Mirage F-1 should it fly like an drunk paralytic ?

[303_Vins]

Question is. Is Fly model and  reactions to  stick correct ?  Very ustable  on ailerons and weird behavior with pitch inputs.

[Hiob]

I sense pushback incoming. I would suggest to reframe the topic.

Regarding your question. You mean the oscillation in pitch? Well, it is so concise that I doubt the SMEs missed it. but I don't know.

[303_Vins]

Crazy pitch behavior near and not far from neutrum. Small amount of  stick pull  and plane react like crazy to hi pitch.  I think internal curve should be adjusted by developers.

Ailerons also weird.  After  input on ailerons for exaple left,  plane roll  lefft mostly endless.  Counter roll input is very difficult to adjust because plane commence roll opposite instead of  stop roll.   Mirage is very unstable  on this axe. Is it normal ?  Difficult, unstable platform. Flying brick.  Hard to understand and predict its fly model

Edited November 21, 2022 by 303_Vins

[Hodo]

Funny I am experiencing none of those things.  The lack of a fly by wire system means sudden movements on the stick can lead to very extreme reactions.  It is a little wobbly on the runway but otherwise not bad.  

[E69_DaniV]

Well I can't experience those behaviours either. Sure thing, if we stick to reality, talking with real Mirage F-1 pilots, most of them told me that "The F-1 behaves as you fly it" , meaning that if you´re krispy or violent on the controls aircraft reactios would be the same, and in the other hand if you try to fly it smoothly and well trimmed, will go smoothly.

Remember that she´s not a fly by wire... and was not easy to master, that´s why I love it.

I've added curves on my rudder axis (due I'm not smooth with my feet when pushing the rudders... for example).

Of course is my personal opinion, anyway, fixing and refinement has to be done to reach perfection on every module, but for the moment I´m happy as it is.

[MysteriousHonza]

I think ive got this problem too even when using smooth imputs on precise virpil base. I believe its due to how they did "ingame" stick and stabs. Aka, you are in max pull ingame while using half of your real life HW axis which is nuts. (check it by when stick in cockpit stops, you still have massive ammount of throw left to your real HW)

Edited November 23, 2022 by MysteriousHonza

[sedenion]

I second the OP, I find the Mirage F1 currently very hard to pilot, a little sharp maneuver turns the aircraft crazy, especially the conjunction of pitch up and roll is almost prohibited and totaly useless since uncontrolable. I still have the sensation to pilot the aircraft using raw input and without any damping mechanism...

Edited November 23, 2022 by sedenion

[sedenion]

On 11/22/2022 at 4:13 AM, Hodo said:

Funny I am experiencing none of those things.  The lack of a fly by wire system means sudden movements on the stick can lead to very extreme reactions.  It is a little wobbly on the runway but otherwise not bad.  

No FWB doesn't mean absence of flight assistance, and the Mirage F1 does have a lot of them, it is not a warbird...

[Loukuins]

14 hours ago, MysteriousHonza said:

I think ive got this problem too even when using smooth imputs on precise virpil base. I believe its due to how they did "ingame" stick and stabs. Aka, you are in max pull ingame while using half of your real life HW axis which is nuts. (check it by when stick in cockpit stops, you still have massive ammount of throw left to your real HW)

 

I second this, at the time the module was released a lot of people had this issue, I will test and check that tomorrow, my VKB stick feel way too sensitive, even compared to the F-14

[Rapierarch]

On 11/21/2022 at 4:54 PM, 303_Vins said:

Question is. Is Fly model and  reactions to  stick correct ?  Very ustable  on ailerons and weird behavior with pitch inputs.

I feel that both pitch and roll I see the stick has a dampening delay in game. 

I fly in VR so I'm quite sure about that. I move my stick and I see in game stick starts moving and keeps moving at a slover constant pace than my own joystick and comes to same state. 

If I jank my joystick, in game stick never does those abrupt moves. That's the only module where I see no 1-1 movement between joystick and in game stick. 

This behavior forces me to pull or roll further than needed do to the delay. 

[Whirley]

According to some definitions it is fly-by-wire as it has an analoge computer and a feedback loop taking air data into account and electric links to the control surface actuators on some channels. By this definition FBW is pretty old actually.

[sedenion]

After some other testing, I notice two things whichn in conjunction make the Mirage F1 currently very hard to control:

The Well known pitch sensitivity problem, which makes the aircraft to reach the max AOA very quickly with huge "elasticity" (the nose go back down once we release the stick). The pitch is so sensitive that we currently can properly fly with only the half of the joystick Y axis amplitude, we still reach max AOA.

The roll in the other hand, seem to have huge latency and inertia, making the aircraft long to make it roll and still rolls pretty long time after joystick returned to center. The result is that we have sensation to fly a nervous jumbo jet.

This is hardest module to control I have tested ever, even the Mig-29 still more controllable. I really doubt the real Mirage F1 is as hard to control as in the module.

Edited December 17, 2022 by sedenion