Rotary dials with button press or key commands jump 2-5 values each press

[shagrat]

The virtual rotary dial work fine when using mouse-over and scroll-wheel, or left click and hold then drag up/down.

But if you assign buttons or keyboard keys to the respective increase/decrease commands each button pulse causes an inconsistent value increase/decrease of about 2 to 5 digits. I tried to map rotary encoders from the Virpil MT-50CM2 Throttle, then tried simple buttons on the TM Warthog Stick, Virpil MT-50 and finally StreamDeck keys and last just keyboard with A and S for increase and decrease. As soon as a button/key press is sent the value change is larger than one digit at a time and erratic.

As the mouse control works fine, with the scroll-wheel changing one digit per pulse, it must be related to the way the button press is processed?

I tested this in multiple modules and the problem is consistent in all of them, ED or third party.

 

P.S. couldn't find an existing thread about this feel free to merge/delete if this has been reported and already addressed.

[Flappie]

Hi shagrat. I've started a quick test on two aircraft (AJS37, Mi-8MTV2) but haven't encountered your issue so far. Can you please give a couple of rotary command/aircraft associations which don't work properly with keyboards and joysticks?

[rob10]

I understand what you're saying. I use a programmable keyboard and AutoHotKey (AHK) to control things like the brightness on HUD, DDI's and the altimeter pressure. I've had to play with it to get both a consistent response and not have it jump several steps. What it's come down to that seems to work is a "hold key" time 25 ms (I think it's ms that AHK is using as the unit). For those you need to be quick on the keypress with even normal keyboard to make it work. I wonder if a high end/gaming keyboard normally sends faster than a standard keyboard so ends up going more than one "click" on some of these shorter response dials? For things like the UFC keyboard on the other hand, it won't consistently register without going up to a 500 ms (it'll miss some keystrokes). Hopefully this might help point you in the right direction anyway.

[shagrat]

Hi shagrat. I've started a quick test on two aircraft (AJS37, Mi-8MTV2) but haven't encountered your issue so far. Can you please give a couple of rotary command/aircraft associations which don't work properly with keyboards and joysticks?

Let's ignore the joystick buttons, rotary encoders and StreamDeck for now, focus on the standard Keyboard binding that should work for everybody:

A-10C HSI course clockwise/counterclockwise mapped to A and Q on the keyboard. The HSI needle jumps about 2 or 3 degrees on each press, even if you try just to press it as short as possible.

Same for the heading rotary...

F-5E default keybinds LSHFT+LALT+1/2 and LSHFT+LALT+3/4 for HSI the same problem.

With the scroll-wheel on the mouse each pulse/click increases/decreases exactly one degree.

 

[shagrat]

I understand what you're saying. I use a programmable keyboard and AutoHotKey (AHK) to control things like the brightness on HUD, DDI's and the altimeter pressure. I've had to play with it to get both a consistent response and not have it jump several steps. What it's come down to that seems to work is a "hold key" time 25 ms (I think it's ms that AHK is using as the unit). For those you need to be quick on the keypress with even normal keyboard to make it work. I wonder if a high end/gaming keyboard normally sends faster than a standard keyboard so ends up going more than one "click" on some of these shorter response dials? For things like the UFC keyboard on the other hand, it won't consistently register without going up to a 500 ms (it'll miss some keystrokes). Hopefully this might help point you in the right direction anyway.

Any idea how I can change the response time of my Keyboard? The root cause is even obvious with default keyboard commands.

It should be possible to set a course on the HSI with the default keyboard commands.

The issue is most obvious in the Course knob, but it affects the heading knob, well and other rotaries, where it isn't much of a problem (lights etc.).

 

[shagrat]

Same issue with the heading bug rotary in the UH-1H with default keybinds LSHFT+LCTRL+,/.

The TF-51D and P-51D default RCTRL+A /RALT+A keybinds same.

And P-47D RCTRL+G/RALT+G same issue, just not so obvious.

[shagrat]

Spitfire same issue with compass default binding RCTRL+C/RALT+C. Mousewheel operates smooth, button/keys jump multiple degrees.

Same with the Bf.109 (need to map keys).

And with the FW-190 A8 and D9 the same with default keybinds RALT+C/RCTRL+C.

The F-86F radio compass E/W variation, default RCTRL+RSHFT+W/E same problem.

Mirage 2000C altimeter pressure knob, default keybinds RSHFT+ =/- as well.

 

Actually so far only the AV-8B Harrier from Razbam seems to have the INS course set knob working fine with keybinds.

 

EDIT Ka-50 HSI course and heading knobs in manual mode jumps, as well.

 

 

Edited November 2, 2020 by shagrat

[shagrat]

So found the L-39C course knob default LCTRL+K /LSHFT+K works ok!

So the question would be, what is different in the implemention between L-39C and the rest?

 

Edited November 2, 2020 by shagrat

[Flappie]

Thank you, now I can see. The speed of A-10C keyboard (or other impulse button) controlled knobs is way too high.

I don't own the F-5, but I assume the speed is the same.

 

[Flappie]

The Viggen offers different speeds for some of her knobs. That's an interesting way to deal with this: everybody is happy.

 

[shagrat]

Thank you, now I can see. The speed of A-10C keyboard (or other impulse button) controlled knobs is way too high.

I don't own the F-5, but I assume the speed is the same.

 

pVRmmtUac7A

Thanks for the video... And yes similar with all modules I tested above. I assume it is most obvious on the course, heading and barometric pressure adjustment knobs.

As grabbing the mouse, keeping it on the knob and dial a precise course, heading or QNH is pretty difficult, the keyboard or buttons need to be fixed.

Setting a course or adjusting QNH is important navigational basics not a "nice to have", especially in a helicopter down low where you want your eyes outside the cockpit.

[shagrat]

The Viggen offers different speeds for some of her knobs. That's an interesting way to deal with this: everybody is happy.

 

It would be totally fine if one quick/normal press advances one value and if you hold the button for say 1.2 sec it speeds to 5 values a second.

If the value range for every rotary would be 1 to 360 (like the HSI) that should work well with course, heading, volume, light and whatever mimics an analog dial.