Will there be any afterburner gate like F-14/F-16/FA-18?

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

As question above. Thanks in advanced.

[Rainmaker]

Only a friction stop exists on the real airplane, so no. You push right through it. 

[Deano87]

14 hours ago, Rainmaker said:

Only a friction stop exists on the real airplane, so no. You push right through it. 

That may be so. But this is not really related to what happens in the real aircraft.

Several DCS modules have option of a “afterburner gate” button required to be depressed to allow AB, this is extremely useful for people playing with basic joysticks that don’t have throttle detents, or have very imprecise throttle controls. It effectively allows you to lock yourself out of AB to make sure you aren’t using it accidentally. It’s a nice quality of life option imho.

[Rainmaker]

43 minutes ago, Deano87 said:

That may be so. But this is not really related to what happens in the real aircraft.

Several DCS modules have option of a “afterburner gate” button required to be depressed to allow AB, this is extremely useful for people playing with basic joysticks that don’t have throttle detents, or have very imprecise throttle controls. It effectively allows you to lock yourself out of AB to make sure you aren’t using it accidentally. It’s a nice quality of life option imho.

Which ones?  Because a few of those I know of in DCS also have mechanical stops in the real airplane as well.  Which of those reasonings were used to create that feature is certainly debatable.  IE, the hornet actually had an option to turn it off, not on. Etc. 

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

For example:

 

[Rainmaker]

Yeah, the f-18’s thing was born out of the fact it has mechanical stops where the finger lifts have to be used. The F-15 is not that way. Whether or not people want some other type of AB inhibit is its own thing, but it would be more of a ‘special feature’ and not due to modeling the real airplane. 

[erniedaoage]

Could be a great idea for DCS overall, like in the gameplay settings you have a checkbox for somethinge like "use artificial afterburner gate with a button" and in the general settings you could bind that button across all modules with an AB. 

[ARM505]

Afternburner detents/gates/throttle travel is one area that the otherwise excellent DCS control bindings setup could be substantially improved.

At the moment, every aircraft has separate key and axis binds - that's excellent. BUT, the point on the throttle axes that enters Afterburner is hard coded. For throttles with physical AB detents, this (at the moment) relies on pure luck for them to just happen to be the same. For most of the aircraft, this is fine, but there are exceptions. The Mirage F1 for example, on release didn't line up. Later they added the option to select the percentage at which AB was activated in the 'special' menu, but others don't have this. The FC3 Mig29 for example, will light up it's AB's before you reach the same point of throttle travel.

So: What they should add, is an AB 'detent' line that can be set in the axis setup, per aircraft. Otherwise you have to resort to juggling custom mappings, which have the downside of creating non-linear throttle travel, and are a pain to adjust. The same can be said for creating custom axis ranges on your throttle software, or physically moving your detents (I have a Virpil CM3 throttle, I can loosen the screw, move the detent, and tighten, but why do this from aircraft to aircraft when a software solution per aircraft is really the answer?)

Then we can talk about button mappings to 'push through' the gate etc, but it's a separate issue.

Edited February 24, 2023 by ARM505

[Deano87]

@ARM505

I hope you realise that you can adjust when the throttle goes into burner by using the “user curve” and “slider” setting in the axis tune window. It’s a bit of a faff but I have successfully tuned the throttle axis on all modules to match up with the physical gate on my throttle. It’s far from ideal way of doing it. But it’s possible. Here is a good tutorial.

This is all a bit off topic though as anybody who has a hardware throttle gate doesn’t actually need a control binding option to disable AB.

[Scott-S6]

20 hours ago, ARM505 said:

At the moment, every aircraft has separate key and axis binds - that's excellent. BUT, the point on the throttle axes that enters Afterburner is hard coded. For throttles with physical AB detents, this (at the moment) relies on pure luck for them to just happen to be the same. 

As is so often the case, the community solves the problem. Spreadsheet to generate throttle curve to align the detent on each aircraft with your throttle's physical detent.

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3315617/

[ARM505]

On 2/24/2023 at 7:04 PM, Deano87 said:

@ARM505

I hope you realise that you can adjust when the throttle goes into burner by using the “user curve” and “slider” setting in the axis tune window. It’s a bit of a faff but I have successfully tuned the throttle axis on all modules to match up with the physical gate on my throttle. It’s far from ideal way of doing it. But it’s possible. Here is a good tutorial.

This is all a bit off topic though as anybody who has a hardware throttle gate doesn’t actually need a control binding option to disable AB.

That's exactly what I meant when I said "juggling custom mappings" (perhaps it didn't come out very clearly), but yes, I know that - as well as the spreadsheet that Scott-S6 mentioned (all very handy when the Mirage F1 came out, in fact I think it was the Mirage F1 that spurred that spreadsheet). But like you said, a bit of a faff, hence my desire to have it all done with a simple 'AB point' setting in the axis setup (Like that other software with BMS in the title - one click: idle cutoff, next click: AB, done).

[Dragon1-1]

On 2/23/2023 at 11:41 PM, Rainmaker said:

Yeah, the f-18’s thing was born out of the fact it has mechanical stops where the finger lifts have to be used. 

That's not true, the Hornet's AB detent is push-through. Only the Idle/off detent requires finger lifts, and also flight idle detent while in flight.

[Rainmaker]

57 minutes ago, Dragon1-1 said:

That's not true, the Hornet's AB detent is push-through. Only the Idle/off detent requires finger lifts, and also flight idle detent while in flight.

Did I point out a direction/specifics?  Lol. 
 

The original implementation required detent use for AB. 

One thread of many. It was then bypassed. 
 

Was 100% true. 

Edited February 26, 2023 by Rainmaker

[Dragon1-1]

5 minutes ago, Rainmaker said:

The original implementation required detent use for AB. 

I was talking about the real aircraft. It does not require finger lifts going in either direction, just additional force.

[Rainmaker]

6 minutes ago, Dragon1-1 said:

I was talking about the real aircraft. It does not require finger lifts going in either direction, just additional force.

Again, never pointed to specifics of the real airplane, just that detents are used. Again, all how the DCS implementation was born.  The force part was not modeled, the lack of and using the detents were. 

[Xupicor]

Seems like you're trying to be awfully slippery there, Rainmaker...

 

Anyway, regardless of the real F-15 throttle behavior - it would be a nice quality of life option for those who need it.

[Voyager]

On 2/26/2023 at 4:56 PM, Xupicor said:

Seems like you're trying to be awfully slippery there, Rainmaker...

 

Anyway, regardless of the real F-15 throttle behavior - it would be a nice quality of life option for those who need it.

I'd agree. Regardless of the debate on how exactly the real F-15 implements its throttle, as far as I know of, no modern fighter has a throttle that allows intermittent accidental afterburner activation. 

Having options to gate AB ignition in sim so someone with a fuzzy potentiometer isn't having to run a 95% mil power just to avoid accidental AB ignition seems like a reasonable accomodation. 

[Deano87]

Yep. It’s a quality of life thing rather than anything to do with realism. 

[splash]

There is some feature coming... Have a look at your hotas lua's.