Highway to physical reality

[Mistang]

4 minutes ago, lunaticfringe said:

Normally, I'm not a fan of people putting words in my mouth, but this time, I'm going to allow it: 

You have been mathematically incorrect at every attempt in this thread, not by simple rounding or carrying error, but by orders of magnitude that a fundamental understanding would catch on even back of the napkin math.  

And like your continual mistatements, halftruths, and outright fabrications ("airplanes are disposable"), at no point in this conversation have I said a Tomcat would sustain 7Gs worth of load for in excess of a minute in this thread. 

I'm saying it now, categorically: 

A F-14 Tomcat, with the necessary altitude and entry speed, and within its lifetime expected hours and maintenance, would have zero issue sustaining 7.5 G for in excess of one minute, and Mistang- as evidenced by your own work in this thread, there isn't a single thing you are capable of providing to disprove that fact. Not mathematically- as you have repeatedly failed to do, not documentarily. The airframe and crew would absolutely survive that experience; your ego and contentions, not so much. 

You should try it sometime, bro. 

Your own source says the plane falling apart at 10g for a second. 7g is half as much kinetic energy or two seconds. Your own source implies the turn would last two seconds. Your objection is a single phrase with no context, "430 knots".

The technical documentation confirms 9g would destroy the plane immediately. It does not give a duration at different G but by the same math the 7g turn is two seconds. 

What evidence will you accept? Simply ask for one piece of evidence and I will present. You have not asked me for any specific piece of evidence. My ask is to show any pilot account or telemetry showing that it actually turned 7g for two seconds. 

[Mistang]

6 minutes ago, RustBelt said:

There’re are few things more detrimental to the human intellect than fear, chemical intoxication, or worst of all, a mediocre undergraduate engineering degree. 

I have a masters degree. Want to see it? I don't think the rules allow me to post it.

[lunaticfringe]

17 minutes ago, RustBelt said:

There’re are few things more detrimental to the human intellect than fear, chemical intoxication, or worst of all, a mediocre undergraduate engineering degree. 

Never let it be said I didn't attempt to preclude him from once again failing at math repeatedly in public.  He'd done so badly in the last thread (see the rivet and lying FAA copypasta here that made an appearance last time), which is why I'd told him straight up how to find the answer on the manual page that was later deleted- so he could attain the solution himself based on the actual math, as performed by professionals, privately. 

But here we are. 

[lunaticfringe]

27 minutes ago, Mistang said:

Your own source says the plane falling apart at 10g for a second.

And what source is that? 

 

27 minutes ago, Mistang said:

7g is half as much kinetic energy or two seconds. Your own source implies the turn would last two seconds. Your objection is a single phrase with no context, "430 knots".

Mhmmm.  Like I said- the pilot is just randomly throwing out the number that he's seeing on the HUD because he's holding a random conversation with the RIO.

 

27 minutes ago, Mistang said:

The technical documentation confirms 9g would destroy the plane immediately. It does not give a duration at different G but by the same math the 7g turn is two seconds. 

Grumman's technical documentation laughs at this premise, wholesale. 

 

27 minutes ago, Mistang said:

What evidence will you accept?

A United States Navy Aircraft Mishap Board finding excessive G loading caused a catastrophic loss of an F-14, with a metered value between 6 and 8 G. 

 

27 minutes ago, Mistang said:

Simply ask for one piece of evidence and I will present. You have not asked me for any specific piece of evidence. My ask is to show any pilot account or telemetry showing that it actually turned 7g for two seconds. 

You can literally witness an F-14 pulling over 7.5 G in the video I presented in excess of two seconds as a function of degrees turned versus speed.  You were off by more than half last time you attempted to solve the problem; try again. 

 

[Mistang]

1 minute ago, lunaticfringe said:

And what source is that? 

 

Mhmmm.  Like I said- the pilot is just randomly throwing out the number that he's seeing on the HUD because he's holding a random conversation with the RIO.

 

Grumman's technical documentation laughs at this premise, wholesale. 

 

A United States Navy Aircraft Mishap Board finding excessive G loading caused a catastrophic loss of an F-14, with a metered value between 6 and 8 G. 

 

You can literally witness an F-14 pulling over 7.5 G in the video I presented in excess of two seconds as a function of degrees turned versus speed.  You were off by more than half last time you attempted to solve the problem; try again. 

 

You mean the "430 knots mumbled" video. Which is your entire argument.

The rest of your replies are immaterial.

 

 I will look for the requested.

Edited August 30, 2022 by Mistang

[Mistang]

[quote]

A United States Navy Aircraft Mishap Board finding excessive G loading caused a catastrophic loss of an F-14, with a metered value between 6 and 8 G. [/quote]

I don't think this actually exists. Can you find any such report for any accident, besides a handful of high profile cases about pilot error?

Should I write to the library of congress and go through all the accident reports? I have no issue doing so.

[NeedzWD40]

59 minutes ago, Mistang said:

I don't really have anything at stake here, I just wanted to demonstrate basic math.

Uh... In a video game forum?

I think you might be in the wrong place. Try Math Forums instead: https://mathforums.com/

[G.J.S]

A word to the wise . . . . 
 

 

[FWind]

5 hours ago, cheezit said:

What was the deal with aircraft #98?

https://archive.org/details/DTIC_ADA193828/page/n15/mode/2up

https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/abs/10.2514/6.1981-2461

Edited August 31, 2022 by FWind

[Frosty2124]

2 hours ago, Mistang said:

I have a masters degree. Want to see it? I don't think the rules allow me to post it.

what in, i can say with some degree of certainty that i am more qualified and experienced  in this field than you are...... are more people are more experienced than me so lets not play games here....

[Mistang]

1 hour ago, Frosty2124 said:

what in, i can say with some degree of certainty that i am more qualified and experienced  in this field than you are...... are more people are more experienced than me so lets not play games here....

But he said all I have to do is find 1 accident report and the forums entire argument collapses. I doubt the archives will reply to my request as it's such a morbid thing to do but I'll try.

The claim is physically impossible by an order of magnitude so it doesn't matter, now I just need a concrete instance of G force being the sole cause of any accident.

Mods are free to close the thread. I'm satisfied with the result and will post if I ever get these reports.

Edited August 31, 2022 by Mistang

[RustBelt]

3 hours ago, Mistang said:

I have a masters degree. Want to see it? I don't think the rules allow me to post it.

Well, maybe someday you'll get that PhD and become completely disassociated with reality like most engineering PhD's with ......."opinions"

[NineLine]

Locked at OP's request.