 32 GB RAM 2 TB SSD RTX 4070 8GB Windows 11 64 bit
Decibel dB Posted June 29, 2018 Author Posted June 29, 2018 Oh I see I tough it updated yesterday. Thanks for the reply
xjiks Posted June 29, 2018 Posted June 29, 2018 Good news ! I thought I was missing something in the profile or did wrong because bombs were always falling very short distance. L'important n'est pas de tuer, mais de survivre. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] if you read this you are too curious
Eldur Posted June 29, 2018 Posted June 29, 2018 Looking forward to get that fix. Anyway I'd pretty much appreciate if ED could tell us the difference between the Mk-20 (which is CBU-100) and the CBU-99.
Bluegrass Posted June 30, 2018 Posted June 30, 2018 Looking forward to get that fix. Anyway I'd pretty much appreciate if ED could tell us the difference between the Mk-20 (which is CBU-100) and the CBU-99. AMD Ryzen 5 3600 | 32gb DDR4 | GeForce 3070 | TM Warthog Stick | MFG Crosswinds V2 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Eldur Posted July 1, 2018 Posted July 1, 2018 Seen that already on description, thanks for posting it here anyway. Basically that information just extends the question to what the difference is between those dispensers. I'd somehow guess it's similar to the LAU-68 and -131 launchers where one of them is USAF and the other USN/USMC with a special paint for offshore duty, but no technical differences regarding the weapon system itself.
Lithion Posted July 1, 2018 Posted July 1, 2018 Looking forward to get that fix. Anyway I'd pretty much appreciate if ED could tell us the difference between the Mk-20 (which is CBU-100) and the CBU-99. This very same question has popped up on the A-10 subforum as well, the answer I saw listed there was that the CBU-99 would have more anti-tank focussed charges, whilst the MK-20 would have more anti-material (little less penetration, but still HEAT) charges. However, just did some digging HERE and it seems like they're essentially the same, except for the dispenser. T.16000m HOTAS + Pedals || TrackIR5 || Win10 64bit || 120+500GB SSD, 1TB HDD || i5 4440 @3.3GHz || 16GB RAM @ 1600MHz || GTX1070 G1 || FCIII, L39ZA, AJS-37, Normandy '44, Persian Gulf, Channel F/A-18C, Bf-109 K-4, WW2 Asset Pack, CA, P-47, F-16
Decibel dB Posted July 5, 2018 Author Posted July 5, 2018 After yesterday update I still can't hit anything with those, I don't know what I do wrong
paura19 Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 min 1800ft , pitch -15°, 400Knots MB2 Czech DCS server. Youtube české Tutorialy Discord MB2 1.Flight | =UVP= Czech school of TOP GUN | DCS at Airshow - Aviaticka Pout 4K player | ASUS B760-F | i7 13700KF 5,4Ghz | MSI 4080 SUPRIME X | 64Gb G.Skill 6000MHz | 2TB M2.PCIe4 for DCS | Corsair RM1000e | (build 2023)
Yoda967 Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 After yesterday update I still can't hit anything with those, I don't know what I do wrong Looking back to your first post, your buttonology is correct, but it's hard to tell what you're doing wrong without a trackfile. I can offer some tips that helped me, though: After you roll in on the target, hold your dive angle (-15 degrees will work, as the previous poster said, and so will -25 degrees) and keep the VV above the pull up cue. Line up the bomb fall line (BFL) on your target and wait until the CCIP cross appears at the bottom of the HUD. Don't try to move the CCIP onto the target, just keep the BFL on the target and let the CCIP cross move up onto the target as you descend. Press the pickle when the CCIP cross is on target, hold the pickle until all bombs are away and start your egress maneuver. Very Respectfully, Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch San Diego, California "In my private manual I firmly believed the only time there was too much fuel aboard any aircraft was if it was fire." --Ernest K. Gann
Decibel dB Posted July 5, 2018 Author Posted July 5, 2018 That's pretty much what I do, well at least what I think I do lol. I see them exploding in the air then on the ground but doesn't hit anything. This is with the instant action mission. I'll try to make one on the ME to see if the result are different
Hog_No32 Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 Works pretty accurate in CCIP for me now after the update, even though I only tried the Mk20s yesterday, not the CBU-99s. I attacked an SA-6 site (1 STR and 2 LNs) two times yesterday. In both runs I popped up about 4-5 NM from tree-top level to about 4500ish feet and then dived to the target. First run: 2x Mk20, burst height 500, INT 300ft. Got a good kill on the STR between the two launchers. The launchers were still intact though. Second run: 2x Mk20, burst height 800, no interval (both released at the same time): Again a good kill on the STR and one LN damaged. So for me they work really well now. I guess the fact that not all units inside the effect radius are killed is probably a realistic representation for (lightly) armoured vehicles and CBU effectiveness.
backspace340 Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 So for me they work really well now. I guess the fact that not all units inside the effect radius are killed is probably a realistic representation for (lightly) armoured vehicles and CBU effectiveness. They're meant to be anti-tank bomblets capable of penetrating 150mm of armour (which should be easily enough to penetrate a T72 roof, possibly up to the T90) - it's also meant to spread 247 bomblets over 2,750 square meters (roughly half a US football field). It doesn't *feel* like it's meeting that level of potency / effectiveness. If it behaved in reality like it does in-game, you've got to wonder why the US dropped so many of them during the Gulf Wars - a single Mk 83 does a better job most of the time and I imagine that's a lot cheaper to make.
Decibel dB Posted July 5, 2018 Author Posted July 5, 2018 I am trying everything that I think off and it always hit short. I am doing it CCIP, MFUZ to VT and HT 300, 600, all the way to 3000 and no luck. Here's the question. Should I pickle it any different then any Mk dump bomb? I mean I am spot on on a CCIP delivery on a MK 83 or 84 and if i use the same technique with the canister it fall short
Yoda967 Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 Decibel_dB, Have you updated to the latest version? After the latest update, I've been getting spot-on accuracy with CBUs. Very Respectfully, Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch San Diego, California "In my private manual I firmly believed the only time there was too much fuel aboard any aircraft was if it was fire." --Ernest K. Gann
Hog_No32 Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 [...] Here's the question. Should I pickle it any different then any Mk dump bomb? I mean I am spot on on a CCIP delivery on a MK 83 or 84 and if i use the same technique with the canister it fall short What you observe is how it was for me before the update, they always fell short. After the update, I figure you release just like a Mk83 when the CCIP cross is over the target. For me they fall exactly where the CCIP cross was upon pickle (with a very light wind of only 1kt).
Lithion Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 So for me they work really well now. I guess the fact that not all units inside the effect radius are killed is probably a realistic representation for (lightly) armoured vehicles and CBU effectiveness. If it behaved in reality like it does in-game, you've got to wonder why the US dropped so many of them during the Gulf Wars - a single Mk 83 does a better job most of the time and I imagine that's a lot cheaper to make. You guys are both missing the fact that even slightly damaging a missile or radar renders it unusable IRL. This is just a shortcoming on the current DCS damage model. Fragmentation does less to damage tanks and APC's than a nice spread of cluster bombs. Pressing pickle and getting your MK-83 on exactly that point is a complete fantasy and just a limitation of what can be accurately simulated, or a shortcoming of mission design: no wind settings? No multi-layered wind directions? I just tested it against some tanks: a lower separtion altitude does more to damage a tank since more bomblets are hurting it, but it was quite difficult for me to actually kill it. But then I realised that IRL, that would've knocked out the gun, engine, maybe a track or the vision slits, or maybe even a crew member or ammo cookoff. They would just bail out or have to call in the engineers to get fixed up. Just because things don't go boom doesn't mean you haven't achieved the objective you were dropping that ordnance for. As a finishing note, Heatblur and ED have been working on improving the cluster (sub)munitions damage model, and some improved BK-90 footage is out there on the forum/youtube. T.16000m HOTAS + Pedals || TrackIR5 || Win10 64bit || 120+500GB SSD, 1TB HDD || i5 4440 @3.3GHz || 16GB RAM @ 1600MHz || GTX1070 G1 || FCIII, L39ZA, AJS-37, Normandy '44, Persian Gulf, Channel F/A-18C, Bf-109 K-4, WW2 Asset Pack, CA, P-47, F-16
Lithion Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 That's pretty much what I do, well at least what I think I do lol. I see them exploding in the air then on the ground but doesn't hit anything. This is with the instant action mission. I'll try to make one on the ME to see if the result are different I've been trying them out just now, and I've made a couple of ground rules for myself: -Don't chase the pipper, meaning, don't try and push Neg-G to get your CCIP on the target. Do a proper run-in. -Release altitude should be a factor of 4-5 to your separation altitude (example: HT 1200: release altititude is about 6000ft) This helps with giving the ordnance proper ballistics before separation. -Learn to account for wind dispersion. Check the briefing for the current conditions and adjust your aiming for this. Lighter submunitions get pushed around more than a heavy 1000lb MK-83. T.16000m HOTAS + Pedals || TrackIR5 || Win10 64bit || 120+500GB SSD, 1TB HDD || i5 4440 @3.3GHz || 16GB RAM @ 1600MHz || GTX1070 G1 || FCIII, L39ZA, AJS-37, Normandy '44, Persian Gulf, Channel F/A-18C, Bf-109 K-4, WW2 Asset Pack, CA, P-47, F-16
Decibel dB Posted July 5, 2018 Author Posted July 5, 2018 (edited) Thank you all for helping me with that. To answer the questions yes it's the latest update. I did a few more run and I like to believe I don't chase the pipper and I have steady hands, I manage to hit them only when more then 30ich degrees anything shallower it fall before. Is it better HT a low or higher altitude? The altitude separation 4 or 5 is a good pointer :thumbup: Edited July 5, 2018 by Decibel dB
Lithion Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 (edited) Is it better HT a low or higher altitude? It depends on the desired effect really, and for this answer it's important to know what lower/higher altitude does. If you're going for a lower HT altitude, the submunitions have less time to disperse. In a nutshell more bomblets will hit the same targets in a smaller area. If you're going for a higher HT altitude, the submunitions disperse more. So in this case, the same number of bomblets will cover a wider area. If you need to hit a tank, you need multiple bomblets: low HT altitude. If you need to hit multiple (lightly skinned) in a wider area (AA emplacements, convoys): higher HT altitude Edited July 5, 2018 by Lithion markup T.16000m HOTAS + Pedals || TrackIR5 || Win10 64bit || 120+500GB SSD, 1TB HDD || i5 4440 @3.3GHz || 16GB RAM @ 1600MHz || GTX1070 G1 || FCIII, L39ZA, AJS-37, Normandy '44, Persian Gulf, Channel F/A-18C, Bf-109 K-4, WW2 Asset Pack, CA, P-47, F-16
Banzaiib Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 anti armor? CBU-99 can't kill anything! (did some testing yesterday) I put 8 (yes.. all 8 of them i was carrying) of them into a T-80, no damage. (500 ft burst height) I could clearly see them exploding with the target right in the middle of the burst... I put 8 of them into a BMP... no damage... I put 8 of them into a shilka... no damage... what the heck are they good for?
Hog_No32 Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 You guys are both missing the fact that even slightly damaging a missile or radar renders it unusable IRL. [...] I always appreciate when someone recognizes a misunderstanding. But how you come to this conclusion from what I wrote really puzzles me. I was not all complaining that not all units were killed. Also, doing ground pounding for 10+ years in the Hog, I absolutely understand the limitations of DCS when it comes to fragmentation damage. The OP reported issues with the delivery accuracy, not issues with the effect that the ammunition has or has not. By the way, you may have noticed I reported killing the SA-6 radar. So even though the Mk20 did not kill the launchers my attack rendered them useless without the radar. Mission accomplished.
TwojaStara Posted July 5, 2018 Posted July 5, 2018 anti armor? CBU-99 can't kill anything! (did some testing yesterday) I put 8 (yes.. all 8 of them i was carrying) of them into a T-80, no damage. (500 ft burst height) I could clearly see them exploding with the target right in the middle of the burst... I put 8 of them into a BMP... no damage... I put 8 of them into a shilka... no damage... what the heck are they good for? Same tests, same results. However BTR-80 and other APCs are killed without problem.
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