New i9-13900K & RTX 4090 PC and suffering stuttering on all settings so far?

[minimi66]

Hey folks,

After a wait of over 5 years I've just invested in a brand new pre-built gaming rig, see specs below. Cost the best part of £3500+  Also picked up a Quest Pro having previously had Quest 2, HP Reverb G1, Rift S and Rift CV1.

So far i've been completely unable to achieve anything close to the performance and quality i expected from this new PC and the Quest Pro?  Don't get me wrong, the QP is a massive step up from the Q2 and as a headset upgrade i couldn't be happier. 

I have tried pretty much every possible solution and combination of settings but the main issue i am seeing is constant stuttering in game.  Frame rate is always pretty stable at whatever i've set it at, 72, 90 etc.

Tried with and without Virtual Desktop, tried Open XR via the shortcut provided by BIGNEWY recently on the dedicated OpenXR compatibility thread. 

I also have DCS Steam version and all the above applies to that too, in fact performance/quality is much worse on Steam version although i am not at all familiar with optimising SteamVR having mostly used Oculus app for most titles i've run.

In terms of in game settings i've tried all the standard DCS pre-sets and dozens of my own variations.  I've also tried enabling/disabling Windows Game Mode, HAGS, Hyper-Threading, Windows Power service in msconfig etc etc etc....

Using Windows High Performance Power Plan.

Still a complete stutter fest 99% of the time.

With this rig DCS non-VR will run at 150-200 FPS (more on the Multi-thread build) with everything maxed out even in a busy SP mission.  I don't do MP so no idea how that would go?  

I purchased the new rig and Quest Pro specifically to enjoy better DCS VR.

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Oh and i get stuttering sound in DCS as well a lot of the time?

Thanks. 

Windows 10 Pro 64-bit

- Intel Core i9-13900K

- 64GB Corsair Vengeance RAM @ 3600 MHz

- ASUS TUF GAMING B660-PLUS WIFI D4

- Zotac NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4090 24GB (using Fasgear USB-C to USB-C Link cable from USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 Type C (up to 20Gbps) port on motherboard)

- 2TB  INTEL NVMe SSD (Windows 10)

- Samsung SSD 970 EVO Plus 1TB (DCS)

- Crucial CT1000 1TB NVMe SSD

- WinWing F-16EX Stick

- WinWing Orion Throttle Base with both F-18 & F-16C TQS Throttle Grips

- Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals

- Logitech G-910 Keyboard

- Logitech G-502 Lightspeed Mouse

- Logitech G-533 Headset

- Occulus Quest Pro VR

- TrackIR 5 with Track Clip Pro

Edited April 14, 2023 by minimi66

[Mr_sukebe]

Regardless of how much you’ve spent, you’re still going to need to compromise on some of the visual settings whilst in VR.

 

First thing is to try to get a handle on what resources are maxed out and resulting I stutters.

Run up DCS, open either task manager or MSI Afterburner to see if it’s your memory, GPU or CPU that’s flattened.

Chances are that if you’re running MT and OpenXR that it’ll be you GPU, even though you have a 4090.

Have a scan at some of the forum recommendations, but things to try include:

- shadows flat/off

- terrain textures low

- MSAA x2 

 

 

[DirtyMike0330]

Even with that system, you need motion reprojection to have a completely smooth experience in VR. I also have the QP and rock a 4090/7950x3D.

You can bump all settings to high/ultra, MSAAx2 included, and just lock ASW to 45 via Oculus Tray Tool or ODT. You do not have to lower shadows or terrain textures, so you can ignore that last response to your post.

Some people can magically stomach various FPS under 90, but I can't enjoy all the stuttering involved with anything other than 90 or 45. 

 

I basically just followed these settings:

 

 

DCS will still look as good as it can with a currently <profanity>ty rendering engine, and you will have actual smooth gameplay in any situation. 

 

Also, I don't use virtual desktop. I use the official Quest Link USB-C cable, plugged into a powered USB-C hub Minisopuru Powered USB C Hub, 10Gbps USB-C Hub 4 Ports Support Data & Smart Charging(Not Support Video), USB C to USB C Hub Multiport Adapter for MacBook Pro/Air, iMac, iPad, Phone, Chromebook, etc. - https://www.amazon.com/ that pumps out more than enough amps to keep the QP charged indefinitely during gameplay. The Kuject cable that everyone suggested to use did not work well for me. 

[minimi66]

@Mr_sukebe

Thanks.

Fully understand the relationship or lack off between cost of hardware and potential results in DCS.  I've owned DCS and all its predecessors since it was Su-27 Flanker by SSI Studio's circa 1993.

That said.

Thanks v much for your reply.  I'll run a few tests and post. 

Edited April 14, 2023 by minimi66

[minimi66]

10 hours ago, DirtyMike0330 said:

Even with that system, you need motion reprojection to have a completely smooth experience in VR. I also have the QP and rock a 4090/7950x3D.

You can bump all settings to high/ultra, MSAAx2 included, and just lock ASW to 45 via Oculus Tray Tool or ODT. You do not have to lower shadows or terrain textures, so you can ignore that last response to your post.

Some people can magically stomach various FPS under 90, but I can't enjoy all the stuttering involved with anything other than 90 or 45. 

 

I basically just followed these settings:

 

 

DCS will still look as good as it can with a currently <profanity>ty rendering engine, and you will have actual smooth gameplay in any situation. 

 

Also, I don't use virtual desktop. I use the official Quest Link USB-C cable, plugged into a powered USB-C hub Minisopuru Powered USB C Hub, 10Gbps USB-C Hub 4 Ports Support Data & Smart Charging(Not Support Video), USB C to USB C Hub Multiport Adapter for MacBook Pro/Air, iMac, iPad, Phone, Chromebook, etc. - https://www.amazon.com/ that pumps out more than enough amps to keep the QP charged indefinitely during gameplay. The Kuject cable that everyone suggested to use did not work well for me. 

Hi, and thanks v much for your advice.  Sadly, i had already read that previous post by Tenpox.  I followed his settings to the letter other than your advice to enable ASW to 45 Forced in OTT.  Just to be sure i just tried your settings with the 45 Forced option but no real improvement.  The frame rate is stable when straight and level but as soon as i manoeuvre much it goes crazy and there is micro-pauses and stutters when looking even slightly off centre in cockpit view.  It gets worse as the speed or manoeuvre become more violent.  Nothing wrong with the image quality, its really great.  As long as i'm stationary in mid air!! Lol!! 

I've not been using Virtual Desktop since reading BIGNEWY's post ref DCS native OpenXR compatibility.  Bizarrely though on my old PC DCS worked pretty well in VR using VD?

I have to say that most of the time when using OTT/ODT i feel like the changes in settings have zero effect in-game?  They seldom seem to do what they seem supposed to?

I have ordered the Powered USB-C Hub you suggested, will be here tomorrow.  I also have a better Link Cable in-bound early next week from VRCover.  Maybe those additions will fix the stuttering?  Hope so as i really feel like i've tried pretty much everything else.  It's been 10 days so far since installing DCS on the new rig.

Thanks v much indeed for your advice, it is very much appreciated.

Edited April 14, 2023 by minimi66

[minimi66]

You Tube video link inbound.

[Nick_17]

Do you fly VR in the multithreaded version? i currently get a lot of stuttering in vr when using mt, the st version runs a lot smoother, with less fps overall though.

[DirtyMike0330]

55 minutes ago, minimi66 said:

Hi, and thanks v much for your advice.  Sadly, i had already read that previous post by Tenpox.  I followed his settings to the letter other than your advice to enable ASW to 45 Forced in OTT.  Just to be sure i just tried your settings with the 45 Forced option but no real improvement.  The frame rate is stable when straight and level but as soon as i manoeuvre much it goes crazy and there is micro-pauses and stutters when looking even slightly off centre in cockpit view.  It gets worse as the speed or manoeuvre become more violent.  Nothing wrong with the image quality, its really great.  As long as i'm stationary in mid air!! Lol!! 

I've not been using Virtual Desktop since reading BIGNEWY's post ref DCS native OpenXR compatibility.  Bizarrely though on my old PC DCS worked pretty well in VR using VD?

I have to say that most of the time when using OTT/ODT i feel like the changes in settings have zero effect in-game?  They seldom seem to do what they seem supposed to?

I have ordered the Powered USB-C Hub you suggested, will be here tomorrow.  I also have a better Link Cable in-bound early next week from VRCover.  Maybe those additions will fix the stuttering?  Hope so as i really feel like i've tried pretty much everything else.  It's been 10 days so far since installing DCS on the new rig.

Thanks v much indeed for your advice, it is very much appreciated.

 

When you selected 45 in OTT, did it actually lock your in-game FPS to 45? Because from that screenshot it looks like you are still running unlocked frames, which is why you're getting stuttering. Anywhere under 90 fps is going to have stuttering in VR. 

[Glide]

Try my settings here:

Basically, 50% OpenXR custom resolution, no Motion Reprojection, no NCP settings, no OpenXR Toolkit settings, and the game settings I have posted in that link.  They may not be the best looking settings, but you will know if you can achieve 90fps with perfectly smooth ground motion.  They look just fine to me.

Edited April 14, 2023 by Glide

[DirtyMike0330]

18 minutes ago, Glide said:

Try my settings here:

Basically, 50% OpenXR custom resolution, no Motion Reprojection, no NCP settings, no OpenXR Toolkit settings, and the game settings I have posted in that link.  They may not be the best looking settings, but you will know if you can achieve 90fps with perfectly smooth ground motion.  They look just fine to me.

 

That thread is a snake-oil filled mess and mostly you responding to yourself. With the OPs hardware, they don’t need to do all this drastic dropping of settings. Motion reprojection with settings maxed is the solution here. 

[minimi66]

Edited April 14, 2023 by minimi66

[minimi66]

So how do i enable Motion Reprojection if i haven't already?  Excuse my ignorance on some of the terminology!  I assume thats a different thing from ASW?

Thanks again for your help.

[dburne]

1 minute ago, minimi66 said:

So how do i enable Motion Reprojection if i haven't already?  Excuse my ignorance on some of the terminology!  I assume thats a different thing from ASW?

Thanks again for your help.

ASW = Oculus Motion Reprojection. If you haved Oculus headset that is way to go.

Edited April 14, 2023 by dburne

[minimi66]

8 hours ago, dburne said:

ASW = Oculus Motion Reprojection. If you haved Oculus headset that is way to go.

 

Yeah so as in the image i posted above showing OTT settings i have ASW set as 45 as per earlier poster's advice?  Didn't make any difference unfortunately?

 

[dburne]

Are you saying that video you just posted above shows a lot of stuttering that you are having?

[minimi66]

8 hours ago, dburne said:

Are you saying that video you just posted above shows a lot of stuttering that you are having?

I was hoping it would show it but it doesn't.  I think you'd have to be sat where i am unfortunately.  Trust me, its there and its a deal-breaker for me VR-wise.  Very disappointed in thisafter the investment made. FFS!

[dburne]

4 minutes ago, minimi66 said:

I was hoping it would show it but it doesn't.  I think you'd have to be sat where i am unfortunately.  Trust me, its there and its a deal-breaker for me VR-wise.  Very disappointed in thisafter the investment made. FFS!

 

Ok cause I was going to say that looked pretty dang smooth to me. Probably a clue in there being that it did not show on video. Other Oculus users hopefully can help you, I have not run their headsets in a while now. Undoubtedly it is in the settings somewhere, likely in compression settings for the Quest PC-VR link.

Edit: You might also try the Quest Discord probably not too many Quest Pro users on these forums yet.

Edited April 14, 2023 by dburne

[minimi66]

8 hours ago, dburne said:

 

Ok cause I was going to say that looked pretty dang smooth to me. Probably a clue in there being that it did not show on video. Other Oculus users hopefully can help you, I have not run their headsets in a while now. Undoubtedly it is in the settings somewhere, likely in compression settings for the Quest PC-VR link.

Edit: You might also try the Quest Discord probably not too many Quest Pro users on these forums yet.

 

Thanks man, i'll do that.  Appreciate all your assistance and time along with all others above.

[Glide]

1 hour ago, DirtyMike0330 said:

That thread is a snake-oil filled mess and mostly you responding to yourself.

And thanks to your trolling, the OP won't even try them.  So, I guess we'll never know.

[minimi66]

8 hours ago, Glide said:

And thanks to your trolling, the OP won't even try them.  So, I guess we'll never know.

Hey trust me mate i will try ANYTHING!!  Please can you fully explain your experience with OpenXR including the tool kit etc?  I only downloaded them yesterday but have no clue what i'm doing with them.  Don't even know what most of the settings do etc?  Thanks.

[DirtyMike0330]

19 minutes ago, Glide said:

And thanks to your trolling, the OP won't even try them.  So, I guess we'll never know.

That wasn't trolling, that was me telling you that, in my opinion, your thread is nonsense. Especially considering the OP's hardware (which clearly you did not, to suggest that they drop their render by 50% in any solution). 

[dburne]

11 minutes ago, minimi66 said:

Hey trust me mate i will try ANYTHING!!  Please can you fully explain your experience with OpenXR including the tool kit etc?  I only downloaded them yesterday but have no clue what i'm doing with them.  Don't even know what most of the settings do etc?  Thanks.

 

A word  of caution - don't get too enamored with Open XR and using the Open XR Toolkit. DCS has native Oculus support, suggest you begin with that rather than adding more compexities  to the equation as you get started. Then later on down the road as you gain experience  you can start to play with other runtimes should you wish. I personally always felt the Oculus runtime was very good.

Edited April 14, 2023 by dburne

[Glide]

19 minutes ago, minimi66 said:

Please can you fully explain your experience with OpenXR including the tool kit etc

I assume you have DCS set up to launch with OpenXR using the shortcut parameters.  I have my G2 set up for maximum quality, and see below for WMR settings.  OpenXR Toolkit should be at defaults for this exercise, but you can use the excellent FPS counter on Advanced.  Your NCP settings for DCS should be restored to defaults.    As for the Quest Pro, try to match my setup if you can.  The resolution is already lower than my G2 at 50%.  Set your game settings just like the screenshot, and hop into the TF51D on the Caucasus map.  Report results.

 

Edited April 14, 2023 by Glide

[DirtyMike0330]

5 minutes ago, Glide said:

I assume you have DCS set up to launch with OpenXR using the shortcut parameters.  I have my G2 set up for maximum quality, and see below for WMR settings.  OpenXR Toolkit should be at defaults for this exercise, but you can use the excellent FPS counter on Advanced.  Your NCP settings for DCS should be restored to defaults.    As for the Quest Pro, try to match my setup if you can.  The resolution is already lower than my G2 at 50%.  Set your game settings just like the screenshot, and hop into the TF51D on the Caucasus map.  Report results.

 

 

Again, this is terrible advice. OP doesn't need to do this with a Quest Pro, as @dburne also mentioned, due to Oculus native support. You're sharing WMR settings that don't even apply to them. OP also has superior hardware and doesn't need to render anything at 50%. Your suggestions are worthless in this scenario. 

[Glide]

1 minute ago, DirtyMike0330 said:

Your suggestions are worthless

Whatever.  Try just the game settings then. Vis Range = Low, Terrain shadows off, AA off, AF off.