BaD CrC Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 Thank to the gods I´m not the only one starting with dilettantism and with a slow but steady learning curve. BaD CrC, you have definitely chosen the right avatar photo. :clap_2: I love this film and would be glad if I would find it some day on DVD... Greetings Hi docehrenhoefer. Don't know where you are, but if in Europe, you can buy like me this cult movie (for me) here for less than 6 euros: http://www.play.com/DVD/Region_1/4-/4/1941-Collector-Edition/Product.html?ob=Price&fb=0&cur=258 Beware this movie has been edited in DVD only in zone 1 (US). https://www.blacksharkden.com http://discord.gg/blacksharkden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docehrenhoefer Posted January 29, 2009 Author Share Posted January 29, 2009 Hi BaD CrC, I´m in Europe (very far south of Germany), so thanks a lot for the link! In the moment I have a Region 2-DVD but i plan to buy a DVD with hard disc recorder, so I´ll have to look for a regionfree device... So sad John Belushi died so young of age... Greetings!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongbowDriver Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Is that Engine anti-Ice running off bleed air? Usually with Eng Anti Ice on you lose about 10-20% power available so if you were at 97% torque and you kicked it on you would get into temp limiting and the engines would bleed off IOT prevent burnout. Also be aware that at very low temperatures you can get into fuel flow limiting even though your eng temp might be low. I guess the gearboxes got hot bc oil got too thick? I haven't delved into Black Shark yet, I'm just amazed at the level of detail you guys discussed from a CW ops POV. I'm impressed by the fidelity of this sim so far. Attack! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pfadfinder Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Is that Engine anti-Ice running off bleed air? Usually with Eng Anti Ice on you lose about 10-20% power available so if you were at 97% torque .... Not sure about the off bleed air but torque is the angle of attack of the rotorblades not the engine power (sure higher aoa means more power is needed but the power is enough for high torque and anti ice, btw the rpm in a helicopter engine is evry time the same an doesnt change like in a fixed wing) Lt. Jake Grafton: "Fighter pukes make movies. Bomber pilots make... HISTORY!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaOneSix Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 torque is the angle of attack of the rotorblades not the engine power Heavens no! Torque is the amount of twisting force on the drive shaft. For rotor torque it's the twisting force on the main rotor drive shaft. For the engines, it's the twisting force on the driveshaft from the engine to the main gearbox. Western aircraft tend to use torque, while Russian aircraft do not. Russian aircraft rely on pitch angles and engine pressure ratios. With regard to engine anti-ice, yes it uses bleed air from the compressor for most parts, while the dust protector fairings are heated electrically. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongbowDriver Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 (edited) Not sure about the off bleed air but torque is the angle of attack of the rotorblades not the engine power (sure higher aoa means more power is needed but the power is enough for high torque and anti ice, btw the rpm in a helicopter engine is evry time the same an doesnt change like in a fixed wing) Yeah, as an American Helicopter pilot I used the word torque to mean how much twist force on the engine driveshaft, I know some other countries use other readings to measure pwr available, but Torque is definitely a very useful way to gauge power output. Since I haven't really jumped into Black Shark I don't know how this sim does it, I was just spitballing on the scenario with just my real world knowledge of american rotorcraft. You should say that the helicopter wants the RPM to remain the same which may or may not be what you need. Trust me if you grab an armpit full of collective and ask for power you don't have or like in this scenario you're already asking for around 97% and you lose a bunch of bleed air which would otherwise be cooling the engines, you'll be asking for power beyond what that steady state RPM will let those engines give you. In the first scenario you'll droop the rotor bc even at a 100% pwr the engines won't be able to push the pitch angle you're asking for through the air and in the second scenario you will loose the ability to cool the engine so your nominal 100% pwr will be reduced. Most engines these days won't let themselves get cooked so it'll hit some temp limiter range and just bleed off on you, it doesn't care if you're 100ft AGL on the side of a mountain. Anyway, maybe next time ask for clarification about what someone else means before you dismiss them entirely. Edited February 4, 2009 by LongbowDriver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaOneSix Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Temp limiting on the TV3-117 is done by restricting fuel flow. It's a very old engine and it's showing its age in many respects, but overall it's a great engine, and there are a metric crapload of them in service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguez Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 With regard to engine anti-ice, yes it uses bleed air from the compressor for most parts, while the dust protector fairings are heated electrically. Hey A16, I believe the main rotor blades are electrically heated. Best regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguez Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 metric crapload That's the funniest statement I've read all week! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaOneSix Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Hey A16, I believe the main rotor blades are electrically heated. Best regards, Indeed they are, I was only referring to engine anti-ice. Turning on engine anti-ice turns on both bleed air heating as well as electrical heating, depending on what part of the engine you're talking about. Rotor de-ice is a separate switch altogether. (Note use of "anti-ice" and "de-ice", that was on purpose.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguez Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Yeppers, I was with you, but I wanted to check and make sure I knew how the rotor was heated, thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diveplane Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 (edited) Temp limiting on the TV3-117 is done by restricting fuel flow. It's a very old engine and it's showing its age in many respects, but overall it's a great engine, and there are a metric crapload of them in service. imo russian equipment is rugged in design, also the insane russian elements these aircraft sit out in 24/7 , many western aircraft would never be able to handle what russian aircraft go through. Edited February 5, 2009 by diveplane https://www.youtube.com/user/diveplane11 DCS Audio Modding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Sure they would be, they'd just suffer from the exact same maintenance problems. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguez Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Sure they would be, they'd just suffer from the exact same maintenance problems. Ha, touché! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaOneSix Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 By "showing its age" I really meant that it can be a pain to work on sometimes. Newer engines are practically plug and play and can be changed in an hour or two. Replacing a TV3-117 is an all day affair at best. However the fuel control is incredibly elegant in my opinion, considering when it was designed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honest989 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Your problem was different to mine, but myself and one other ran into a similar problem on the mission - ekran would report battery on accum or something similar. The reason behind it was the rotor speed was insufficient to generate AC/DC current, and we lost power and then crashed. this may also be an issue for you! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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