3600X and VR ?

[Svsmokey]

So thinking of a new build , and $ are definitely a factor . I have read elsewhere that AMD gpu's are less than stellar for VR . How about the cpu's ? I'm thinking of a 3600X to drive my current 1070 and CV1 , with a view to upgrading to a 2070S and Rift S or Reverb down the road . Anyone have VR experience with a 3600X ? Thanks !

Edited November 1, 2019 by Svsmokey

[DeltaMike]

It's fine. I don't know how much of a budget option it is.

 

Main place to save money I think is on the motherboard, assuming this is for DCS only there's no point in overclocking so you can get away with a cheap-ish mobo and stock cooler. I like MSI's gaming plus series, I might go with their X470 if building today but B450 is fine. I like that you can flash BIOS without a chip on the board, also there are plenty of USB channels. You can still run into conflicts but at least you can move stuff around to make it work. Plenty of fan headers. Decent cheap board

 

I'm assuming you want to cannibalize parts from your current build. Check the mobo's manufacturer website to make sure your RAM will run at rated speed. Even better, budget for decent ram 3200mhz minimum, 3600mhz ideal. Don't hamstring that beautiful CPU.

 

But, you should notice a *substantial* improvement from the CPU upgrade, you will definitely notice a difference. Busy MP servers like growling sidewinder smooth right on out, insanely busy servers like GAW will become playable. Even in VR this is a CPU game

Edited November 1, 2019 by DeltaMike

[jwilliams417]

LOL, whoever you heard that from is nuts. I run a Ryzen 2700x with a 1070ti on a Samsung Odyssey + HMD and it runs absolutely awesome. I use the standard in game VR settings tweaked up a bit and can still run 45-58 fps in vr depending on the situation, never dips below. That 3600x would outrun my 2700x easily.

[Svsmokey]

Thanks for the answers ! @jwilliams , i was referring to gpu's with the "less than stellar" vr comment . I note with interest that you're running a 1070ti :)

 

And welcome to the forums !

Edited November 1, 2019 by Svsmokey

[Svsmokey]

It's fine. I don't know how much of a budget option it is.

 

Main place to save money I think is on the motherboard, assuming this is for DCS only there's no point in overclocking so you can get away with a cheap-ish mobo and stock cooler. I like MSI's gaming plus series, I might go with their X470 if building today but B450 is fine. I like that you can flash BIOS without a chip on the board, also there are plenty of USB channels. You can still run into conflicts but at least you can move stuff around to make it work. Plenty of fan headers. Decent cheap board

 

I'm assuming you want to cannibalize parts from your current build. Check the mobo's manufacturer website to make sure your RAM will run at rated speed. Even better, budget for decent ram 3200mhz minimum, 3600mhz ideal. Don't hamstring that beautiful CPU.

 

But, you should notice a *substantial* improvement from the CPU upgrade, you will definitely notice a difference. Busy MP servers like growling sidewinder smooth right on out, insanely busy servers like GAW will become playable. Even in VR this is a CPU game

 

Yeah , one of the considerations for the upgrade is to enable faster ram . Good advice !

[Gnadentod]

LOL, whoever you heard that from is nuts. I run a Ryzen 2700x with a 1070ti on a Samsung Odyssey + HMD and it runs absolutely awesome. I use the standard in game VR settings tweaked up a bit and can still run 45-58 fps in vr depending on the situation, never dips below. That 3600x would outrun my 2700x easily.

In VR the goal is to hit the refresh rate 100% of the time. Medium FPS on a normal screen is negligible, not so with a VR headset because of the dual picture 3D effect. Better have "too much" horsepower than too few. 45 FPS is barely the refresh rate of any HMD.

[jwilliams417]

In VR the goal is to hit the refresh rate 100% of the time. Medium FPS on a normal screen is negligible, not so with a VR headset because of the dual picture 3D effect. Better have "too much" horsepower than too few. 45 FPS is barely the refresh rate of any HMD.

 

In any game the goal is to hit 100% RR, but lets play in VR reality for just a minute, and reality is you arent hitting 90fps in DCS VR without a beast of a rig or looking like utter shit in game. 40+ has always been the target in VR to keep it smooth.

[DeltaMike]

^I really like the concept of a target FPS. In other words, there's a time budget where both the CPU and the GPU have to get their work done, and you adjust your settings to hit that target. FPS is almost meaningless, and % utilization is almost precisely meaningless.

 

CPU plays a big role, in areas that surprise people sometimes. Shadows and trees for example suck up as much CPU power as GPU. Draw range has (or at least had, haven't tested it lately) a huge effect on CPU.

 

I think it's wise to max out the CPU side of things first, although I swear I don't see how one flies a CV1 on a 1070 without clawing your eyes out. I see a new GPU in your future, obiwan. (It never ends, does it?)

[Svsmokey]

^I really like the concept of a target FPS. In other words, there's a time budget where both the CPU and the GPU have to get their work done, and you adjust your settings to hit that target. FPS is almost meaningless, and % utilization is almost precisely meaningless.

 

CPU plays a big role, in areas that surprise people sometimes. Shadows and trees for example suck up as much CPU power as GPU. Draw range has (or at least had, haven't tested it lately) a huge effect on CPU.

 

I think it's wise to max out the CPU side of things first, although I swear I don't see how one flies a CV1 on a 1070 without clawing your eyes out. I see a new GPU in your future, obiwan. (It never ends, does it?)

 

I dunno , my system is punching above its weight somehow . All the settings that are important to me , including civil traffic , shadows (including terrain) water high , clutter maxed (mainly for helos) , trees far enough out to avoid "popping up " , msaa x2 and pd 1.2 still provide 45 fps (very) low over the Caucasus , including cities .

 

No , it never ends !

 

I am planning cpu , mb , memory and gpu upgrades for a higher- res headset (Gawd i wish the Reverb wasn't WMR ) , but in the meantime my CV1 is providing a great experience in the Albatross , Hornet , Huey and TF-51 .

 

This solo and mostly ground attack , nav exercises , and tourist flights .

[Gnadentod]

In any game the goal is to hit 100% RR, but lets play in VR reality for just a minute, and reality is you arent hitting 90fps in DCS VR without a beast of a rig or looking like utter shit in game. 40+ has always been the target in VR to keep it smooth.

On a normal screen not hitting the refresh rate is negligible and doesn't change the end result so much like it does in VR not hitting the HMD refresh rate. Hitting the refresh rate was and still is the target to hit in VR, not 40+ FPS. It's just a stepping stone until the hardware and software in combination has matured enough to constantly hit the HMD refresh rate, not the goal. Saying to someone he only has to aim for 40 to 50 FPS or so for VR, then it would be awesome, is not a legit advice.

Edited November 2, 2019 by Der Hirte

[Svsmokey]

On a normal screen not hitting the refresh rate is negligible and doesn't change the end result so much like it does in VR not hitting the HMD refresh rate. Hitting the refresh rate was and still is the target to hit in VR, not 40+ FPS. It's just a stepping stone until the hardware and software in combination has matured enough to constantly hit the HMD refresh rate, not the goal. Saying to someone he only has to aim for 40 to 50 FPS or so for VR, then it would be awesome, is not a legit advice.

 

Do you fly in VR ?

[David OC]

On a normal screen not hitting the refresh rate is negligible and doesn't change the end result so much like it does in VR not hitting the HMD refresh rate. Hitting the refresh rate was and still is the target to hit in VR, not 40+ FPS. It's just a stepping stone until the hardware and software in combination has matured enough to constantly hit the HMD refresh rate, not the goal. Saying to someone he only has to aim for 40 to 50 FPS or so for VR, then it would be awesome, is not a legit advice.

 

Do you fly in VR ?

 

Must be in that

that is made simple for VR.

 

There is no way your hitting the refresh rate in DCS, most bring the eye candy down to hit the asw 45 for the rift. Half the refresh and hold that and it's good.

 

"hardware and software in combination has matured"

 

It has, for now it's called asw for the rift. Here is the latest on asw for RTX cards.

Edited November 2, 2019 by David OC

[Gnadentod]

There is no way your hitting the refresh rate in DCS, ...

Never did I claim it is possible. This is also the reason why I said the hardware and software in combination has to mature so then it is possible.

 

It should be the goal when you build a NEW system around DCS VR, not settling for "40+ FPS" and then go with it.

 

... most bring the eye candy down to hit the asw 45 for the rift. Half the refresh and hold that and it's good.

 

"hardware and software in combination has matured"

So it has not matured to the point where it needs to be, since you need to bring the "eye candy" down. Good to know.

 

"hardware and software in combination has matured"

 

It has, for now it's called asw for the rift.

It's not like you can buy and use other headsets than the rift which most simulator pilots do in fact right?

 

Do everyone a favor and read carefully, don't put words in my mouth. I thank you a lot.

[Svsmokey]

Never did I claim it is possible. This is also the reason why I said the hardware and software in combination has to mature so then it is possible.

 

Saying to someone he only has to aim for 40 to 50 FPS or so for VR, then it would be awesome, is not a legit advice.

 

I assure you it is awesome , even on my rig , and that if there is no conflict between these two statements , you must be saying that no one should fly VR in DCS . Or perhaps that no one should fly with a WMR headset in DCS ?

Edited November 2, 2019 by Svsmokey

[David OC]

Never did I claim it is possible.

So it has not matured to the point where it needs to be, since you need to bring the "eye candy" down. Good to know.

 

Do everyone a favor and read carefully, don't put words in my mouth. I thank you a lot.

 

Have a little think before posting. Its not all about the tech now. At the moment its a lot to about the software its working with. DCS was never designed around vr, it still is one of the best vr experience you can have as long as you can keep good frames.

 

Seeing you know all and just post with no substance here. What is a good fps to hit on thr other vr headsets in dcs. That would be the question to ask others here and be helpful to others looking at what to buy. Not just post to criticize for somthing to do.

Edited November 2, 2019 by David OC

[Gnadentod]

Have a little think before posting. ...

 

Seeing you know all and just post with no substance here. ...

Always a pleasure seeing people projecting or putting claims into others mouths so they can then debate against these self made claims, then getting emotional when countered for the immature shit they do. I do in fact know how to read others statements and focus only on what they've said instead of creating some imaginary claims to them. Atleast you've tried, clap clap.

Edited November 2, 2019 by Der Hirte

[David OC]

Always a pleasure seeing people projecting or putting claims into others mouths so they can then debate against these self made claims, then getting emotional when countered for the immature shit they do. I do in fact know how to read others statements and focus only on what they've said instead of creating some imaginary claims to them. Atleast you've tried, clap clap.

 

Still digging that hole deeper I see.

 

I will be ignoring you now, thanks for the great input here. I'm sure it helped many people out here in this thread.:thumbup:

 

 

I assure you it is awesome , even on my rig , and that if there is no conflict between these two statements , you must be saying that no one should fly VR in DCS . Or perhaps that no one should fly with a WMR headset in DCS ?

 

 

Got an answer for Svsmokey?

Edited November 3, 2019 by David OC

[Gnadentod]

Still digging that hole deeper I see.

Wait a second.

 

Got an answer for Svsmokey?

What you've posted isn't a question so there's no need for an answer but instead it's a perfect illustration of what I've said previously about misinterpreting what I said to debate against YOUR OWN misinterpretations, e.g. putting words in others mouths. Let's see what he wrote: "I assure you it is awesome , even on my rig , and that if there is no conflict between these two statements , you must be saying that no one should fly VR in DCS ."

Good. He assures me it is awesome although I never said it can't be awesome, I've never given a valuation, but you talk like I did. He also says that I must be saying that no one should fly in VR in DCS, which I also never said but again was put into my mouth. I ONLY meant that giving people the advice to just aim for "40+ FPS" or so for DCS VR is undeniably not a legit advice. Simple as that. It's not what you're aiming for in DCS VR, that there are functions like ASW doesn't negate the goal being to achieve the HMD refresh rate in terms of FPS. I have never given valuations, you painted me like I did.

 

... thanks for the great input here. I'm sure it helped many people out here in this thread.:thumbup:

Should be obvious to most anyway but still glad to help.

 

I will be ignoring you now, ...

This all isn't your fault, for most it's hard to grasp with an IQ of 105 or so. Have fun "ignoring" me snack. Still digging that hole deeper I see.

Edited November 3, 2019 by Der Hirte

[BitMaster]

No one wins if you keep on fighting each other ????

 

Open a virtual beer, say Cheers and Prost and be comrades again ????????????????‍

[BitMaster]

Oh, my Beer emoji became lots of ????.... Funny

 

iPhone Emojis don’t like this forum haha, the male emoji is a friendly hand btw, aaahhh

 

Need coffee

[Delta59R]

Oh, my Beer emoji became lots of ????.... Funny

 

iPhone Emojis don’t like this forum haha, the male emoji is a friendly hand btw, aaahhh

 

Need coffee

 

It made me like the post even more! People Love to get mad in forums. Will it ever end ????????

 

 

TO THE OP, I'm curious what kind of cpu usage you typically see.

[BitMaster]

I have once read a signature here in DCS Forum, it goes somehow like this:

 

"Don't post in anger or it will be the greatest post you will ever regret"

 

I commit, in my younger days I really did not obey that golden rule of online communication. Not that I ever insulted or went vs. somebody personal but it made me think, think twice often before I even start to type. Often I write a lot...and then delete the whole thing and let it be, w/o my comment. It paid I dare to say. Less stress, less anger, longer & better life :)

 

We all share this dream of DCS, let us be comrades. Let us debate but not fight.

[Delta59R]

I have once read a signature here in DCS Forum, it goes somehow like this:

 

"Don't post in anger or it will be the greatest post you will ever regret"

 

I commit, in my younger days I really did not obey that golden rule of online communication. Not that I ever insulted or went vs. somebody personal but it made me think, think twice often before I even start to type. Often I write a lot...and then delete the whole thing and let it be, w/o my comment. It paid I dare to say. Less stress, less anger, longer & better life :)

 

We all share this dream of DCS, let us be comrades. Let us debate but not fight.

 

 

I couldn't agree more, we should all work on it. Its hard sometimes not to bite back. Just the other day on this forum a member first let me know how hard he was trying not to be rude before telling me that I didn't know what the hell I was talking about LOL. People do struggle to be polite when there isn't that face to face interaction.

[Svsmokey]

It made me like the post even more! People Love to get mad in forums. Will it ever end ????????

 

 

TO THE OP, I'm curious what kind of cpu usage you typically see.

 

The number in Afterburner is about 35% . Gpu 90% . I take both of those numbers with a tablespoon of salt . According to pc bottleneck , my cpu bottlenecks the 1070 by 38% . I can see the cpu struggling in the form of shadows being drawn at close distances . Not all shadows , but some . And my view distance is "low" .

I've decided in any case to aim a little higher for the cpu upgrade , prolly a 9700k / mid-rsange Gigabyte MB / biggest Noctua i can stuff into my case . About $ 650 altogether . Temporarily use my existing memory until i replace my existing power supply (Evga 650 bronze 80) , then the headset . By then , the 3070 should be launched , which is rumored at this point to have 12gb memory .

 

Yeah , while not as helpful as they might be sometimes , these and other forums always provide insight into human nature :)

Edited November 3, 2019 by Svsmokey

[BitMaster]

DCS Forum is by far the most clean & polite and thus useful forum I have come across in years.

 

It it wasn't like this, I'd be gone in a minute.