Trackir 5 concerns.

[ronald15]

Everything works fine. Beautiful simulation, except, when I have Trackir 5 enabled I get massive simmering. If I alt tab out of Trackir 5, I get an almost perfect display. I have found almost nothing on this issue. Am I missing something? Please. Is there a fix for this problem. Thanks for any help.

[ilikepie]

I get massive simmering

 

what is this exactly ? is it a visual artifact or is it shaking? bit more detail will help troubleshoot the problem.

 

I have TIR5 with 0 issues

[ronald15]

It is a visual artifact on horizontal and vertical lines. in and out of the cockpit. as though there is no antialiasing. Spudknocker mentioned it in his graphics tutorial. I am running at 2560x1440 @60htz. RTX 2060,i7-9700k,z390 board. But, I am sure the issue is with the Trackir 5, the difference is just to obvious. I have tweaked the game and nvidia settings as best as I can. What do you think?

[ilikepie]

I've never heard or experienced TIR causing visual artifacts. but thats not to say it cant happen.does it happen with all aircraft or one in particular? got a screenshot? sound like rendering rather than track ir, stable or beta version?

[ronald15]

This shimmering happens in the DCS world, everything. what is rendering the video card? This problem was obvious in stable versions, 2.5.5 and 2.5.6. I am surprised so few people have complained about this problem. All the DCS videos look solid. Go figure!!! Thanks anyway.

[ilikepie]

i'd be looking at gpu settings. start with everything application controlled in in gpu panel and set low everything in dcs and start from there. bumping things up and checking what effect they have until the problem occurs.

 

if it is track ir you should jump on the naturalpoint forums and submit a ticket. super unusual. i've used tir for over 10 years and not had it interfere with graphics. but , first time for everything...

[ronald15]

Sorry for the delay. Natural point was no help. They offered a bunch of generic questions etc. Are you saying that there is no difference in shimmering with trackir enabled and your display with trackir disabled? Looks like I have to investigate from the beginning as you suggested. Since there have been few complaints, I thought it was something that stuck out about my rig. Thanks.

[ilikepie]

if you can make a vid of it, it might help people trouble shoot

 

also what are your system specs?

Edited June 14, 2020 by ilikepie

[VeeSPIKE]

It sounds like you are running TIR open in the background. If you are not tweaking controls or settings for some reason, try running it minimized. It'll give the Windows viewport one less thing to be concerned with.

[ronald15]

Windows 10,7 duel boot. I7-9700k,Z390 AORUS MASTER,RTX2060,SAMSUNG 830,850 series ssd's,Samsung 970 pro NVMe,Dell at 2560x1440@60hz.SOUND BLASTER RECON3D,Logitech Extreme 3D PRO,SAITEK X52 PRO. Thanks, I will make a video as soon as I figure out how to do it. Also, thanks VeeSPIKE, I am running trackir minimized in the background.

[David OC]

OR take a screenshot by hitting print screen button.

 

Image found

C:\Users\YOUR USER NAME\Saved Games\DCS beta or stable etgc\ScreenShots.

[Vertigo72]

Do you have g-sync enabled by any chance? I did some tests recently and found that enabling g-sync (on my monitor which isnt certified and only officially supports freesync but does kinda support g-sync) causes weird shimmering, tearing and micro stuttering in combination with trackir. Disabling it and enabling v-sync (either in game or in nvidia control panel) solves that though.

[ronald15]

On this Dell U2713 there is no g-sync. Although I noticed, If i place my hand in front of camera the image freezes, but no shimmering. I guess this is the same as the alt-tab function...

[Vertigo72]

You do have v-sync enabled then? Either in the game or in nvidia driver settings, but not both.

[ronald15]

Yes, v-sync is enabled in the nvidia control panel. I tried all options, with no impact on the shimmering. It is not enabled in the game.

[Vertigo72]

at the risk of asking the obvious, you do have view smoothing set to 50 in trackir? You may even want to experiment with enabling precision mode (F7 by default) and then in the camera settings set the precision mode smoothing to a ridiculous high number like 1000 or 10000. If that doesnt solve anything, then at least we know its not noisy head tracking data causing the problem.

[Lange_666]

except, when I have Trackir 5 enabled I get massive simmering.

If you mean shimmering on the edges of objects, that's normal.

You can reduce the effect by cranking up your anti-aliasing settings as high as you can afford but still you will see a shimmering.

The main reason for this is difference in colour on the edges of objects (or against the background). A very good example are fences or powerlines.

These are made-up often out of 1 or 2 lines of pixels. If these pixels shift colour, you see shimmering. The bigger the difference in colour between the shift, the more shimmering you'll notice.

Now on a still frame, like with no head movement, the pixels don't need to shift, hence no shimmering. But when you use TrackIR, your viewpoint shifts all the time so slightly (even if you think you keep your head still, the tracker will still see movement) which will move the fence/powerline slightly which in turn shifts the colour from the pixels from the fence to the background and back giving the shimmering you see. If it's one straight line that doesn't move (like perfectly horizontal or vertical) you'll see no shimmering. Once it's tilted, the pixels needs to shift all the time when your viewpoint changes, giving you crawling edges.

Not much you can do about it besides moving up your anti-aliasing settings.

And a flightsim, with his constant moving background is even more vulnerable.

Just wait until you go VR, shimmering in 2D is nothing compared to VR (since you need all the power of your GPU to even keep the FPS up to a decent level, there is much less anti-aliasing headroom)

Edited June 16, 2020 by Lange_666
better explained

[Dr_Arrow]

I would also say that this shimmering is normal as your viewpoint is slightly moving edges of objects will shimmer, the only solution as Lange_666 mentioned is to ramp up anti-aliasing. I also have slight object edges shimmering with TIR5 in all sims I fly.

[marcost]

Could also try setting up a deadzone in TrackIR so that small head movements aren't causing in-game movements all the time

[Lange_666]

That only works for looking straight ahead around the centerzone of TrackIR. Once you move out of the centerzone, you are also out of the deadzone already.

[Vertigo72]

I will make a video as soon as I figure out how to do it. .

 

Just point your phone at your screen if need be. Might be enough to show us what the issue is.

[maquez]

It is a visual artifact on horizontal and vertical lines. in and out of the cockpit. as though there is no antialiasing. Spudknocker mentioned it in his graphics tutorial. I am running at 2560x1440 @60htz. RTX 2060,i7-9700k,z390 board. But, I am sure the issue is with the Trackir 5, the difference is just to obvious. I have tweaked the game and nvidia settings as best as I can. What do you think?

 

reverse all Nvidia tweaking and setting to driver default, most of them do have a placebo effect and won't work with DCS

they can even worse the game image experience, like as you describe.

 

disable also vsync and use instead the nvidia frame limiter with a setting to 60

 

try that and report back.

 

I do also use a Nvidia GPU and TrackIr 5 and do not have any problem like you describe.

Edited June 16, 2020 by maquez

[Bob1943]

Just an observation that might be a contributing factor. I see you are running an RTX 2060 with a 1440P monitor. That monitor resolution is a bit of a stretch for an RTX 2060.

 

Playing at 1440P is best experienced with at least an RTX 2070 Super.

[ronald15]

Thanks. I agree with Lange 666, poles and fences are pretty consistent. But, buildings, runway and taxi lines, building lights at night. It can be distracting some times. Cockpit and close-ups are mostly fine. I think I understand technically, what is happening, I just don't understand WHY under trackir this is happening. With trackir disabled, and I look around with my mouse, no shimmering. If I play Battle of Britain under windows 7, no shimmering. All external adjustments have no impact. So it must be trackir specific, or am I missing something obvious. THANKS.

[Lange_666]

I have the same. If i don't use TrackIR (not or paused), shimmering is gone. That's because you look at a still image then. If you move around with keyboard or mouse you generally move in a nice straight line as where you look around with TrackIR, it's a lot more jumpy (up and down, one or 2 rows of pixels is enough) due to the nature of the movement.

Buildings, runway- and taxi lines also suffer. It all depends on the colour difference between the two. That's why you can see shimmering on the edge of a building during the day but not at night. A black building edge against a black night causes no shimmering (it does but since you constantly switch the same colour in and out it isn't noticable). But at night lights come into play for the same reason. IL-2 also has that but to a lot lesser extend. The terrains and other stuff are a lot less detailed and contains a lot less objects then it does in DCS. There are a lot less "edges" there compared to DCS.

 

What are your current settings in DCS (High low textures, MSAA, SSAA etc...)?