L-159 Albatross II

[upyr1]

 

The  L-59 Super Albatross and L-59 Albatross II are upgraded L-39s. The L-59 was developed in the1980s and the 159 was developed in the late 1990s and entered production in 2000

 

 

I don't have a photo of the 59's cockpit but here is the 159 it can carry Paveways and Mavericks,  

 

If it can be programed by modifying the L-39's code it may be a good addition for DCS 

[Fri13]

Well, I think the Russian law would again strike over that one. 

But sure, it would be a nice thing to have as extra $80 module. 

 

[rkk01]

Nice... But I’d rather have a Hawk

[upyr1]

30 minutes ago, Fri13 said:

Well, I think the Russian law would again strike over that one. 

But sure, it would be a nice thing to have as extra $80 module. 

Russian laws don't apply to the Czech republic. So it is all up to the folks in Prague to  say yes or no. Putin doesn't have a word on this 

21 minutes ago, rkk01 said:

Nice... But I’d rather have a Hawk

Why not both? Toss in the Goshhawk too. The Hawk IMHO would be a perfect replacement for the Su-25T as a free plane

[Fri13]

4 hours ago, upyr1 said:

Russian laws don't apply to the Czech republic. So it is all up to the folks in Prague to  say yes or no.

 

Good correction, that it was the Czech manufactured airplane... But, it is still in operational in Russian air force so it doesn't matter who manufacturer is when the Russian military equipment comes to under law. ED is a foreign company in a Russia, and needs to follow their laws, so if Russian military does use something, it doesn't make a case "But it is made in non-russia!".

 

4 hours ago, upyr1 said:

Putin doesn't have a word on this 

 

You can leave your personal attacks elsewhere. 

[Northstar98]

2 hours ago, Fri13 said:

 

Good correction, that it was the Czech manufactured airplane... But, it is still in operational in Russian air force so it doesn't matter who manufacturer is when the Russian military equipment comes to under law. ED is a foreign company in a Russia, and needs to follow their laws, so if Russian military does use something, it doesn't make a case "But it is made in non-russia!".

 

 

You can leave your personal attacks elsewhere. 

 

The L-59 and L-159 isn't/wasn't in service with Russian anything from what I can find, so it's basically up to the Czechs.

 

Russia instead uses the Yak-130 as their replacement for the L-39; the good thing there is that the Italians have their own version; the Alenia Aermacchi M-346.

Edited March 4, 2021 by Northstar98

[Fri13]

51 minutes ago, Northstar98 said:

 

The L-59 L-159 isn't/wasn't in service with Russian anything from what I can find, so it's basically up to the Czechs.

 

So that deals it then that Russian laws doesn't apply. 

 

51 minutes ago, Northstar98 said:

Russia instead uses the Yak-130 as their replacement for the L-39, the good thing there is the Italians have their own version the Alenia Aermacchi M-346.

 

Ah, that I didn't remember that they did indeed take the Yak-130 for their modern trainer. Did want to see it once in the DCS as it has same controls as Su-35S does IIRC?

[Northstar98]

44 minutes ago, Fri13 said:

Ah, that I didn't remember that they did indeed take the Yak-130 for their modern trainer. Did want to see it once in the DCS as it has same controls as Su-35S does IIRC?

 

Not familiar with the -130 by any means, but I would assume so.

[upyr1]

3 hours ago, Fri13 said:

 

Good correction, that it was the Czech manufactured airplane... But, it is still in operational in Russian air force so it doesn't matter who manufacturer is when the Russian military equipment comes to under law. ED is a foreign company in a Russia, and needs to follow their laws, so if Russian military does use something, it doesn't make a case "But it is made in non-russia!".

The plane was built for the Czech Air Force and the only other operator is Iraq. If you remember by brief one sentence description I state it used American Paveway bombs and AGM-65 Mavericks which are not used by the Russian military. The Russians are using the Yak-130 for their trainer. 

 

3 hours ago, Fri13 said:

 

 

You can leave your personal attacks elsewhere. 

Mind explaining why you think saying "Putin doesn't have a word on this" is a personal attack? He's the president of Russia and the commander-in-chief of the Russian military. He has the final say on what the Russian military makes public and doesn't make public.  I haven't stated any personal opinion about him or anyone else. 

1 hour ago, Fri13 said:

 

Ah, that I didn't remember that they did indeed take the Yak-130 for their modern trainer. Did want to see it once in the DCS as it has same controls as Su-35S does IIRC?

It when head to head with the MiG-AT for the contract I don't think we would be able to get either of them, since that would violate Russian law. I don't believe MiG is trying for export sales or not. Though there's a chance we might

[upyr1]

2 hours ago, Northstar98 said:

 

The L-59 and L-159 isn't/wasn't in service with Russian anything from what I can find, so it's basically up to the Czechs.

 

Russia instead uses the Yak-130 as their replacement for the L-39; the good thing there is that the Italians have their own version; the Alenia Aermacchi M-346.

 

The L-59 was developed for export the 159 was developed for home use though the Iraqis use it as well. Boeing helped with the L-159 project I am not sure about the 59. The L-159A has been used by the Iraqis against ISIS so they would be good for the Syria map. 

[Fri13]

56 minutes ago, upyr1 said:

Mind explaining why you think saying "Putin doesn't have a word on this" is a personal attack? He's the president of Russia and the commander-in-chief of the Russian military. He has the final say on what the Russian military makes public and doesn't make public. 

 

Because you made claim that Putin is the reason the law has been made, that has personally been drafting it by alone, responsible for it to get through the legal process to become finally as a law that he signs (assuming that he needs to sign all laws in the last phase to make them approved, or if not signing, the second time the president signature is not required if it goes through the legal process). 

 

It is a personal attack when You draw a president by name to be solely responsible for something without mentioning the whole duma being in the process or the source why such law exist in Russia, in USA and many many other countries. And he doesn't have the final saying, as it is the Russian laws that has the final word for everything. He can not step over the laws as wanted. 

[Fri13]

1 hour ago, Northstar98 said:

 

Not familiar with the -130 by any means, but I would assume so.

 

Quick checking and it really is that Yak-130 does have the Su-35S controls, but it has as well special flight models built in, by allowing mid-flight the pilot to switch between different flight characteristics so the aircraft can be used to fly like a Su-27, MiG-29, Mirage 2000, Typhoon, F-15, F-16, F-22 and even F-35 and can perform the flight maneuvers of those. This way the pilot gets easy training for transitioning to those aircraft gradually when the fly-by-wire system makes plane behave familiar manner. 

 

So at least in the future the Yak-130 is out of the modeling when it would be required to model so many other systems flight characteristics

But back to L-159 etc.... 

[upyr1]

2 hours ago, Fri13 said:

 

Because you made claim that Putin is the reason the law has been made, that has personally been drafting it by alone, responsible for it to get through the legal process to become finally as a law that he signs (assuming that he needs to sign all laws in the last phase to make them approved, or if not signing, the second time the president signature is not required if it goes through the legal process). 

 

It is a personal attack when You draw a president by name to be solely responsible for something without mentioning the whole duma being in the process or the source why such law exist in Russia, in USA and many many other countries. And he doesn't have the final saying, as it is the Russian laws that has the final word for everything. He can not step over the laws as wanted. 

I never claimed Putin was the reason the Law was written nor am I trying to insult him.  All I am saying is that while the Federal Assembly wrote the laws concerning the levels of classification it is up to the military to apply the labels and Vladimir Putin is the Commander-in-Chief of the Russian armed forces.  So when you read something like that from me, you should read it in the same light as a post that talks about Uncle Sam when discussing the United States or Her Majesty or John Bull when discussing the UK.  So let's get back to the L-159

Edited March 5, 2021 by upyr1

[upyr1]

2 hours ago, Fri13 said:

So at least in the future the Yak-130 is out of the modeling when it would be required to model so many other systems flight characteristics

But back to L-159 etc.... 

here are a couple of diagrams of both planes, clearly the mod has to start fresh. The L-159 is faster and carries a heavier pay load since it has 6 harpoints under the wings and a single centerline one. 

[Fri13]

7 hours ago, upyr1 said:

So when you read something like that from me, you should read it in the same light as a post that talks about Uncle Sam when discussing the United States or Her Majesty or John Bull when discussing the UK. 

 

You do not know that who goes to classify something. Majority doesn't go through the top personnel in the military but through a normal offices responsible for such tasks. There are just captains, majors and colonels (etc) that are deciding the classifications etc as their job. So simply, Putin has nothing to say about that, as the laws and procedures are there that others follow and so does he.

When you start to talk about specific people by their names, you will concentrate your comments and all the remarks directly to them. And when you start to talk politics in the discussion of other topic, you will load all the negativity and positivity to those names. Personal attack doesn't mean insult, it means that you take your argument about person itself instead the topic/subject. It doesn't matter at all who is the president in what country, or who is responsible to sign the security classification etc. It is enough to just talk about "Russia" or "Russian Federation" etc and it is more valid. And this applies to all countries. Using people by their names allows you to load the argument with opinions of the person when it doesn't matter. It can as well be easily used to make argument errors by going to authority when individual is mentioned by its status. Like there is a difference if someone say "A friend of mine said X" compared to "The General X said X" or "the Ground Crew Chief said X", as no one knows about the friend status so if someone assumes it is wrong because of that, then they are victims to authority. Only thing that matters is the information itself, like if a general says that water can be burned with a matchstick, it doesn't matter as anyone who knows science knows that water can not be lit with a matchstick. If someone is unsure about it, they can perform scientific test to try it out themselves. So does the title of the person matter if information is correct or not? No. It is just that people like to use the title or fame as authority to trust things, simple group behavior where leader is followed with same manner as younglings follow their parents. 

 

It is better leave the politics out of the discussions. 

 

7 hours ago, upyr1 said:

So let's get back to the L-159

 

Yes. Let's do that. 

[Fri13]

7 hours ago, upyr1 said:

here are a couple of diagrams of both planes, clearly the mod has to start fresh. The L-159 is faster and carries a heavier pay load since it has 6 harpoints under the wings and a single centerline one.

 

I talked about the Yak-130 that was for a while mentioned as the Russian jet trainer for military. And for it I didn't talk about the 3D model, but the overall modeling of the aircraft to the DCS World as the flight modeling is not possible to be done for it as the FBW system is so complex, that you can change the flight behavior in the real thing in-flight to emulate another aircraft flight characteristics.

 

The glass cockpit designs are problematic for the modding. There are many things that are not accessible without SDK, so if someone wants more than just the extra hardpoints and more powerful thrust from engine, then it can easily end up to be too big work or even impossible. 

 

I could see a new module made from it officially, but as far I know, the L-39 came to DCS World because ED got a contract to make a real simulator for the L-39 to civilian market. And I don't think that the L-159 is available on the civilian market? So there wouldn't then be a contract to make. It is anyways a two seater trainer that has own military purposes for training that differ from the civilian markets. Like as far I know, the L-39 is closest one can get in civilian flying to a fighter jet, why it is popular. 

 

I don't even know that can the full fidelity modules be used as base for a mod. So far thought that Flaming Cliffs aircraft is required for that. 

[upyr1]

8 minutes ago, Fri13 said:

I could see a new module made from it officially, but as far I know, the L-39 came to DCS World because ED got a contract to make a real simulator for the L-39 to civilian market. And I don't think that the L-159 is available on the civilian market? So there wouldn't then be a contract to make. It is anyways a two seater trainer that has own military purposes for training that differ from the civilian markets. Like as far I know, the L-39 is closest one can get in civilian flying to a fighter jet, why it is popular. 

Draken international operates the L-159, and I don't know what Areo and Boeing have planned. It all depends on what support Eagle can get and how much interest there is in the L-159. So instead of trying to figure out if something can be done legally we need to say if it should be done.