Gun on the Shark?

[Mugatu]

Like the KA-50 the apache is an old dog too.

 

http://www.eurocopter.com/site/FO/doc/rotor_j/37/pa-37-04-00.pdf

[deviletk]

The Tiger is sweet. Hopefully Europe's mil will order a Eurocopter module from DCS ...and then DCS release it to us. :)

 

Hey, i can dream right?! :D

[-sulan-]

Me and my wingman can track and engage two targets at once :D

[cool_t]

Like the KA-50 the apache is an old dog too.

 

http://www.eurocopter.com/site/FO/doc/rotor_j/37/pa-37-04-00.pdf

 

Hummmm.....well lets make an analogy. The human body has been the same for thousands of years but our ability too make tools and our Cognitive reasoning skills have "Upgraded" along time. Just as the KA-50 and the AH-64 might be old air frames but there internal devices "Tools" have changed.

[cool_t]

The Ka-50 is not one of 'today's helos'. It's one of your grandpa's helos.

 

That's strange we just shipped over 100 front sight housings and other goodies today for the AH-64, I think its one of "today's Helos".

 

:thumbup:

Edited September 17, 2008 by cool_t

[GGTharos]

The Ah-64D is. The Ka-50 is still one of your Grandpa's helos.

[sobek]

Why does Russia even bother to buy them then instead of spending the money on the newer and better equipped Havoc variant?

[GGTharos]

Because the Ka-50 is well suited to the sort of mountainous terrain terrorists/rebels tend to like hiding in. Its weapon systems are cheap, effective and reliable against the same.

 

It basically delivers the correct bang for the buck, or perhaps its a result of politics - or both.

[cool_t]

The Ah-64D is. The Ka-50 is still one of your Grandpa's helos.

 

I guess we must be in misunderstanding, both are state of the Art. We get updates weekly due too mission goals, weather/climate, geological factors, and new materials. Dismissal with my "Grandpa", by the way he passed at 102 years old :) is a far shot from current production and development that I see day too day. If you could explaine more about the "Grandpa" thing I will kindly listen too what it means in your eyes.

 

Sorry GG

[cool_t]

Because the Ka-50 is well suited to the sort of mountainous terrain terrorists/rebels tend to like hiding in. Its weapon systems are cheap, effective and reliable against the same.

 

It basically delivers the correct bang for the buck, or perhaps its a result of politics - or both.

 

I do not know anything or very little about where it has served in combat.

[GGTharos]

You're the one with the misunderstanding. The Ka-50 as is right now was state of the art 25 years ago.

 

 

I guess we must be in misunderstanding, both are state of the Art.

[cool_t]

You're the one with the misunderstanding. The Ka-50 as is right now was state of the art 25 years ago.

 

Ahhhh I get it now, thats why the gun can only probe to the right? What about the AH-64? Or the SR-71? As the poll states 50% think its state of the art?

Edited September 18, 2008 by cool_t

[GGTharos]

The gun is state of the art? Why that might be. The Ka-50 isn't ;)

 

I suggest you go back a few posts so you can reclaim your own train of thought and remember what we're discussing instead of pretending you're not hopping from one subject to the other ;)

 

Ahhhh I get it now, thats why the gun can only probe to the right? What about the AH-64? Or the SR-71? As the poll states 50% think its state of the art?

[swepain]

Ahhhh I get it now, thats why the gun can only probe to the right? What about the AH-64? Or the SR-71? As the poll states 50% think its state of the art?

 

We will find out in combat when the KA-50 is released. :megalol:

[-sulan-]

Ahhhh I get it now, thats why the gun can only probe to the right? ...

 

I think the reason the gun has such a limited movement is because the sight can only move 35degrees off to either side, besides a single pilot can't be expected to operate the gun like the WSO of an apache/hind anyway - Therefore they mounted it in such a way that it is more accurate and produces less drag than if it would've been turret mounted.

[Avimimus]

What does "state of the art" mean?

[swepain]

Ahhhh I get it now, thats why the gun can only probe to the right? What about the AH-64? Or the SR-71? As the poll states 50% think its state of the art?

 

that is a false statement... 57% of the voters think "It is a tecnological advantage" not state of the art! witch is a totaly diff thing:smartass:

[159th_Viper]

What does "state of the art" mean?

 

 

"The state of the art is the highest level of development, as of a device, technique, or scientific field, achieved at a particular time. It also applies to the level of development (as of a device, procedure, process, technique, or science) reached at any particular time usually as a result of modern methods."

[cool_t]

The gun is state of the art? Why that might be. The Ka-50 isn't ;)

 

I suggest you go back a few posts so you can reclaim your own train of thought and remember what we're discussing instead of pretending you're not hopping from one subject to the other ;)

 

I did go back thats why I talked about the "Gun" again. Also all of the KA-50's air frames, and all of the hundreds of parts, MFD's, ect.ect have not been up-graded too state of the art materials or tools? Hummmm...In all truth If the KA-50 has never been fitted with new state of the art equipment and some one can prove it Ill buy it.

Edited September 18, 2008 by cool_t

[cool_t]

I think the reason the gun has such a limited movement is because the sight can only move 35degrees off to either side, besides a single pilot can't be expected to operate the gun like the WSO of an apache/hind anyway - Therefore they mounted it in such a way that it is more accurate and produces less drag than if it would've been turret mounted.

 

That's nice! Hummm I never looked at it that way. Thanks for the on topic information.

 

:smilewink:

[Dvst]

I did go back thats why I talked about the "Gun" again. Also all of the KA-50's air frames, and all of the hundreds of parts, MFD's, ect.ect have not been up-graded too state of the art materials or tools? Hummmm...In all truth If the KA-50 has never been fitted with new state of the art equipment and some one can prove it Ill buy it.

 

The concept of "state of the art" is missleading.

Design always follows a purpose.

The Ka 50 and it's gun do the job they were designed for fine.

And that's all it's operators care for.

[Avimimus]

"The state of the art is the highest level of development, as of a device, technique, or scientific field, achieved at a particular time. It also applies to the level of development (as of a device, procedure, process, technique, or science) reached at any particular time usually as a result of modern methods."

 

Very interesting... now this raises a question. Can there be two "arts" and therefore two "state of the arts". I can't help but remember that the VBMP requirements (for the Hind successor) stipulated an ability for the turbines to run on diesel fuel if necessary. Perhaps, there is one "art" or design philosophy and role/requirement in the east and another in the west?

[cool_t]

The concept of "state of the art" is missleading.

Design always follows a purpose.

The Ka 50 and it's gun do the job they were designed for fine.

And that's all it's operators care for.

 

Ok,

 

Here is an example of "State of the Art" in the KA-50 gun. This statement is representational in form.

 

The Ka-50's gun was first made out of steel, then developers of the KA-50 discovered a new stronger, lighter, heat-resistant material. The developers then used the same blue-print specks and built the same gun out of this new material, making an old version new and "state of the art"

[Dvst]

The usage of a new material because of better heat resistance would mean that the original material did not fullfill the needs and therefor the design was not matched or false to begin with.

On a sidenote: Achivements in technology or materials are generaly made when a given design is infeasible or impossible without the breaking of new ground. That's why technology leaps in times of warfare - read situations of urgent need.

 

Again: The "fixed" gun is a cognitive design descision ( the thoughts behind it explained often enough by now ) and not a matter of technology developement.

Edited September 19, 2008 by Dvst

[Peyoteros]

Muahaha:megalol: